Just Heard on the Birmigham News

[Roamer]

that Beth will be on Oprah today if any of you want to catch it.

[Grande]

that Beth will be on Oprah today if any of you want to catch it.

Thanks Roamer!

[Roamer]

You're welcome. It isn't listed in the guide as the show that will be on, but it was on our noon news, and I thought some of the case followers would want to know.

[Luke Davis]

Oprah (http://www.momlogic.com/2008/01/todays_oprah_a_mothers_nightma.php)

A very emotional show with nothing new. They do mention Joran throwing a glass of wine. And they promote Loving Natalee. Matt replies to one question.

[Luke Davis]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNKvGbTPAts

[Luke Davis]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3FG0CmHnxA

[Luke Davis]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25-LfFkzgas

[Luke Davis]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdf28nxMtC4

[Luke Davis]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NbaRp0d_dk

[sanneke]

Luke, who are these people?

[Luke Davis]

Luke, who are these people?I don't know anything more than what is on the recording. There is some news in Aruba but not in English.

[Details]

Reading elsewhere - I've heard they've been involved in the case for a long time, and claim to have tape recordings showing NH was most likely a runaway, that she had never planned to return to Alabama. So far, it's all very up in the air - are the tapes real, do they actually exist, do they say what they're being claimed to say, is there any other indication that this is what actually happened to Natalee (a girl planning to run away can still be kidnapped and murdered), can any of this story be backed up with a fact?

One interesting bit though, that slightly backs their story up (IIRC, they claim abuse from stepfather) - while Beth and Matt gave the Aruba LE DNA samples to help test against mystery DNA found on a toothbrush, and for whatever other purposes might help - Jug refused. Kinda weird.

[sanneke]

I don't know anything more than what is on the recording. There is some news in Aruba but not in English.



Thanks Luke.

I think some people are going to start to talk, now that all the charges have been dropped against Joran and the 2 brothers.

We'll see what will develop next.

[Luke Davis]

http://www.amigoe.com/english/

Amigoe (http://www.amigoe.com/english/)

[QUOTE]ORANJESTAD

ORANJESTAD

ORANJESTAD

[Details]

This is an interesting quote from that website:Dompig received so many information at that time that he saw no reason to further investigate Castillo and Young’s findings. Looking back now he says that he regrets that ‘the two have made their entry in a wrong manner’. “The story about sexual abuse explains in any case Jug’s conduct. He was very aggressive and threatened me and other police officers.”

[Luke Davis]

http://video.google.nl/videoplay?docid=6192575384273936337&q=natalee+holloway&total=391&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=7

video

[Roamer]

Oh, my goodness. :shock:

I haven't been keeping up with this case, even though I live about 55 mi or so from B'ham, so this is only my opinion, but this sounds very believable.

To you who are totally in the loop, is this for real?

[Details]

It's as for real as it sounds - they've been involved in the case a long time. Dompig has said he dismissed them, but kinda wishes he hadn't, and that the info might explain Jug's very hostile behavior towards the police.

But they're also possibly flakes, and I don't know that they've released any of the tapes they supposedly have of a MB student talking about Natalee's fear of Jug.

[Roamer]

As closely as Bham covered this case, and I don't watch every news station, I've never even heard a hint of abuse. Not that there weren't stories, but if there were, they were seldom talked about on her hometown news stations.

[Details]

IMO - in the atmosphere of the time, you'd be just destroyed in the media, as bashing the poor dead girl's family, had anyone dared mention it. Aruba was the villain, and we had to stand together against them! was, IMHO, the mood of the time.

Beth's told a lot of lies, and the news stations reported those without a protest or correction either. From the original report that Natalee was a nondrinking virgin, to the claims that there was a confession to gang rape, and so on and so forth.

[Roamer]

Thank you, Details.

[Details]

No problem. I've got some strong opinions on this one - sorry if I'm too vocal here...



JMO - but after seeing those 3 boys locked up for so long, and not cracking, then the tape recording where they obviously think they are alone and unobserved in the car - to me, that was it - those guys didn't do it. And something has always stunk a bit about the whole story from Beth - the behavior just doesn't feel like any other missing persons mom I've ever seen - and I read about a lot of these cases.

This one just bugs me. And the boycott, and the vindictiveness I've seen some exhibit to Aruba, when Arubans did so much to try to find Natalee, to find out what happened, to even lock up the 3 boys for months without charges or evidence - that bugs me too.

[Roamer]

After reading so many good links and details (pardon the pun) here, I'm beginning to question my prior opinion in this case.

These things would explain why prosecutors dropped all charges and closed the case.

[Details]

The media has been selling one story on this case, because it makes for a great story that people read, better views, better ad sales - nice, beautiful, innocent, blonde girl goes missing, dedicated mother searches, horrible foreigners protect one of their own, who is obviously guilty! - and IMHO, omitting everything that doesn't fit into that storyline. That story gets the views to make money, the little gray areas and questions - not as compelling.

Have you heard about the Dr. Phil tape distortions? Changing "No, she didn't" into "She did" - creating a confession that doesn't actually exist, but everyone who saw the show, and hasn't closely followed the case, believes exists.

[sweetcharlotte]

I lived in B'ham for 30 years but never got interested in this case because of a sense of unease that I felt about Beth from early on......

[Luke Davis]

I lived in B'ham for 30 years but never got interested in this case because of a sense of unease that I felt about Beth from early on......Reportedly Beth now lives in Hoover. Do you know what that area is like?

[sweetcharlotte]

Reportedly Beth now lives in Hoover. Do you know what that area is like?

Hoover is a nice part of town, but doesn't have the "social" status of Mt. Brooke or some of the newer areas, i.e., Greystone. Hoover developed back in the late 60s/early 70s and is (I guess) what you would call 'middle' middle class (lol). Think Sandy Springs/Atlanta.

[Luke Davis]

Hoover is a nice part of town, but doesn't have the "social" status of Mt. Brooke or some of the newer areas, i.e., Greystone. Hoover developed back in the late 60s/early 70s and is (I guess) what you would call 'middle' middle class (lol). Think Sandy Springs/Atlanta.Thank you for the reply. It is interesting to get your personal view.

[2Hope4]

Oh WOW! I wanna know about these two people that gave the info. What were their names so I can google them. They truly sound convincing!

[2Hope4]

Dan Young & Kelly Castillo revealing important information

Ok that's who they are. Still interesting, and I'm going to listen and read more.

What's everyone else's opinion?

Flakes? OR worth looking into?

[PatC]

As much as I believe that paranormal experiences can be "real" I have to admit that if these two people were NOT "mediums" but rather just two friends of Beth's who had been involved in the search I would have no problem whatsoever believing what they say. I have said repeatedly to my husband that "Something is rotten in the state of Denmark" in this case. I could never bring myself to warm up to Beth and I've always thought she inserted herself into the investigation far more than was normal or reasonable.

If I'm proved wrong, I'll apologize, but I don't buy Beth's act. I didn't before the Dan & Kelly Act and I still don't.

[Swampwater]

Oh my, I really haven't followed this case except what I've been fed from the media but after listening to that video I wonder why the major networks haven't jumped on this? It shouldn't be difficult to confirm whatever evidence they have. I can't believe they would state on record that Jug sexually abused and impregnated Natalee without having backup. :0009:

IMO

[Details]

Dan Young & Kelly Castillo revealing important information

Ok that's who they are. Still interesting, and I'm going to listen and read more.

What's everyone else's opinion?

Flakes? OR worth looking into?Both. No little bit flakes, but the people they have quoted should be asked what is true and the allegation about the airplane landing many hours earlier than stated should be incredibly easy to verify or debunk.

They were there, with Beth, and their impressions of what she did and did not do, are relevant - if true. Their other statements hopefully can be checked to see if they are generally telling the truth or not.

Beth, and what she says has always seemed a lot off. The concern about reputation, the excessive hostility, the entitlement of not ever thinking of others - it all just does not feel right.

[hmm]

Dan Young & Kelly Castillo revealing important information

Ok that's who they are. Still interesting, and I'm going to listen and read more.

What's everyone else's opinion?

Flakes? OR worth looking into?

They sure don't sound like flakes. They give accurate names ect.Would explain somethings about Beth that I had wondered about.Would like to hear the rest and what Beth has to say and what proof she has about any of this.Maybe Nats father should be looking to his ex for more info.JMO:z0tdntknw::z0tdntknw:

[twinkiesmom]

I can't believe anyone would leave this crime at anyone's doorstep other than Joran and the two Kalpoes.

As far as Beth, you don't like her because she's socially pretentious and doesn't wilt like a magnolia bush. I cringed when I saw her in Natalee's bedroom holding up the sorority rush dresses...not my cup of tea, but it doesn't make her less a victim...She's real, and she is who she is.

But because she doesn't act like a victim typically acts (slinks off in silence and tears) doesn't mean the stepfather did anything to Natalee. That's just demented...She was going off to college on a scholarship. If she didn't like her stepfather, she could always holiday with Dave.