After the Verdict

[kellabeck]

:mornincoffee:

Oh, what a beautiful morning! Oh, what a beautiful day! GOOD MORNING, peeps!! It's snowing here in the city, but who cares?

I woke up and I thought--- Today's the first day of the rest of your rotten life, Mark Jensen!

I also thought about that wonderful jury. They reached the same conclusion I did, albeit through a different route. And there is no one, not even Jami Floyd, to say that they rushed to judgment. Or that their minds were unfairly inflamed by the salacious material, the sewage they had to wade through!

I predict: InSession will be all Verdict, all day. Jean will still be in Elkhorn. They will show clips: the verdict, the jurors, Jambois, brothers. And live: the Wojts, the brothers, Jammy? One last day to finish out the week. So satisfying! And then I will be able to let it go. Although we still have the sentencing to look forward to: Mark in shackles, bracelets and jumpsuit and sentenced to life in a place where everyone possesses his favorite object. Poetic!

He really is among the worst of the very worst, the picture of evil next door disguised as a suburban neighbor with a heart as dark as soot.

I feel confident that the jurors will wake up this morning, smiling, knowing that they did their duty and rendered a just verdict that they can live with. The best news is that Mark has to, too.

[RayStar]

:mornincoffee:Just reading some from yesterday and I find most great posts. I am so glad it's over as you (Kellabeck) say real life goes on.
#1 post is GREAT!!!:)
JUSTICE FOR JULIE:1222423:

[kellabeck]

Further thoughts on the genius of the jury system and the course of deliberations when there are twelve fair and open-minded citizens on board.

Only five jurors were convinced of Mark Jensen's guilt at the start of deliberations. Only five. Less than half! With the sureness I had in my heart and mind, I am astonished by that number. With the enormous amount of incriminating facts, I, having had weeks to discuss it here, was with the five. And part of me doesn't understand why it wasn't obvious to the seven.

The biggest surprise is that they were not convinced BARD that she was suffocated. With the position of her body, the condition of her nose and the injuries she sustained, I thought it was patent. But as we suspected, they threw Aaron Dillard's testimony out, and were left with what even the defense could not deny: she had ingested antifreeze.

So then it came down to: who gave it to her? Mark or herself? Ultimately Mark did himself in. His actions and words. His little Post It note of weird and ominous items which alarmed Julie and she memorialized in a photograph before it was poofed. That and his other behaviors caused her to suspect him. Caused her to write the letter. And that, side by side with the letter was his undoing.

The genius of the deliberation process is that the seven came around to the abiding conviction held by the five. And that change of heart was arrived at through the evidence. Not passion. Not prejudice.

Did any of those people last evening seem to hate Mark because he's a weird little perv with a size obsession? No. Not at all.

They just came to see that the facts revealed Mark Jensen's evil deeds: he planned it. (internet research) He pushed her (got her to go to the doctor and get the meds to cover his deed). He dosed her (Dec. 1-2) and he left her to die.

They could not get away from one of the starkest facts: he never called an ambulance. The irony is that had he, she would have died anyway and he would have looked at lot less suspicious. But he had a plan!

I thought the suffocation was his undoing. The crystals were.

[bigkitty]

Good morning Everybody!:0012:

Finally, Justice for Julie! The jury was amazing. I listened to the presser last night and I was so impressed that they went into deliberations with such open minds.

That the jury was split amazed me. The way they took the evidence apart and put it back to come to the right verdict was awesome. The one juror who wasn't convinced caught a fact that I don't think anyone else brought up, or if they did I missed it. The antifreeze being used to close the pool up. The search being done in November. Putting Julie's letter next to Mark's list was also something that nobody else mentioned that I recall. The razor blades maybe being used to slit wrists.

I just think that the people on that jury represent the best part of the justice system. Ordinary people presented with an extraordinary case and rising to the challenge.

FOR THE JURY ....:1222423::1222423::1222423:

[chambord]

Good Morning Guys and Dolls

I have a question that kept me awake last night. Will there be a custody fight between Kelley and then Jensen family as to where the two boys will live? I don't think Kelley adopted them, did she? And would Mark have a say in their placement?

[cavimom]

Well Good Morning everyone...:mornincoffee:. I am very happy today! I woke up this morning thinking about what the jurors said about coming to the verdict... One of them LQQKed at the clock and it was 4:30.. the time JJ was found dead.. gives me goose bumps...

So where is everyone gonna be today? What boards? I'm gonna miss you guys IF we dont start watching a new trial! :girl_sad:

[dojewo]

Good Morning Guys and Dolls

I have a question that kept me awake last night. Will there be a custody fight between Kelley and then Jensen family as to where the two boys will live? I don't think Kelley adopted them, did she? And would Mark have a say in their placement?
I do see Mark's parents jumping in with the custody battle but I sure do hope that Julies brothers fight for visitation rights. I know that grandparents have rights to visitation here in Wisconsin but I'm not to sure about further down the line.

BTW, Good morning all

[cavimom]

Good Morning Guys and Dolls

I have a question that kept me awake last night. Will there be a custody fight between Kelley and then Jensen family as to where the two boys will live? I don't think Kelley adopted them, did she? And would Mark have a say in their placement?


Good Question! I'm sure KJ isnt goinng to want to PAY for HIS kids anymore since he's NOT going to be able to support them. MAybe the oldest will take custody of the youngest??`

[TigressPen]

Good Morning Guys and Dolls

I have a question that kept me awake last night. Will there be a custody fight between Kelley and then Jensen family as to where the two boys will live? I don't think Kelley adopted them, did she? And would Mark have a say in their placement?



I hope it is. By law, they can go after Kelly for perjury. I doubt if she divorces Mark that she will be able to keep Douglas. But, Mark can sign over custody to his parents too. He has legal custody since Julie isn't living. I think Julie's brothers would love to raise him and know since they have mentioned it that they would love to have communications with them.

I hope David has gone to mysisterjulie site and read. He has to know about it since this trial began. It has been talked about on boards and on TV.
Hopefully one of his friends told him of it.

But I have a feeling those boys are so brainwashed that their Mom really did committ suicide that it will be a long time before they come to terms with all of these trial events and realize truths.

[dojewo]

Well Good Morning everyone...:mornincoffee:. I am very happy today! I woke up this morning thinking about what the jurors said about coming to the verdict... One of them LQQKed at the clock and it was 4:30.. the time JJ was found dead.. gives me goose bumps...

So where is everyone gonna be today? What boards? I'm gonna miss you guys IF we dont start watching a new trial! :girl_sad:
I know there is a new trial out of Colorado started on the boards. I"m going to mosey over there in a bit but I really need to get some real life stuff done today.

[Try2Win]

Did the jury believe Julie was sufficated? NO
Did the jury believe any of the snitches? NO
Did the jury really understand depression? NO

They said they did not agree on the depth of Julies depression. :1187603408.CR.Mothe

[dojewo]

I hope it is. By law, they can go after Kelly for perjury. I doubt if she divorces Mark that she will be able to keep Douglas. But, Mark can sign over custody to his parents too. He has legal custody since Julie isn't living. I think Julie's brothers would love to raise him and know since they have mentioned it that they would love to have communications with them.

I hope David has gone to mysisterjulie site and read. He has to know about it since this trial began. It has been talked about on boards and on TV.
Hopefully one of his friends told him of it.

But I have a feeling those boys are so brainwashed that their Mom really did committ suicide that it will be a long time before they come to terms with all of these trial events and realize truths.I also hope the boys get to see the mysisterJulie site, I feel so badly for them. They need to know that there are other family members out there that love them. I'm sure they have been told for years that their mothers family is no good. Who knows if the boys will even want to meet them. The children are always the ones that have to suffer.:1222423:

[kellabeck]

Today is all coming down from the Jensen trial. Enjoying the aftermath. Watching the coverage of the verdict. Can't see that video of him in shackles and cuffs and the smirk wiped off his miserable evil puss enough. I want to hear the THs saying they knew all along! I want to hear the praises of this jury sung. Bring it on! Let me wallow in it today.

The timing is so perfect. Yes, we fretted over the wait. But the jurors themselves noticed that they came to a decision at 4:30 on a Thursday just as Mark "found" her body at 4:30 on a Thursday. Eerie.

A verdict on a Thursday means IS can devote their entire palty "court day" to Jean's wrap ups, interviews with jurors and the Wojts and Susan K. and whoever else they snag and we can transition to Real Life or another trial.

I am choosing Real Life. But I know we will meet again after today. I'll be back soon for the sentencing.

[tbrito1]

oh what a beautiful morning, oh what a beautiful day, ............I forgot the rest of the song....good morning all my wonderful posters...just got into work and drove 1 hour to get here,,,,expecting 10 inches of snow today.....UGH!!!!! so are we going to have a thread for the new trial????

[StoneFox]

Well Good Morning everyone...:mornincoffee:. I am very happy today! I woke up this morning thinking about what the jurors said about coming to the verdict... One of them LQQKed at the clock and it was 4:30.. the time JJ was found dead.. gives me goose bumps...

So where is everyone gonna be today? What boards? I'm gonna miss you guys IF we dont start watching a new trial! :girl_sad:

Some of us will be on the Shawna Nelson forum following live coverage of that trial in Colorado. Harlett posted some great background information and we have a thread opened to post about the live testimony.

ETA: jeepers~the message posted twice.

[kellabeck]

tbrito, there is a forum for the Shawna Nelson trial already begun.

[tbrito1]

tbrito, there is a forum for the Shawna Nelson trial already begun.

thanks Kella, i'm on my way over there!! :) are you coming?

[kellabeck]

thanks Kella, i'm on my way over there!! :) are you coming?

No. After today Real Life beckons. Another trial will come along down the road that I will get sucked into I am sure.

[tbrito1]

well i hope to see you around!!! I'll be here and there today!!

[shortcake]

Good Morning My Happy Friends!!

Knew you guys wouldd party without me when the verdict came in. I finally got back on line around 10:30 last night.

I'm so excited!! Been watching all the clips on utube---love that SLSmith has been so dedicated to this trial. So cool the judge mentioned the clips to the jurors.

[shortcake]

tbrito--

saw where you had asked where I work. I'm a substitute school teacher who hasn't been able to work for about a year due to a back injury that ultimately resulted in two surgeries last year. Why do you ask?

[tbrito1]

tbrito--

saw where you had asked where I work. I'm a substitute school teacher who hasn't been able to work for about a year due to a back injury that ultimately resulted in two surgeries last year. Why do you ask?

I thought you had said that you have to go talk to a judge so I thought maybe you worked as a court transcriber or something......how are you today????????????:happy0207:

[cavimom]

tbrito, there is a forum for the Shawna Nelson trial already begun.

is it here?

[TigressPen]

Did the jury believe Julie was sufficated? NO
Did the jury believe any of the snitches? NO
Did the jury really understand depression? NO

They said they did not agree on the depth of Julies depression. :1187603408.CR.Mothe



You know what I find so amazing about these awesome jurors. Even after the lady holdout realized that the picture with the sticky note and Julie's letter was a dying declaration, they continued through the rest of the evidence and discussed it. By then, they were all basically on the same page with guilt. Nagging questions may have lingered before they said enough, he is guilty, but they were all on same thought waves.

[tbrito1]

is it here?

yep!http://helpfindthemissing.org/forum/showthread.php?t=2784

morning Cavi!! :howdy:so glad you all got the guilty verdict you all were waiting for.....

I couldn't help but laugh when you all were talking about the engineer and freaking out and it turns out that he thought guilty from the beginning!!! :67302:

[shortcake]

I thought you had said that you have to go talk to a judge so I thought maybe you worked as a court transcriber or something......how are you today????????????:happy0207:


I had to go for deposition on my wrkr comp claim. Just like in court there's a transcriber there and you are sworn to tell the truth, the whole truth......

I'm okay today, a little sad that the posting group will probably split for a while. I know there's another trial, but I'm not sure how many will actually be able to follow with it. There's so much real life stuff that many have to get back to. I've already got that thread open but really know nothing about the trial yet. Haven't had the chance to read the threads yet.

Last year after all the weeks of the Mel McGuire trial many jumped right into the PSpector trial. I just couldn't do it. Had too many things going on and just the sight of that strange looking little man creeped me out. So I chose to try to move on with life. Missed chatting with my friends on the board.

[shortcake]

yep!http://helpfindthemissing.org/forum/showthread.php?t=2784

morning Cavi!! :howdy:so glad you all got the guilty verdict you all were waiting for.....

I couldn't help but laugh when you all were talking about the engineer and freaking out and it turns out that he thought guilty from the beginning!!! :67302:

Told you guys not to worry, but did anyone listed to lil' ole me? Don't lie!!

[tbrito1]

I had to go for deposition on my wrkr comp claim. Just like in court there's a transcriber there and you are sworn to tell the truth, the whole truth......

I'm okay today, a little sad that the posting group will probably split for a while. I know there's another trial, but I'm not sure how many will actually be able to follow with it. There's so much real life stuff that many have to get back to. I've already got that thread open but really know nothing about the trial yet. Haven't had the chance to read the threads yet.

Last year after all the weeks of the Mel McGuire trial many jumped right into the PSpector trial. I just couldn't do it. Had too many things going on and just the sight of that strange looking little man creeped me out. So I chose to try to move on with life. Missed chatting with my friends on the board.

I know but now that everyone knows about this board we'll all meet up soon but your right, after I got home from work, all i wanted to do was chat about the trial so now I'm gonna pay for it this weekend...I have laundry up the kazoo!!! yesterday it took me a good .45 minutes to get myself to atleast empty out the dishwasher......Thank god my boys were home for vacation this week, it was less that I had to do...:22wink:

[kellabeck]

And I did not declare even before closing arguments that if there was a verdict it could only be guilty? I did! Even so, my heart was thump thump thumping as I waited for that wonderful word: GUILTY as charged!!

And the smirk was gone and the head bowed. He knew: I didn't get away with it after all.

And btw, the YouTube clips are not just moments from the trial. SLSmith has added stuff, not just graphics on the screen but other clips and it is really worth your while to watch the after verdict clip. Quite funny now that justice is done.

[shortcake]

Okay, since I missed the celebration posting time frame, I'll just sit here and chat with my self.

My the excitement that had to surround everyone waiting for the verdict, here and in the courthouse. I can just imagine Julie's brothers' chests heaving as they waited to hear the verdict. WOW! Ya'll had no warning there was a verdict! Here it was the end of the day! I bet when the judge was shown in his robe ya'll just thought the jury was going home for the day. And no trutv coverage to say a verdict had been reached. So WHAM! out of nowhere ya'll found yourselves in the courtroom and the verdict was going to be given? I know you are were going OMG! OMG! OMG!

As the guilty verdict was read, I noticed that some of Mark's expession was the same as when Det. Ratzburg showed him Julie's letter. That was priceless.

[shortcake]

Man! You mean I have to see Jamie Floyd this early? Yeck!

[kellabeck]

OMG! What a shock! Jami would have held out!!!

[Try2Win]

Lisa just said they will have some jurors on the show through out the day. :zm10:

[chambord]

Man! You mean I have to see Jamie Floyd this early? Yeck!

Oh brother!! Jamie tells Lisa she would have been a hold out!!

[TigressPen]

I had to go for deposition on my wrkr comp claim. Just like in court there's a transcriber there and you are sworn to tell the truth, the whole truth......

I'm okay today, a little sad that the posting group will probably split for a while. I know there's another trial, but I'm not sure how many will actually be able to follow with it. There's so much real life stuff that many have to get back to. I've already got that thread open but really know nothing about the trial yet. Haven't had the chance to read the threads yet.

Last year after all the weeks of the Mel McGuire trial many jumped right into the PSpector trial. I just couldn't do it. Had too many things going on and just the sight of that strange looking little man creeped me out. So I chose to try to move on with life. Missed chatting with my friends on the board.



I usually give it a break after a real strong and emotional trial like Jensen trial was. Back when we had CTV and Extra, I'd watch more than 1 trial at a time. But, the other trials were like 3 or 4 day ones. And too, we had Extra's replay of days evidence. I'm proud of the YouTube play backs but they are not titled well and you have to search-and-find with them.

I read on the Nelson case that you first put up and got hooked. When they said 2 to 3 wks I thought. Oh God, how will I be able to do that. But, I will. I may miss some testimony but threads and playbacks and local in court blogs will catch me up.

[kindee]

Oh brother!! Jamie tells Lisa she would have been a hold out!!



She's a permanent holdout, are you kidding? If I'm ever on trial for murder I want HER on my jury!

hey chambord! How ya doin' budddddddddy! :love0085:

[kellabeck]

Couldn't resist this email to Jami:

This is for JAMI FLOYD:

Jami, what a shock that you would have held out! You should NEVER serve on a jury because you are not capable of FAIRNESS you are so biased and ridiculous!
Obviously you didn't listen to a word that thoughtful and fair jury said last night.
You discredit the defense bar with your idiotic blather. Since there are no guilty defendants in your eyes we must also live in a world where there is no crime.
I hope Ron Kuby replaces you.

[TigressPen]

OMG! What a shock! Jami would have held out!!!



I betcha if she had actually been in that jury room and talked as these jurors did, and seen, that she'd have come around just like the original holdouts and the final holdout did. It was just too much there to say, My husband killed me, for her not to have. These jurors worked together, were understanding of each others feelings and stayed respectful.

[chambord]

She's a permanent holdout, are you kidding? If I'm ever on trial for murder I want HER on my jury!

hey chambord! How ya doin' budddddddddy! :love0085:

Its good to see you and all the others. Life's been too hectic to be here with you all every day, but I devoured all the posts in the evening. Great group here!:zm10:

[shortcake]

...snipped I'm proud of the YouTube play backs but they are not titled well and you have to search-and-find with them. ...


Once I learned to sort by "date added", I found the videos easier to search. I just felt they were great to have, since we don't have the videos to go back to watch on the IS boards like before.

[chambord]

Couldn't resist this email to Jami:

This is for JAMI FLOYD:

Jami, what a shock that you would have held out! You should NEVER serve on a jury because you are not capable of FAIRNESS you are so biased and ridiculous!
Obviously you didn't listen to a word that thoughtful and fair jury said last night.
You discredit the defense bar with your idiotic blather. Since there are no guilty defendants in your eyes we must also live in a world where there is no crime.
I hope Ron Kuby replaces you.


(((((BRAVO!!!!)))))

[tbrito1]

Couldn't resist this email to Jami:

This is for JAMI FLOYD:

Jami, what a shock that you would have held out! You should NEVER serve on a jury because you are not capable of FAIRNESS you are so biased and ridiculous!
Obviously you didn't listen to a word that thoughtful and fair jury said last night.
You discredit the defense bar with your idiotic blather. Since there are no guilty defendants in your eyes we must also live in a world where there is no crime.
I hope Ron Kuby replaces you.

WOW Kella, you should have told her how you really felt!! :hifive:

Great email!!!!

[RayStar]

She's a permanent holdout, are you kidding? If I'm ever on trial for murder I want HER on my jury!

hey chambord! How ya doin' budddddddddy! :love0085::)I had to laugh. Jami is a true defense atty. I saw no doubt.

[RayStar]

Please not Ron K perhaps that Hunk Michael Bryant.

[kindee]

Its good to see you and all the others. Life's been too hectic to be here with you all every day, but I devoured all the posts in the evening. Great group here!:zm10:



the BEST. SO nice to see all the good posters here.

[kellabeck]

Jami Floyd dishonors the jury system which she claims to support.

Has there EVER been anyone who she thought was guilty EVER????? If you listened to her, no crime has ever been solved.

Or maybe there IS no crime in the world what with all these innocent people running around.

What a jerk she is!

[need2no]

Please not Ron K perhaps that Hunk Michael Bryant.




:zm10::hifive:

[chambord]

Did I hear correctly that the sentencing is today?

No victim impact statements?

[tbrito1]

:zm10::hifive:

looking good today need!!! :22wink:

[tbrito1]

Did I hear correctly that the sentencing is today?

No victim impact statements?

at the end of the trial, Albee did ask or was it Jammy to get together today and the judge said it was too soon or it was something like that? I can't recall the exact conversation...

[shortcake]

Please not Ron K perhaps that Hunk Michael Bryant.

:puke::zm10::lex_10::022:

[kellabeck]

Did you notice that when Lisa Bloom asked Jami to explicate the evidence that gave her reasonable doubt, all she could do is say that the family doctor was key and the toxicologist was convincing about when the AF was ingested.

That is just pathetic. She was just a tiny bit better than Juror #10.

[chambord]

the BEST. SO nice to see all the good posters here.

LOL...I've been here for awhile. When I wander over the other place I go in disquise.

[Bernie]

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg48/bernieh/bfef3f7e.gif

For Jami.....:howdy:

[IfIMay]

Did I hear correctly that the sentencing is today?

No victim impact statements?

No, today the Judge will call the attorneys to set a sentencing date. I don't think we'll see anything. I think he said he'd set something for next week, as the defense waived the pre-sentencing report.

[kellabeck]

at the end of the trial, Albee did ask or was it Jammy to get together today and the judge said it was too soon or it was something like that? I can't recall the exact conversation...

Schroeder agreed to "calendar" the sentencing today, meaning set the date. My impression is that it will occur next week. No presentencing report is required as the defense waived it.

[need2no]

Jami Floyd dishonors the jury system which she claims to support.

Has there EVER been anyone who she thought was guilty EVER????? If you listened to her, no crime has ever been solved.

Or maybe there IS no crime in the world what with all these innocent people running around.

What a jerk she is!


Well yes...Jamie does think Dog Chapman should be hung from the rafters for his statements to his son. In her 'last word' comments she made it clear she feels he has not been punished enough for his words and she has not forgotten what he said....yet she believes there was reasonable doubt in the MJ case. :waitasec: :francis:

[TigressPen]

Once I learned to sort by "date added", I found the videos easier to search. I just felt they were great to have, since we don't have the videos to go back to watch on the IS boards like before.



I looked at them via date added also. But, still would rather have all of one person's testimony titled as it should be. I am not impressed by the subtitles listed with them.

[chambord]

What a shame, Julie's brothers have no contact with their nephews. How cruel. Two more of Mark's victims.

[kindee]

Did I hear correctly that the sentencing is today?

No victim impact statements?




No the judge is going to SET a date for the sentencing today. It will probably be next week some time.

[chambord]

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg48/bernieh/bfef3f7e.gif

For Jami.....:howdy:

Love it!!!! Perfect~~:girl_haha:

[kellabeck]

How typical. On the air they announce a poll "Do you agree with the verdict?" Unfortunately their website poll is still yesterday's.

:doh:

[dojewo]

Couldn't resist this email to Jami:

This is for JAMI FLOYD:

Jami, what a shock that you would have held out! You should NEVER serve on a jury because you are not capable of FAIRNESS you are so biased and ridiculous!
Obviously you didn't listen to a word that thoughtful and fair jury said last night.
You discredit the defense bar with your idiotic blather. Since there are no guilty defendants in your eyes we must also live in a world where there is no crime.
I hope Ron Kuby replaces you.Did you really send this Kella? I loved it.

[kindee]

LOL...I've been here for awhile. When I wander over the other place I go in disquise.




I thought I saw you here a couple of months back when I signed on. Yeah, I don't go there any more. Don't miss is a bit. :francis:

[need2no]

looking good today need!!! :22wink:


Why thank you! My cousin called and said she was pizzed I replaced her pic with mine, so I put her back as my avator. She can be so darn difficult to get along with so I try to keep the peace whenever possible. :22wink: :girl_haha:

[kellabeck]

What a shame, Julie's brothers have no contact with their nephews. How cruel. Two more of Mark's victims.

Isn't it sad that the boys live with the skeevy wife of their mother's killer??

[TigressPen]

Schroeder agreed to "calendar" the sentencing today, meaning set the date. My impression is that it will occur next week. No presentencing report is required as the defense waived it.


He said after the verdict was read that he'd likely set it one day next week. he also is going to right that addendum about the dying declaration decision.

[tbrito1]

Isn't it sad that the boys live with the skeevy wife of their mother's killer??

i would love to hear how Kelly feels about all of this? and why wouldn't the brothers have custody now that MJ's been found guilty?

[kellabeck]

The brothers should have custody, imo.

[twinkiesmom]

I do see Mark's parents jumping in with the custody battle but I sure do hope that Julies brothers fight for visitation rights. I know that grandparents have rights to visitation here in Wisconsin but I'm not to sure about further down the line.

BTW, Good morning all

Didn't Jean C. say yesterday that she did not believe Kelly had adopted the boys?

I think the main obstacle to a custody battle is age..David is 18, and at 13, Douglas would have a great say over where he stays.

Another possibility is Douglas moving in with David.

The good news is that all of the Jensens (the ones evident in the trial...is there another brother we haven't seen?) have had brushes with the law....It's a shame they weren't all prosecuted.

[Bernie]

It looked like she got your letter.....:howdy:

[tbrito1]

It looked like she got your letter.....:howdy:

why do you say that? Please share with us folks at work.....

[Try2Win]

Isn't it sad that the boys live with the skeevy wife of their mother's killer??


I haven't heard these brothers say anything bad about Kelly yet. They know that these boys have been living with her for a long time. I admire them for not going there, even if the feel like Kelly is the scum of the earth.

[kindee]

i would love to hear how Kelly feels about all of this? and why wouldn't the brothers have custody now that MJ's been found guilty?




The boys don't know the Griffin brothers; I know they should have had custody all this time but they are total strangers to those boys. And David is 18 now; he's an adult.

I feel sorry for Doug. He's stuck.


and yesterday the brothers said they haven't wanted to pick any kind of a fight with Kelly or the Jensen family so as not to ruin any chances of reuniting with the boys.

They've had to tread carefully so as not to blow their chances sky high.

[Orchid Corsage]

Did you notice that when Lisa Bloom asked Jami to explicate the evidence that gave her reasonable doubt, all she could do is say that the family doctor was key and the toxicologist was convincing about when the AF was ingested.

That is just pathetic. She was just a tiny bit better than Juror #10.

Morning! :) :happy0207: Loved your opening comments Kella!

:howdy: to Lisa, she came on with a wonderful opening!

Last night was my first good night's sleep since this trial began. One tired gal here! Ah feel all refreshed this lovely morn, snow and all!

Jamie! Jamie! Jamie! Yeppers she admitted, she would have been a 'hold out'! :duh: Jamie the Queen of Reasonable Doubt! :duh:

[Bernie]

why do you say that? Please share with us folks at work.....

Sorry....Jami...:howdy:

Couldn't resist this email to Jami:

This is for JAMI FLOYD:

Jami, what a shock that you would have held out! You should NEVER serve on a jury because you are not capable of FAIRNESS you are so biased and ridiculous!
Obviously you didn't listen to a word that thoughtful and fair jury said last night.
You discredit the defense bar with your idiotic blather. Since there are no guilty defendants in your eyes we must also live in a world where there is no crime.
I hope Ron Kuby replaces you.

[tbrito1]

The boys don't know the Griffin brothers; I know they should have had custody all this time but they are total strangers to those boys. And David is 18 now; he's an adult.

I feel sorry for Doug. He's stuck.

i'm sorry if this is a stupid question but why don't they know them? did MJ keep the boys away from the family at an early age?

[kellabeck]

The jurors said the original vote was 5G 5? and 2NG.

I wish they would ask them after they removed the fence and they had to come down on one side or another, what was that vote? I would be so curious to know that!

[TigressPen]

LOL...I've been here for awhile. When I wander over the other place I go in disquise.


I am still the same person over there and was thrilled when I got PM'd about this place. I was about to quit regularly posting due to all the bashing going on.
I did a few after joining here, but very few. And I will do a few in the future to keep my pseudonym active.

[dojewo]

Didn't Jean C. say yesterday that she did not believe Kelly had adopted the boys?

I think the main obstacle to a custody battle is age..David is 18, and at 13, Douglas would have a great say over where he stays.

Another possibility is Douglas moving in with David.

The good news is that all of the Jensens (the ones evident in the trial...is there another brother we haven't seen?) have had brushes with the law....It's a shame they weren't all prosecuted.The only problem I see is that David and Douglas really don't know their uncles. I don't know if they would choose to live with them. I know that David is 18 now and could be on his own but it's a bit young to take care of a younger brother.

[need2no]

i'm sorry if this is a stupid question but why don't they know them? did MJ keep the boys away from the family at an early age?

Yes, they said they were not allowed to see the boys. :(

[tbrito1]

Sorry....Jami...:howdy:

Couldn't resist this email to Jami:

This is for JAMI FLOYD:

Jami, what a shock that you would have held out! You should NEVER serve on a jury because you are not capable of FAIRNESS you are so biased and ridiculous!
Obviously you didn't listen to a word that thoughtful and fair jury said last night.
You discredit the defense bar with your idiotic blather. Since there are no guilty defendants in your eyes we must also live in a world where there is no crime.
I hope Ron Kuby replaces you.

no I know that Kella sent an email but did Jami say something on the air or something? why did you post " i guess she got your email?

[Bernie]

no I know that Kella sent an email but did Jami say something on the air or something? why did you post " i guess she got your email?

I was kidding....when they cameback onair Jami looked bummed...:howdy:

[kellabeck]

Jami is more like the Queen of Unreasonable Doubt.

[kindee]

i'm sorry if this is a stupid question but why don't they know them? did MJ keep the boys away from the family at an early age?




They haven't seen the boys since Julie was murdered.

[twinkiesmom]

[QUOTE=kellabeck;132879]Jami Floyd dishonors the jury system which she claims to support.

Has there EVER been anyone who she thought was guilty EVER????? If you listened to her, no crime has ever been solved.
QUOTE]

I don't think she was supporting the cops during the Frank Jude trial...So that makes her a two-note rather than a one-note.

[twinkiesmom]

They haven't seen the boys since Julie was murdered.

What was in the Kenosha News is that they hadn't seen her since Mark was charged.

[chambord]

They haven't seen the boys since Julie was murdered.

FWIW, I think its ridiculous that a parent in prison for murdering the mother has any say about who has custody of his children.

[Bernie]

FWIW, I think its ridiculous that a parent in prison for murdering the mother has any say about who has custody of his children.

I agree....:howdy:

[kindee]

What was in the Kenosha News is that they hadn't seen her since Mark was charged.




The brothers said they haven't seen the boys since Julie died---maybe they saw them from afar or something but Mark, Kelly and the Jensens have not let the brothers see those boys. Per the brothers.

[twinkiesmom]

The only problem I see is that David and Douglas really don't know their uncles. I don't know if they would choose to live with them. I know that David is 18 now and could be on his own but it's a bit young to take care of a younger brother.

If the Jensens thought the Griffins were going to make a serious play for custody, I wouldn't put it past them to set the two up together on their own.

[Orchid Corsage]

My thoughts:
The wonderful, intelligent, and insightful jury surely by divine intervention of Julie's spirit were able to see Julie's letter for the purpose she intended! WOW! An AMAZING jury!

[kindee]

FWIW, I think its ridiculous that a parent in prison for murdering the mother has any say about who has custody of his children.




He was out on the streets WITH custody of those boys for almost a decade.

But yeah. I think if the boys were younger, the brothers might fight them for custody. But 18 and 13? Would the boys even want to go with strangers?

yes, this is all Mark's fault. Just some other chaos and dysfunction left in his wake.

Mike Peterson's two wards never have come to terms with the fact HE killed their MOTHER. And they are young ADULTS. :1187603408.CR.Mothe

[chambord]

The brothers said they haven't seen the boys since Julie died---maybe they saw them from afar or something but Mark, Kelly and the Jensens have not let the brothers see those boys. Per the brothers.

They did say this morning that they have kept tabs on them. Julie was artistic, and David seems to have that talent and did well in school. Looks like someone was letting them know. How sad. They would be good role models for those boys.

[kindee]

My thoughts:
The wonderful, intelligent, and insightful jury surely by divine intervention of Julie's spirit were able to see Julie's letter for the purpose she intended! WOW! An AMAZING jury!




absolutely, that jury has given me hope again that the system DOES work when everybody is there for the right reasons.

[JONOTWO]

I turned on B&P to see Jami- light, aka Vinnie the Pooh, and there was the Queen of denial herself! By now, Jami must have gotten untold dozens of emails concerning her gross bias, yet she marches on. I have come to the conclusion her pro-defense at all costs persona has become a gimmick. Getting attention from, and attracting viewers is the game, and she is playing it to the max.
I wonder how she would have reacted to the Dahmer and Gacy cases?

[kindee]

They did say this morning that they have kept tabs on them. Julie was artistic, and David seems to have that talent and did well in school. Looks like someone was letting them know. How sad. They would be good role models for those boys.



did you see the site for Julie? LOTS of people leaving messages for the boys in case they want to drop in. I do think the brothers have kept as close as they can to David and Douglas. But someone said yesterday the Jensens have kept the boys "insulated" and I bet they have.

[Bernie]

My thoughts:
The wonderful, intelligent, and insightful jury surely by divine intervention of Julie's spirit were able to see Julie's letter for the purpose she intended! WOW! An AMAZING jury!

I agree......no poster on any board Im on ever compared the note with the letter.....how smart...:howdy:

[kindee]

I turned on B&P to see Jami- light, aka Vinnie the Pooh, and there was the Queen of denial herself! By now, Jami must have gotten untold dozens of emails concerning her gross bias, yet she marches on. I have come to the conclusion her pro-defense at all costs persona has become a gimmick. Getting attention from, and attracting viewers is the game, and she is playing it to the max.
I wonder how she would have reacted to the Dahmer and Gacy cases?



EXcellent points. She's Stuck on NG and that's just the way it is,like it or lump it.

The DAY Darren MAck copped his plea she was STILL protesting his innocence; it was kind of funny. Even though HE confessed, she couldn't "go there". Just ridiculous...and unreasonable. As you say, a kind of sick Vegas lounge act stuck on stupid.

[Try2Win]

did you see the site for Julie? LOTS of people leaving messages for the boys in case they want to drop in. I do think the brothers have kept as close as they can to David and Douglas. But someone said yesterday the Jensens have kept the boys "insulated" and I bet they have.

I have never seen her site. Could you post the link for that here please. TIA

[Orchid Corsage]

The brothers said they haven't seen the boys since Julie died---maybe they saw them from afar or something but Mark, Kelly and the Jensens have not let the brothers see those boys. Per the brothers.

I thought one of the brothers saw David this past July at one of the hearings and said, David was very receptive. :) There is HOPE!

[chambord]

did you see the site for Julie? LOTS of people leaving messages for the boys in case they want to drop in. I do think the brothers have kept as close as they can to David and Douglas. But someone said yesterday the Jensens have kept the boys "insulated" and I bet they have.

I can't imagine how those kids feel today. They need a lot of support. Julie's brothers would be so good for them at this time.

[kindee]

I agree......no poster on any board Im on ever compared the note with the letter.....how smart...:howdy:




They were also on top with the antifreeze research date. Early November, Albee suggested it was for Mark's POOL. The jury said that was WAY too late in the season; he should have been doing that in early fall, like Labor Day. They knew the research was for something else entirely.

[kindee]

I can't imagine how those kids feel today. They need a lot of support. Julie's brothers would be so good for them at this time.




Yes they would, unless Mark's family and Kelly have convinced the boys Julie's brothers are the ones who put their dad behind bars.

And I doubt they have been in counseling. That's not the jensen way.

[chambord]

Wow!! Jambois has done over 300 jury trials.

[kellabeck]

SNIP
Mike Peterson's two wards never have come to terms with the fact HE killed their MOTHER. And they are young ADULTS. :1187603408.CR.Mothe


ITA! But one thing, Kindee, that moment in THE STAIRCASE when Margaret and Martha are talking to a friend who has asked about all the blood that the witnesses at MP's trial said was at the scene of Elizabeth Ratliff's (their mother for those not familiar) death at the foot of the stairs where she lay. A scene their "father" (MP, who raised them, not their legal father) and his first wife claimed was bloodless...

And Margaret is silent as she is thinking and she quietly says "Oh, my god!"

I have always taken that moment as Margaret's epiphany. Dod says there was no blood. All these people say there was a lot of blood. ...Dod is LYING! Why? Dod KILLED OUR MOTHER!! Oh, my god!

[kindee]

I thought one of the brothers saw David this past July at one of the hearings and said, David was very receptive. :) There is HOPE!



Really? OHHHHHHH that's really good. I'm hopeful as well but with Mark's family in charge I don't think they are going to be cooperative with the effort.

I hope I'm wrong and those boys fall into their uncles' loving arms.

[chambord]

Quick question. Jambois expects this case to be argued before the Supreme Court. Why is that a probabilty?

[kindee]

ITA! But one thing, Kindee, that moment in THE STAIRCASE when Margaret and Martha are talking to a friend who has asked about all the blood that the witnesses at MP's trial said was at the scene of Elizabeth Ratliff's (their mother for those not familiar) death at the foot of the stairs where she lay. A scene their "father" (MP, who raised them, not their legal father) and his first wife claimed was bloodless...

And Margaret is silent as she is thinking and she quietly says "Oh, my god!"

I have always taken that moment as Margaret's epiphany. Dod says there was no blood. All these people say there was a lot of blood. ...Dod is LYING! Why? Dod KILLED OUR MOTHER!! Oh, my god!



Maybe....but it didn't change their lives or their public support of Dod. Man, I wish these guys would just not mess with the kids.

[TigressPen]

Yes they would, unless Mark's family and Kelly have convinced the boys Julie's brothers are the ones who put their dad behind bars.

And I doubt they have been in counseling. That's not the jensen way.


Agreed. I don't think it is the Jensen way any more than it is the Mack way. The children are always the biggest living victims. Sad.

[kindee]

Quick question. Jambois expects this case to be argued before the Supreme Court. Why is that a probabilty?




The letter Julie wrote saying "If I die, Mark killed me" basically. The defense says they have a right to face the accuser. Julie, dead, can't do that.

It's already gone through the system; one more time all the way to the supreme court. It's one reason this took so long to come to trial; it's been fighting its way up the ladder all this time. The courts just OK'd it recently so the letter could be brought into this trial.

[TigressPen]

Quick question. Jambois expects this case to be argued before the Supreme Court. Why is that a probabilty?


Julie's letter. Dying decalaration. IIRC

[Cat]

Morning, Kindee and all, http://bestsmileys.com/coffee/2.gif
This is too early for me. I really feel like dipping myself in a cup of coffee. I just couldn't sleep any more, up about three times so I said what the heck, and here I am. That's what I get for praising Ambien yesterday. I did not want to take another half a pill and sleep half the day.

[kindee]

Agreed. I don't think it is the Jensen way any more than it is the Mack way. The children are always the biggest living victims. Sad.




The families are extremely similar imo. Like Scott Peterson's as well.

Kids are there to be used as pawns. Pass it down the generations.

[kellabeck]

Maybe....but it didn't change their lives or their public support of Dod. Man, I wish these guys would just not mess with the kids.

And they could start by not killing their mothers.

[Cat]

Maybe....but it didn't change their lives or their public support of Dod. Man, I wish these guys would just not mess with the kids.

He needed them for their support money. I doubt if he ever really loved them.

[kindee]

Morning, Kindee and all, http://bestsmileys.com/coffee/2.gif
This is too early for me. I really feel like dipping myself in a cup of coffee. I just couldn't sleep any more, up about three times so I said what the heck, and here I am. That's what I get for praising Ambien yesterday. I did not want to take another half a pill and sleep half the day.




We've got a new trial starting today little Missy, and StoneFox got us a live feed from the trial in Colorado! We have lots to do! :mornincoffee:

[Orchid Corsage]

They were also on top with the antifreeze research date. Early November, Albee suggested it was for Mark's POOL. The jury said that was WAY too late in the season; he should have been doing that in early fall, like Labor Day. They knew the research was for something else entirely.

For the Jury, :happy0158::hifive::hifive: Another AMAZING revelation by the jury!

:attention: WI should be made the official jury center of the USA! LOL

[TigressPen]

They were also on top with the antifreeze research date. Early November, Albee suggested it was for Mark's POOL. The jury said that was WAY too late in the season; he should have been doing that in early fall, like Labor Day. They knew the research was for something else entirely.


Yep. And they understood the she is asleep and will be for a long time comment also.
This jury is just fabulous.

[chambord]

Thanks Kindee and Tigress for your explanations. I did forget how long this took to get to trial. Wonder if this anxiety all these years effected his sexual productivity. *evil grin*

[tbrito1]

We've got a new trial starting today little Missy, and StoneFox got us a live feed from the trial in Colorado! We have lots to do! :mornincoffee:

alright friends, i'm off to watch the next trial. going to get coffee and settle in here at my desk....i'll come by and check up on all of you during recess! :basic44:

[Cat]

We've got a new trial starting today little Missy, and StoneFox got us a live feed from the trial in Colorado! We have lots to do! :mornincoffee:

I know, kindee. I looked at the link last night and put up the live feed link on my favorites. I am ahead of the game for once.

[Try2Win]

I know, kindee. I looked at the link last night and put up the live feed link on my favorites. I am ahead of the game for once.

can someone please post the link. tia

[tbrito1]

http://media.myfoxcolorado.com/live/index2.html

[RayStar]

Jami is sick of OJ.:) I like Jami and a defense atty thinks that way. I really feel lawyers go to court to fight the LAW and not the guilt or innoence of the charged party. I don't think defense attys really care about ng nor g.:0009:

JUSTICE FOR JULIE:1222423:

[Orchid Corsage]

Morning, Kindee and all, http://bestsmileys.com/coffee/2.gif
This is too early for me. I really feel like dipping myself in a cup of coffee. I just couldn't sleep any more, up about three times so I said what the heck, and here I am. That's what I get for praising Ambien yesterday. I did not want to take another half a pill and sleep half the day.

:mornincoffee::mornincoffee::mornincoffee:

Hey Cat, this is early for me too! :1187603408.CR.Mothe LOL

I set the alarm! I wouldn't have missed this for the world! :s1gyahoo:

Here have another! :mornincoffee:

[kindee]

hey y'all, what is that site for Julie? The link is over on that other place and I just am not going there. I think it's called OurSisterJulie or something like that? It has all kinds of information, a time line etc.

[kellabeck]

Julie's letter. Dying decalaration. IIRC

Actually, Tigress, if I may...calling it a dying declaration is a recent event and that was done by Judge Schroeder just last week.

The issue with Julie's letter is a matter of real importance, the right of defendants to confront their accusers.

But in this case, or in any case where the accuser is KILLED by the person accused before s/he can testify, why should the killer profit from the person's absence when that absence was created by the killer himself?

Originally Julie's letter was suppressed. That was the importance of the forfeiture hearing. Had the defendant forfeited his right to insist that this letter be suppressed if the proponderance of the evidence showed he was responsible for the absence of the accuser?

That's why Julie's letter came in. And we saw how important it was to the jury. Separate from that, Judge Schroeder ruled that her letter was a "dying declaration" which may uphold its use in evidence despite the Supreme Court ruling, whatever it is.

[kellabeck]

hey y'all, what is that site for Julie? The link is over on that other place and I just am not going there. I think it's called OurSisterJulie or something like that? It has all kinds of information, a time line etc.

oursisterjulie.com

[girlfriday]

Quick question. Jambois expects this case to be argued before the Supreme Court. Why is that a probabilty?

If there is an appeal - it is likely to be based on Julie's letter. The only court higher than the one that allowed for it's admission is the Supreme Court.

Good luck to the appallents - they will need it.

Julie's death was not in vain. Her letter has already set important precedent for victims and her (our) voice will not be silenced!

[Cat]

:mornincoffee::mornincoffee::mornincoffee:

Hey Cat, this is early for me too! :1187603408.CR.Mothe LOL

I set the alarm! I wouldn't have missed this for the world! :s1gyahoo:

Here have another! :mornincoffee:

Thank, OC. I had two cups, and I really should only have one. The depression med I'm on doesn't go well with caffeine. It was so good though, hazelnut. See you over there. :love0085:

[kellabeck]

Matthew and Cynthia, jurors, are on!!

[kindee]

jury foreman and one of the women on TruTV. He's the engineer dude Hehehehe.

[Topaz]

I hope the jury is reading this forum. I think they were very very diligent and worked hard and did see the truth.

The amount of consideration and compassion they demonstrated was immense.
Far more than Jensen himself is capable of. And I bet he will never understand that process.

Now Mr. Albee will be trying to get the trial overturned BECAUSE of that letter!
For sure.

I lived with abuse for a long time as a child, and when I could escape, I did.
So I know how hard it was for Julie. I think she stayed to protect her children, and I don't think she was suicidal. I do think she was ill, and the doctor himself, told us with his records, only he was not paying attention himself. Her blood work needed further testing to evaluate the increased MCV result. This is a cardinal sign of pernicious anemia, which for her may have been starting and giving her the fatigue, weight loss, tiredness which may look like depression. One cannot think clearly, or have stamina to DO THINGS you might do otherwise. But her doctor chose to give her a potent drug instead.
The fast quick way and not the careful thoughtful way.

I watched the press conference of the jury and am heartened and encouraged by their work and behavior.

If this is ever retried, I hope the letter will still be allowed, and a more careful medical opinion will be offered for Julie's "depressive" symptoms.

Thank you Wisconsin!

Does anyone know why Albee passed on the presentence report? Is there something huge to hide if it were done?
And would some guilt be revealed? I didn't know you could do this, I thought it was automatic and done for
the prison system to use. Anyone know?

[kellabeck]

They picked the right foreperson!!

[Cat]

If there is an appeal - it is likely to be based on Julies letter. The only court higher then the one that allowed for it's admission is the Supreme Court.

Good luck to the appallents - they will need it.

Julie's death was not in vain. Her letter has already set important precedent for victims and her (our) voice will not be silenced!

Setting precedent for victims: maybe that is what Julie came to earth to do. Good job, Julie. :1222423:

[kindee]

oursisterjulie.com




Thank you!

[Orchid Corsage]

Thank, OC. I had two cups, and I really should only have one. The depression med I'm on doesn't go well with caffeine. It was so good though, hazelnut. See you over there. :love0085:

That coffee was decaf! Only decaf for me or I'd be hanging from the chandelier! LOL

I switched years ago, and the difference has been amazing! :zm10:

[DeeJay]

What do y'all make of the jurors saying they don't believe JULIE WAS SUFFOCATED? :faintTHUD:

[kindee]

What do y'all make of the jurors saying they don't believe JULIE WAS SUFFOCATED? :faintTHUD:




They didn't say she WASN'T suffocated, just that they didn't have to go there as they bought the EG killed her and stopped there.

[chambord]

They didn't say she WASN'T suffocated, just that they didn't have to go there as they bought the EG killed her and stopped there.

Yes, that's how I took it also.

[Orchid Corsage]

Oh Laura! If case someone missed it today

Jean said, Laura and her parents walked out of court separately!

We knew they were not sitting together in court yesterday!

Trouble in River City!

Laura's friends will be very very wary of her from now on!

[kellabeck]

What do y'all make of the jurors saying they don't believe JULIE WAS SUFFOCATED? :faintTHUD:

They said it wasn't proven BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT. And since the EG poisoning was and they believed Mark did that, then they could convict without being hung up on the suffocation.

I will bet some, if not all of the jurors believe he smothered her, they just didn't feel it was proven. No matter.

[Orchid Corsage]

What do y'all make of the jurors saying they don't believe JULIE WAS SUFFOCATED? :faintTHUD:

Dee, it still had to be in the back of their minds! How could it not? Like a little 'inkle' hanging around! :)

[shortcake]

As I've sat and thought about the verdict and how important it was to the family to have justice served and a murderer revealed, my greatest thoughts are about the impact on the children involved here. This is just so absolutely sad for them.

First, you have David, the oldest son. He is now a senior in high school with many decisions facing him about the path/s for his future. How extremely disturbing to think that this young man will not have the convenience that so many other students have, which is to rely on parent's for guidance. Mark has removed all parental influence from David's life through horrific calculated actions. Oh, yes, I know that Kelly is still around, but I do not see her as being able to offer anything positive in David's life. For David, to have his mother die and now have to come to terms with the fact that his dad is the reason for all of this. And I do mean all. Whatever wrong decision/s that Julie made regarding Perry, it never merited abuse for 7 years and ultimately death.

I just can't get past all the things David should be enjoying right now. How unfair to rob this young man of what should have been able to be the best and most memorable years of his life. Having one daughter who has graduated and another in high school right now, I have realized more than ever how important it is for kids to have good memorable moments. They are gone so fast, and real life sets in soon after graduation when friends start heading in other directions.

Doug, who has not been mentioned as much, is apprx. 13 now. What an age to have to come to terms about your dad and the murder of your real mother. Unfortunately because of his young age when Julie was removed from his life, his memories of her are limited, therefore the mother figure he knows most is Kelly Jensen. How sad! Who would want to learn the things that have become common knowledge to so many now. Doug now faces the remainder of his teen years without a father and a true mother. Not to mention that he will face all that David is facing now as he approaches decisions about his future.

Of course there is the third son, the one born the same year Mark was charged with intentional homicide of Julie. How would you like to have that connected to your birth year? Now he will grow up as the kid with the mother.....Don't really need to spell that out, do I? What a life! His mother will never be the same and therefore will never be able to be all she could have been to him. As this son grows older, it only stands to reason that he will question if his mother connection to Julie's death. What respect will he be able to have for his mother?

David is old enough to be on his own, but custody of Doug will be an issue. There's no telling who will end up being the adult influence his life. From the things we've heard in this trial, there's no one on the Jensent side of the trial that I can see would have a positive influence on him. Looking at the character of the children that the Ma & Pa Jensen have produced, I don't see a good scenario of them being in charge of Doug.

Sorry for the long post. But remember, my fingers didn't get the post verdict that many of you did, so I'm sorting through my feelings today.

[DeeJay]

They said it wasn't proven BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT. And since the EG poisoning was and they believed Mark did that, then they could convict without being hung up on the suffocation.

I will bet some, if not all of the jurors believe he smothered her, they just didn't feel it was proven. No matter.


I meant to type WASN'T suffocated, instead of WAS....gees it's so early here and not fully awake.

I had no doubt about suffocation b/c of the damages to her ribs. The autopsy photo told the story.

I had more belief in suffocation than EG....there wasn't much in her system by most accounts.

[annalyzer]

Actually, Tigress, if I may...calling it a dying declaration is a recent event and that was done by Judge Schroeder just last week.

The issue with Julie's letter is a matter of real importance, the right of defendants to confront their accusers.

But in this case, or in any case where the accuser is KILLED by the person accused before s/he can testify, why should the killer profit from the person's absence when that absence was created by the killer himself?

Originally Julie's letter was suppressed. That was the importance of the forfeiture hearing. Had the defendant forfeited his right to insist that this letter be suppressed if the proponderance of the evidence showed he was responsible for the absence of the accuser?

That's why Julie's letter came in. And we saw how important it was to the jury. Separate from that, Judge Schroeder ruled that her letter was a "dying declaration" which may uphold its use in evidence despite the Supreme Court ruling, whatever it is.

I had never seen the post it note of Mark's but had seen Julie's letter. To me it didn't make sense either why she would write the things she did. The jury was able to lay them side by side and see why Julie wrote the things she did. She was writing that letter as she was looking at Mark's post it note of different ways he could kill Julie. Poor Julie. :1222423:

[Cat]

That coffee was decaf! Only decaf for me or I'd be hanging from the chandelier! LOL

I switched years ago, and the difference has been amazing! :zm10:

It's hard to switch, because my husband won't drink decaf. I guess we could make two pots of coffee. He is unreal. Some days he can drink a whole pot of caffienated by himself, and it doesn't seem to bother him. :shock:

[Orchid Corsage]

jury foreman and one of the women on TruTV. He's the engineer dude Hehehehe.


:zm10: wink wink LOL

[annalyzer]

I meant to type WASN'T suffocated, instead of WAS....gees it's so early here and not fully awake.

I had no doubt about suffocation b/c of the damages to her ribs. The autopsy photo told the story.

I had more belief in suffocation than EG....there wasn't much in her system by most accounts.

I guess Mark had said the reason etheylene glycol was looked up on the computer was because he was going to close the pool. That was in late November I believe and the jurors said if you don't have your pool closed by mid October you're in for big trouble so why would he be searching for that in Novemeber. Very astute jury.

[Orchid Corsage]

It's hard to switch, because my husband won't drink decaf. I guess we could make two pots of coffee. He is unreal. Some days he can drink a whole pot of caffienated by himself, and it doesn't seem to bother him. :shock:

Cat we were a 2 potter here for a long time, now he has switched over! :zm10:

He gets his fix at work, his sec make 1/2 and 1/2 :) LOL

[Cat]

Cat we were a 2 potter here for a long time, now he has switched over! :zm10:

He gets his fix at work, his sec make 1/2 and 1/2 :) LOL

I may try it, OC. Thanks. See you over on the other thread.

[girlfriday]

I meant to type WASN'T suffocated, instead of WAS....gees it's so early here and not fully awake.

I had no doubt about suffocation b/c of the damages to her ribs. The autopsy photo told the story.

I had more belief in suffocation than EG....there wasn't much in her system by most accounts.

The crystallization in her organs meant the EG poisoning was lethal. The chance of her survival was unlikely even had there been intervention. IMO, suffocation during her final breaths only hastened the inevitable - I doubt it would have taken much since her body was likely not fighting but was letting go already.

[girlfriday]

I guess Mark had said the reason etheylene glycol was looked up on the computer was because he was going to close the pool. That was in late November I believe and the jurors said if you don't have your pool closed by mid October you're in for big trouble so why would he be searching for that in Novemeber. Very astute jury.

And not just that. The fact that there was an excuse offered is so telling. The defense would like us to believe that it was just a coincidence that he was researching it for the pool while she was researching if for suicide....ridiculous!

[kellabeck]

I meant to type WASN'T suffocated, instead of WAS....gees it's so early here and not fully awake.

I had no doubt about suffocation b/c of the damages to her ribs. The autopsy photo told the story.

I had more belief in suffocation than EG....there wasn't much in her system by most accounts.

Her kidneys were full of the crystals.

[twinkiesmom]

Does anyone know why Albee passed on the presentence report? Is there something huge to hide if it were done?
And would some guilt be revealed? I didn't know you could do this, I thought it was automatic and done for
the prison system to use. Anyone know?

It was suspected "over there" that Albee might want to avoid the psych eval.:a1chic:

[Try2Win]

I think Jami is going to have another juror on her show.

I would like to hear from at least one or two alternates.

Does anyone know for sure that all the jurors who were interviewed last night were only the ones from the deliberating group?

[lovelaw]

They didn't say she WASN'T suffocated, just that they didn't have to go there as they bought the EG killed her and stopped there.

Jamie Floyd is driving me NUTS!~

[kellabeck]

OMG! Jami just said if someone is excited and says, "OMG! I just shot someone!" it should come in -- implying that it's true.

Oh, yeah, didn't Jami believe that Phil "I just shot someone" Spector was not guilty???

What a sham!!!

[Cat]

I think Jami is going to have another juror on her show.

I would like to hear from at least one or two alternates.

Does anyone know for sure that all the jurors who were interviewed last night were only the ones from the deliberating group?

Someone posted that the man in the red shirt was an alternate.

[lovelaw]

Even W/O the letter this case is strong.

[chambord]

LOL...Lisa sure appears frustrated with Jamie this morning.

[Try2Win]

Someone posted that the man in the red shirt was an alternate.

thank you

[kellabeck]

Someone posted that the man in the red shirt was an alternate.

Yes, the only alternate at the presser last night. And HE was the engineer! And he was convinced of GUILT and said he couldn't imagine anything could have talked him out of that belief.

[lovelaw]

Someone posted that the man in the red shirt was an alternate.

IIRC, that is correct.

I can hardly wait for Jamie's show today...even though I'll probably break something during it!~

[lovelaw]

LOL...Lisa sure appears frustrated with Jamie this morning.

I can't blame her. I could strangle her myself!!~

:0012:Chambord LTNS!~

[chambord]

Beautiful sentiments shortcake. You said a mouthful! Bravo!

[kellabeck]

I can't blame her. I could strangle her myself!!~


And then you could hire Craig Albee to defend you. Claim justifiable homicide.


Jami is still fixated on the Stallings case. Fill a sock with manure, Jami and stick it in your mouth.

[RayStar]

LOL...Lisa sure appears frustrated with Jamie this morning.

I think it's call Smart Woman Syndrome. SWS LOL:)

Now I think I'll go look for TA=Trial Anon :grin::grin:

[chambord]

I can't blame her. I could strangle her myself!!~

:0012:Chambord LTNS!~

Oh My....Its so nice to see all my favs and reconnect. LOL...Is there anyone left behind.. *grinning*...Everyone who is anyone is here.

[lovelaw]

I LOVE how Lisa doesn't let Jamie walk over her....verbally or otherwise!~

[chambord]

Haha..Loved what the juror just said, no alimony, no child support, nothing. Hope he enjoyed it while he had it.

[wi_twin_mom]

Good morning everyone!!! What a beautiful morning, everything is right with the world!!! I didn't post much after the verdict...too emotional,too excited, and so proud of the Jury!!!!

[lovelaw]

And then you could hire Craig Albee to defend you. Claim justifiable homicide.


Jami is still fixated on the Stallings case. Fill a sock with manure, Jami and stick it in your mouth.

NO WAY!! Not Albee!! LOL!~
I DO agree with justifiable homicide tough!~ I want YOU on my jury!


Like the Stalling's case has ANYTHING to do with this one!~ She won't let it go though!~

[lovelaw]

Oh My....Its so nice to see all my favs and reconnect. LOL...Is there anyone left behind.. *grinning*...Everyone who is anyone is here.

ITA!!~ Don't you JUST LOVE IT!~? :zm10:

[lovelaw]

Haha..Loved what the juror just said, no alimony, no child support, nothing. Hope he enjoyed it while he had it.

He walked free for faaaaaaaaaaaar too long. He must have felt so superior all that time. FINALLY...justice grabbed him by the throat!~

[kellabeck]

NO WAY!! Not Albee!! LOL!~
I DO agree with justifiable homicide tough!~ I want YOU on my jury!


Like the Stalling's case has ANYTHING to do with this one!~ She won't let it go though!~

She's like a dog with a bone. She just would not let go of the Stallings case which had Dr Long in common with this one.

THREE LABS found EG in the Stallings case, fgs! The real COD was a very rare genetic defect apparently and there is nothing to say that Dr Long did anything wrong given the state of the science at the time.

In any case, those are apples. These are oranges. Jami is an idiot. And a hypocrite to boot.

[chambord]

ITA!!~ Don't you JUST LOVE IT!~? :zm10:

:love0085:

[wi_twin_mom]

He walked free for faaaaaaaaaaaar too long. He must have felt so superior all that time. FINALLY...justice grabbed him by the throat!~

Yes, and my brother finally put him there!!!!

[kellabeck]

Will Jami talk about Mike Nifong for two hours?

Jami is still speaking in the present tense. "Jensen denies any wrongdoing."

Jami on the left. Me on the right.
http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff272/esp95/smackdown.gif

[DeeJay]

Yes, and my brother finally put him there!!!!


Your BROTHER is Jambois?!!

[kellabeck]

Yes, and my brother finally put him there!!!!

Your brother????

[twinkiesmom]

Yes, and my brother finally put him there!!!!


Are you Jammy's sister or Brucey's??? LOVE IT!!!

[wi_twin_mom]

Your BROTHER is Jambois?!!

My brother is Ed Klug.

[kellabeck]

Wow!!!

[chambord]

He walked free for faaaaaaaaaaaar too long. He must have felt so superior all that time. FINALLY...justice grabbed him by the throat!~

The day of reckoning, (yesterday) was so sweet. Hearing Jambois this am say, Julie's boys have suffered such depravation, (paraphrased) breaks my heart. Mark left many victims, and as much as I disapprove of Kelley, she too is one.

[DeeJay]

My brother is Ed Klug.

Oh....and I was shocked the jury didn't believe him. :shock:

He told of MJ's plans before he actually did the deed. How could the jury DISMISS that? :0doh:

[shortcake]

Beautiful sentiments shortcake. You said a mouthful! Bravo!

Thank You for reading. It was lengthy.

[lovelaw]

She's like a dog with a bone. She just would not let go of the Stallings case which had Dr Long in common with this one.

THREE LABS found EG in the Stallings case, fgs! The real COD was a very rare genetic defect apparently and there is nothing to say that Dr Long did anything wrong given the state of the science at the time.

In any case, those are apples. These are oranges. Jami is an idiot. And a hypocrite to boot.


A dog in tight clothes!~

Of course Dr. Long was the common thread.....but as far as factually, IMO, the circumstances were nothing alike. This had NOTHING to do with a genetic disorder. And, the finding of EG in the system was undisputed here as to her STOMACH contents.

Yep.....apples/oranges!~ Jamie IS an idiot!~ And....I USED to like her and respect. NOT anymore!~ Over the past year or two I have lost all love for her!~

[wi_twin_mom]

Oh....and I was shocked the jury didn't believe him. :shock:

He told of MJ's plans before he actually did the deed. How could the jury DISMISS that? :0doh:

They did believe him about the crystals and benadryl. They also believed my SIL and Wruck.

[twinkiesmom]

My brother is Ed Klug.


WoW!!! Thrilled to finally meet you...So glad he and JoAnne spoke the truth. Have no doubts he was terrified of the Jensen clan and hope their safety will be assured in the future.

I hope this case will bring Ed and JoAnne closer together into the type of marriage they could only dream of.

[lovelaw]

Yes, and my brother finally put him there!!!!

HOO AHHHHH!~:hifive: (WHICH guy?)



I have to run folks! Gotta catch up on a bit of life!!~

:0012::0012::0012:LATER!~


HUGS TO ALL!~:love0085:

[lovelaw]

My brother is Ed Klug.

WOWZA!! WOWZA! WOWZA!~:zm10:

[DeeJay]

They did believe him about the crystals and benadryl. They also believed my SIL and Wruck.

Doesn't make sense......they believed Wruck
and Mrs. K but not Ed?? but he was their SOURCE!
Without him...Mrs. K & Wruck had no info.

[kellabeck]

Oh....and I was shocked the jury didn't believe him. :shock:

He told of MJ's plans before he actually did the deed. How could the jury DISMISS that? :0doh:

Actually, they didn't totally dismiss his testimony, according to what they said yesterday.

They said they credited some of his testimony because they believed what he said about the crystals, and they also said that his testimony was backed up by Joanne Klug and Ron Wruck.

[DeeJay]

Actually, they didn't totally dismiss his testimony, according to what they said yesterday.

They said they credited some of his testimony because they believed what he said about the crystals, and they also said that his testimony was backed up by Joanne Klug and Ron Wruck.

Nor did they seem to believe MJ was trying to hire someone to SIT ON KLUG, the 500$ twice. What else did mj mean by that, if not for sitting on klug?

[shortcake]

So kewl WiTwMom! I'm so glad you're brother did the right thing. I know it was hard and it was obvious during his testimony just how nervous he was. You're SIL did good too! Hope whatever is needed to protect them or secure is done so that they can enjoy the life they should have.

By the way, I love the pic!

[chambord]

My brother is Ed Klug.

*Thud*

[chambord]

Thank You for reading. It was lengthy.

But so worth it. Loved it.

[andersson33]

Yes, and my brother finally put him there!!!!

OMG!
I'm actually speechless!

:faintTHUD:

[wi_twin_mom]

Doesn't make sense......they believed Wruck
and Mrs. K but not Ed?? but he was their SOURCE!
Without him...Mrs. K & Wruck had no info.

They beleived him about the crystals and the benadryl. He was so nervous about testifing. He thought Mark was going to kill him. The first day of his test. the ME left the pic of Julie's face so if he looked down he could see it. He is a pretty nervous guy to begin with.

[kellabeck]

Nor did they seem to believe MJ was trying to hire someone to SIT ON KLUG, the 500$ twice. What else did mj mean by that, if not for sitting on klug?

Didn't you think that the "sit on Klug" plot was nutty and impractical? That doesn't mean it wasn't hatched. We heard the phone call about the "bockle idea" but that was not the be all of the pros. case! As you see, the jury set aside the snitches and the science and still were able to convict.

[IfIMay]

My brother is Ed Klug.

whoa! I had no idea. Tell your brother thank you for standing up for Julie and justice.

[Cat]

wi_twin_mom :love0085: Say thanks to your brother.

[DeeJay]

They beleived him about the crystals and the benadryl. He was so nervous about testifing. He thought Mark was going to kill him. The first day of his test. the ME left the pic of Julie's face so if he looked down he could see it. He is a pretty nervous guy to begin with.

Without the crystals and the benadryl, told told his wife on the phone a month prior, there's the proof!

Maybe my brain's not in its gear yet. Still coming down from 7 weeks of trial and it's still early out here.

[Bernie]

Will Jami talk about Mike Nifong for two hours?

Jami is still speaking in the present tense. "Jensen denies any wrongdoing."

Jami on the left. Me on the right.
http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff272/esp95/smackdown.gif

:67302:

[wi_twin_mom]

wi_twin_mom :love0085: Say thanks to your brother.

I will pass on all of your sentiments, he will appreciate that. It's been very hard on our families, but not as hard as Julie's family.

[wi_twin_mom]

whoa! I had no idea. Tell your brother thank you for standing up for Julie and justice.

Well, if you had no idea then I did a good job about not saying anything that would hurt the case!

[need2no]

http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x161/need2no/1526_business_man_crying_over_his_d.jpg


Poor Mark................



:67302:

[kellabeck]

WTM. we thought you were just a former Yooper who like us was interested in the case!!

When did Ed tell you what he knew? (If you feel like answering...)

[jcc]

Further thoughts on the genius of the jury system and the course of deliberations when there are twelve fair and open-minded citizens on board.



Excellent post! Like you, I was surprised that only 5 were convinced of guilt upon entering into deliberations. But, they all reasoned it through... I love it when the system works.

[kindee]

Yes, and my brother finally put him there!!!!




Just heard the news, congrats BIG time. I was with him all the way, never had a bad word to say about him.

Y'all rock. :love0085:

[Cat]

Well, if you had no idea then I did a good job about not saying anything that would hurt the case!

You did a GREAT job, twin mom.
http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii157/Guitara_Hero/flowers.jpg

[kellabeck]

BTW, Jami actually said to Sandy Schott, juror, who spoke of being glad she served on this jury...

"So this experience didn't poison you against jury duty??"

Jami is a twit.

[kindee]

Well, if you had no idea then I did a good job about not saying anything that would hurt the case!





I had NO idea. Ya done good! :hifive:

[shortcake]

Well, if you had no idea then I did a good job about not saying anything that would hurt the case!

Yes, you did a very good job not compromising anything at all. Have you spoken to your brother since the verdict? I would think he was emotional about it. I seem to remember you were new to the boards with this trial. So how did you learn of the boards? Just wondering.

[need2no]

My brother is Ed Klug.




:shock:


I bet it was tough to keep that to yourself during this trial.

:zm10: to you, and your brother

[Cat]

I had NO idea. Ya done good! :hifive:
WI Twin Mom, if I had a secret, I'd trust it with you.

[IfIMay]

Excellent post! Like you, I was surprised that only 5 were convinced of guilt upon entering into deliberations. But, they all reasoned it through... I love it when the system works.

With a purely circumstantial case, BARD can be difficult for some. I think that's why the numbers on guilty were lower. I suspect a lot more thought he was guilty, but had to look at the BARD instruction to be able to vote that way.

[kellabeck]

I swear to gawd, Jami is crossexamining this woman and trying to get to admit that Mark isn't guilty and there's reasonable doubt.

[kindee]

I swear to gawd, Jami is crossexamining this woman and trying to get to admit that Mark isn't guilty and there's reasonable doubt.




yep. She's a piece of work. :rolleye0001:

[kellabeck]

Just to show you how twittish Jami is--- She says "We thought it was all about Aaron Dillard and the Stallings case!"

NO, Jami. YOU think it's all about that. We were talking about Mark's words and deeds and how incriminating they were.

[wi_twin_mom]

WTM. we thought you were just a former Yooper who like us was interested in the case!!

When did Ed tell you what he knew? (If you feel like answering...)

He told me 2 days before he test. this summer at the hearing. He wanted to stay overnight with us because we're only an hour from Kenosha.

[kindee]

Just to show you how twittish Jami is--- She says "We thought it was all about Aaron Dillard and the Stallings case!"

NO, Jami. YOU think it's all about that. We were talking about Mark's words and deeds and how incriminating they were.



Jami is pizzing me off big time, attacking this woman like this.

[DeeJay]

Excellent post! Like you, I was surprised that only 5 were convinced of guilt upon entering into deliberations. But, they all reasoned it through... I love it when the system works.

That one engineer was a guilty from the get-go!
Not a stumbling block, like in spector.
He had an agenda and a bit of fear of spector.
He was a neighbor of specs and likely feared for his life if he voted guilty.

It was that one woman. I just knew it too at the time. My instinct told me that.

[chambord]

Jami is pizzing me off big time, attacking this woman like this.

Jamie raises my blood pressure. She needs to be banned.

[wi_twin_mom]

:shock:


I bet it was tough to keep that to yourself during this trial.

:zm10: to you, and your brother

I didn't keep it a secret, only on-line. I told anyone who would listen about it. Friends, neighbors, co-workers... I just didn't want total strangers (You guys are not strangers anymore!)knowing. I feel safe here, would not have said anything at the "other" place!!!!

[kellabeck]

And Jami didn't get how the Post It note related the letter!!! Are you kidding??? Last night when you heard Ms Schott say that about putting them side by side didn't you just go :doh:

But Jami wasn't really paying attn. to the evidence. As I pointed out to her. The other day when Reilly's testimony was replayed and Mark's FIRST LIES were there to behold, she completely ignored them.

That's why I asked her how in the world she ever cross examined anyone when she can't even keep evidence in her head?

http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc38/sweetlows/arton1215.jpg

[jcc]

Isn't it sad that the boys live with the skeevy wife of their mother's killer??

As much relief as I felt last night, as I laid down to sleep... this is the thought that was in my head.

Now, it could very well be these boys have accepted KJ as their mother... they were awfully young. I have no idea if the relationship is good, bad, loving, or not. But..still... at some point these boys are going to have to come to terms with the reality here...

What a mess for them.

And, I also thought of that little 3yo boy, who also did nothing to deserve this. He'll grow up without a father, only to learn he was put away for murdering his brothers mother. :1222423:

I couldn't feel more for these boys... all of them. And I hope someday they can accept the truth, and move beyond it.

[kellabeck]

DeeJay, I seem to be disagreeing with you a lot today. I agree that #10 had an agenda in the Spector debacle. But it wasn't fear.

It was $$$$$$$$$$. I still say look in his driveway. Is there a new Lexus there?

[IfIMay]

Jami is pizzing me off big time, attacking this woman like this.

Sandy seemed capable of holding her own last night. Is she putting Jamie in her place?

[wi_twin_mom]

As much relief as I felt last night, as I laid down to sleep... this is the thought that was in my head.

Now, it could very well be these boys have accepted KJ as their mother... they were awfully young. I have no idea if the relationship is good, bad, loving, or not. But..still... at some point these boys are going to have to come to terms with the reality here...

What a mess for them.

And, I also thought of that little 3yo boy, who also did nothing to deserve this. He'll grow up without a father, only to learn he was put away for murdering his brothers mother. :1222423:

I couldn't feel more for these boys... all of them. And I hope someday they can accept the truth, and move beyond it.
:1222423:

[Orchid Corsage]

Yes, and my brother finally put him there!!!!

He sure did help to get things rolling.

Ah thanks for telling us your connection :)

How is your brother doing? Not suffering from Albeeitis is he? :innocent0001:

[kellabeck]

Sandy seemed capable of holding her own last night. Is she putting Jamie in her place?

No, she is not doing what I would do. I will bet she has no idea who this twit with a microphone is...She continues to be very solid and sensible and down-to-earth.

I would be reaching through the monitor and smacking Jami upside her head.

[Orchid Corsage]

I didn't keep it a secret, only on-line. I told anyone who would listen about it. Friends, neighbors, co-workers... I just didn't want total strangers (You guys are not strangers anymore!)knowing. I feel safe here, would not have said anything at the "other" place!!!!

:1222423:

[kellabeck]

I hope a juror clarifies the issue of the suffocation. It's not that they didn't believe she was suffocated. They didn't believe it BARD!!!

[DeeJay]

Jami Floyd is such a disgrace!

She disgraces the network and herself each day she shows and opens her mouth!

[DeeJay]

I hope a juror clarifies the issue of the suffocation. It's not that they didn't believe she was suffocated. They didn't believe it BARD!!!

What?
They don't believe their lying eyes? (autopsy photo.)

[kellabeck]

Wow! Deejay We Totally Agree!!

[Cat]

Jami Floyd is such a disgrace!

She disgraces the network and herself each day she shows and opens her mouth!

Yes, and makes a lot of money doing it. Blech.....

[DeeJay]

DeeJay, I seem to be disagreeing with you a lot today. I agree that #10 had an agenda in the Spector debacle. But it wasn't fear.

It was $$$$$$$$$$. I still say look in his driveway. Is there a new Lexus there?


Oh indeed I just forgot about the $$$ part. I think that's a very good possibility.

The pros should have not allowed him on the jury, b/c he does live in the neighborhood.

[DeeJay]

Yes, and makes a lot of money doing it. Blech.....

Indeed! What a gig!! :s1gyahoo:

I'd like to take her place, I could at least get most things right! :basic44:

[kellabeck]

That case was hung in the jury selection.

Jami is gonna beat on Nifong. As if all DAs were like him. And all defendants are innocent. She makes me want to retch.

[jcc]

What do y'all make of the jurors saying they don't believe JULIE WAS SUFFOCATED? :faintTHUD:


I personally believe the suffocation was plausible, but I can understand why they just tossed it out. There may have been doubt for some. It is difficult to PROVE suffocation, and although there were physical symptoms that matched her being sat upon and pushed into the mattress... Dr. Denton cast some doubt on that. Of course, Dr. Denton also said there was nothing INCONSISTENT about the physical symptoms and a suffocation. But, they couldn't PROVE it.

In any case, I think because of the whole Dillard thing, they felt better just discounting that.

They didn't need it to prove Mark killed her. They had the poison proof.

[Orchid Corsage]

I felt the same way as this last guest, Sandy-- all along, not understanding why Julie hadn't packed it up and left. I did come the realization M had her beaten down to the point she had lost all self-confidence and had her feeling mega guilt.

However, from the getgo of Det R's interview with M along with the evidence of EG, I had no problem knowing he was G! So I was never hung up on the 'not leaving'!

I really don't think Julie stayed because she loved Mark :duh:

Thank God, she finally got beyond her 'strong woman' internalization!

We could have been looking at a hung jury here! :mad:

[IfIMay]

Oh indeed I just forgot about the $$$ part. I think that's a very good possibility.

The pros should have not allowed him on the jury, b/c he does live in the neighborhood.

Saddest part is Jackson and Dixon wanted to strike him, but the DA overruled that decision.

[kellabeck]

What?
They don't believe their lying eyes? (autopsy photo.)

I disagree with the jury about the suffocation. I believe it WAS proven.

But I can see why they decided to let it go because they had a COD that they could hang their hats on and that's the EG which was undeniable. Even the defense conceded she had EG in her body. Had Mark not become impatient, she would have been dead within hours. He just didn't want to wait.

So in that regard it's immaterial. They got the killer right.

[kellabeck]

Saddest part is Jackson and Dixon wanted to strike him, but the DA overruled that decision.

What????

[kindee]

They beleived him about the crystals and the benadryl. He was so nervous about testifing. He thought Mark was going to kill him. The first day of his test. the ME left the pic of Julie's face so if he looked down he could see it. He is a pretty nervous guy to begin with.




I bet he IS afraid of Mark and with dammmmed good reason.

[jcc]

And not just that. The fact that there was an excuse offered is so telling. The defense would like us to believe that it was just a coincidence that he was researching it for the pool while she was researching if for suicide....ridiculous!


Not to mention... it is completely inconsistent with the DEFENSE theory that it was JULIE doing all the internet searching. :rolleye0001: Duh! I guess that is just what you said. And ITA!