The Bishop's Papers

[awakening2lite]

80-year-old Texas polygamy cult member's 21 wives

May 7 2008 By Lachlan Mackinnon

A MEMBER of a religious cult in Texas has 21 wives - aged from 24 to 80 - and 36 children, it was revealed yesterday.

Polygamist Wendell Loy Neison, 67, is a member of a sect which allows multiple marriages.

His oldest child is 21 and his youngest just six months.

Wendell's amazing brood emerged after a court review of the so-called "Bishop's List" .

The list is a series of documents seized after a raid on the Yearning for Zion ranch in Eldorado.

It reveals the age, marital status, children and address of the members.

The ranch is owned by the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, a breakaway group from the Mormon Church.

The Bishop's List was found among nearly 1000 boxes of paperwork taken from the ranch by investigators.

They are considering child-abuse charges against some sect members.

Investigators, however, don't believe there is a "bishop" on the ranch.

Instead, they believe sect members take orders from convicted polygamist Warren Jeffs.

Jeffs is in prison for forcing a 14-year-old girl to marry her 19-year-old cousin.

He was convicted last year in Utah on two counts of being an accomplice to rape, charges related to the marriage.

Jeffs also faces trial in Arizona on charges of sexual conduct with a minor, incest and conspiracy.

Police think Jeffs still exerts control from prison through one of the men on the ranch, Merle Jessop.

One of Jessop's wives is a former sect member, Carolyn Jessop, who left a polygamist compound and later wrote a book about her experience.

Last week, sect lawyers argued against a court review of the documents.

They said the papers should remain private under US First Amendment rights to freedom of association.

Judge Barbara Walther disagreed, saying the documents must be examined to try to find possible medical records of the sect's children.

The Bishop's List also revealed other worrying details - such as the Jacob H. Johnson family file, which listed his 22-year-old wife and their infant daughter's address as a "house of hiding".

Investigators have not revealed where or what that might be.

Also, some sect members have refused to tell investigators - or claimed they don't know - how old they are.

In the Johnson family record, one wife is listed as "almost 28" while another is down as "almost 22".

The ages of wives and their children are critical to investigators, who believe underage girls were routinely married and forced to have sex with older men.

The next court hearing regarding the Texas state's custody of 463 sect children is set for later this month.

source: http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/2008/05/07/80-year-old-texas-polygamy-cult-member-s-21-wives-86908-20407935/


If the "Bishop's list" contains the names and ages of married woman/girls, then they should be able to map out the families and would clearly have evidence of underaged sex. IMO

[awakening2lite]

April 29, 2008
Dispatch from the FLDS hearing: The Bishop’s Records
Posted: 01:34 PM ET

Cheryl Getty
CNN Producer

An informal hearing was held in Judge Walther’s court room Monday regarding the search warrant and the length of time it is taking to go through the “Bishop’s records” obtained from the YFZ Ranch.

During the search of the ranch Texas Rangers took into evidence 45 computers, 6 or more laptops, and nearly 1,000 boxes of Bishop’s records.

The defense for FLDS is arguing that the majority of the Bishop records are confidential due to “spiritual” nature and membership concerns… And it is a violation of their clients’ first amendment rights to have the court viewing these documents.

The FLDS has an attorney reviewing the documents to state what is private. The court has an independent judge reviewing to confirm… Bob Switzer is the attorney viewing the docs.

Prosecutors want to know if there is any evidence for their case in these documents and if there is a genealogy chart amongst them. The judge wants the medical records for the children ASAP.

Here are my rough notes:

Attending:

1. Allison Palmer - Tom Green County Asst. DA
2. Cynthia Orr - criminal def attorney for FLDS
3. Gerald Goldstein - attorney for FLDS
4. Bob Switzer - attorney for FLDS - reviewing documents -
5. Dan Hurley - attorney for FLDS
6. John Fahle - attorney for FLDS

Goldstein: Much of what’s in those docs are sensitive… priest/parishioner documents are all privileged medical care - find those medical records.

Switzer: The problem I am having is on one document there might be two
sentences of privilege… that’s all… and I mark that out - it’s taking a lot of
time…there are boxes floor to ceiling, judge, I can’t go through them any
faster and I read 1100 words per minute…I am not slowing the process
down..

Goldstein: judge most of these docs are priv. and contain membership list -
it’s a violation of our clients’ first amendment rights to be viewing these
docs

Judge: the state has a compelling interest - some rights must give way for
the better interest for the child. Judge Francis is at the DPS facility and
will access the situation… allow her to review the situation and setup
guidelines for going thru records. She will be out there this week and we
can get another judge out there next week if necessary.

Switzer: I disagree - it’s going to take more than just another week…We
have some docs that are from Warren Jeff’s –a prophet.

Judge: No wait a minute. For communication to be made confidential it must
have been made private “everything Warren Jeffs says is spiritual advice?”

Swtizer: I’m saying it is possible - we have 45 computers, 6 or more
laptops and boxes it’s going to take two to three more weeks

Judge: one concern the court has is the medical records - one child was
already ill when taken into custody - I am having trouble thinking privilege
regarding medical records. From a practical point of view - children need medical care - find those medical records.

source: http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/04/29/dispatch-from-the-flds-hearing-the-bishops-records/

[GollyGeeWhiz]

The Bishop's list has been floating around for awhile - seems to me it was one of the first documents released to the public. It's a fascinating read, in a macabre sort of way.

I think it will prove very useful to the state as they attempt to pull together the names, ages and familial relationships of the FLDS group - especially since it is probably about as much truth as they'll get from those folks, seeing as how it was a report requested by the YFZ Bishop of his flock. I'm quite sure if they'd ever thought for a moment that it would fall into the hands of 'outsiders,' they would never have compiled it.

IIRC, much of the information attributed to 'media leaks' about underage 'marriages,' pregnancies and childbirth came from the Bishop's list.

[awakening2lite]

The Bishop's list has been floating around for awhile - seems to me it was one of the first documents released to the public. It's a fascinating read, in a macabre sort of way.

I think it will prove very useful to the state as they attempt to pull together the names, ages and familial relationships of the FLDS group - especially since it is probably about as much truth as they'll get from those folks, seeing as how it was a report requested by the YFZ Bishop of his flock. I'm quite sure if they'd ever thought for a moment that it would fall into the hands of 'outsiders,' they would never have compiled it.

IIRC, much of the information attributed to 'media leaks' about underage 'marriages,' pregnancies and childbirth came from the Bishop's list.

Do you have an information about the result of this:

Judge: the state has a compelling interest - some rights must give way for
the better interest for the child. Judge Francis is at the DPS facility and
will access the situation… allow her to review the situation and setup
guidelines for going thru records. She will be out there this week and we
can get another judge out there next week if necessary.

[GollyGeeWhiz]

Do you have an information about the result of this:

Judge: the state has a compelling interest - some rights must give way for
the better interest for the child. Judge Francis is at the DPS facility and
will access the situation… allow her to review the situation and setup
guidelines for going thru records. She will be out there this week and we
can get another judge out there next week if necessary.

I don't have any update on progress in getting through the records taken from the compound, no.

Not sure if you've seen the CPS response to the appellate court's decision to return the children to their 'alleged' mothers. Here's the link: http://web.gosanangelo.com/pdf/PetitionWritMandamus.pdf

It's 27 pages and a lot of it is legalese, but if you start at page 10 of the PDF and read the entire Statement of Facts (it's about 4-5 pages), you'll get a good idea of what sort of evidence/information the state is investigating.

[Tracian]

And who exactly gave this information to the media?

Please, this should be heard first in a court of law, not released to taint a jury pool.

[GollyGeeWhiz]

And who exactly gave this information to the media?

Please, this should be heard first in a court of law, not released to taint a jury pool.

It wasn't 'leaked.' It is one of several documents available here: http://gosanangelo.com/news/news/FLDS/. And elsewhere, I'm sure.

One man's tainting is another man's freedom of information.

[Walton]

http://gosanangelo.com/news/2008/may/02/bishops-record-lists-families-of-the-yfz-ranch/

The Bishop's Record, found in a safe on the YFZ Ranch, is a record of families whose fathers lived on the Schleicher County polygamist compound, according to court testimony last month.

The record, released Thursday by Tom Green County District Court, contains names, ages and locations for many of the men, women and children of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints living at the ranch.

Most of those listed are said to live at "R17," a code name for the YFZ Ranch.

"Short Creek" is a former name for the twin FLDS-controlled cities of Hildale, Utah, and Colorado City, Ariz.

The state of Texas introduced the document as part of its evidence during a child custody hearing involving the more than 400 FLDS children removed from the YFZ ranch as part of an investigation into a "pervasive pattern and practice" of forced "marriages" and sexual abuse.

[GollyGeeWhiz]

http://gosanangelo.com/news/2008/may/02/bishops-record-lists-families-of-the-yfz-ranch/

The Bishop's Record, found in a safe on the YFZ Ranch, is a record of families whose fathers lived on the Schleicher County polygamist compound, according to court testimony last month.

The record, released Thursday by Tom Green County District Court, contains names, ages and locations for many of the men, women and children of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints living at the ranch.

Most of those listed are said to live at "R17," a code name for the YFZ Ranch.

"Short Creek" is a former name for the twin FLDS-controlled cities of Hildale, Utah, and Colorado City, Ariz.

The state of Texas introduced the document as part of its evidence during a child custody hearing involving the more than 400 FLDS children removed from the YFZ ranch as part of an investigation into a "pervasive pattern and practice" of forced "marriages" and sexual abuse.

Thanks, Walton. That's what I meant to say ... :girl_haha:

[Tracian]

It wasn't 'leaked.' It is one of several documents available here: http://gosanangelo.com/news/news/FLDS/. And elsewhere, I'm sure.

One man's tainting is another man's freedom of information.


Okay, say that next time an innocent person is convicted because of freedom of information.

This is an on going case, not like JFK that is done and over with, this will taint a jury pool, and that is wrong.

Duke University comes to mind...but hey that is all about freedom of information.

Sorry, I don't buy this 'freedom of information' when there is an on going investigation, as in the 'Duke case' fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

Does anyone here believe that these parents deserve a fair trial? Or do you think that this misuse of the media is just part of the 'game'?

The game is win at all costs....We should do away with juries, let the media pick and choose who is guilty and who is not...

Sorry, that is not the American justice system I hope that exists in this country.

And frankly, no one else should be comfortable with that either.

[Walton]

Okay, say that next time an innocent person is convicted because of freedom of information.

This is an on going case, not like JFK that is done and over with, this will taint a jury pool, and that is wrong.

Duke University comes to mind...but hey that is all about freedom of information.

Sorry, I don't buy this 'freedom of information' when there is an on going investigation, as in the 'Duke case' fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

Does anyone here believe that these parents deserve a fair trial? Or do you think that this misuse of the media is just part of the 'game'?

The game is win at all costs....We should do away with juries, let the media pick and choose who is guilty and who is not...

Sorry, that is not the American justice system I hope that exists in this country.

And frankly, no one else should be comfortable with that either.

I believe they should get a fair trial. I also believe that is what they are getting. jmo

Misuse of the media? Misuse?

Misuse of the media would be nothing allowed by the media. Utah has done it for years. Hush Hush. Turn the other way. They've tried to bury it for 80 years and more before that. jmo (If ya want links, I can get them but for now it is jmo.)


Long time past due I'd say.


Thank goodness for all those writers and reporters that have had the guts to print these stories. Thank goodness for those that have taken the time to listen and go forward. I for one am very grateful for the media and message boards like this. And you know what I am even grateful for the chance to see other peoples opinions even if they might differ with mine.

[Walton]

Thanks, Walton. That's what I meant to say ... :girl_haha:

I thought so.

The little huggy guy right back atcha. :)

[GollyGeeWhiz]

Okay, say that next time an innocent person is convicted because of freedom of information.

This is an on going case, not like JFK that is done and over with, this will taint a jury pool, and that is wrong.

Duke University comes to mind...but hey that is all about freedom of information.

Sorry, I don't buy this 'freedom of information' when there is an on going investigation, as in the 'Duke case' fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

Does anyone here believe that these parents deserve a fair trial? Or do you think that this misuse of the media is just part of the 'game'?

The game is win at all costs....We should do away with juries, let the media pick and choose who is guilty and who is not...

Sorry, that is not the American justice system I hope that exists in this country.

And frankly, no one else should be comfortable with that either.

What I am most uncomfortable with is what has happened to the children of the FLDS for far too long.

I do not want, nor do I expect the American justice system to protect me while I abuse children or limit their ability to make their own choices and live their own lives.

[awakening2lite]

Okay, say that next time an innocent person is convicted because of freedom of information.

This is an on going case, not like JFK that is done and over with, this will taint a jury pool, and that is wrong.

Duke University comes to mind...but hey that is all about freedom of information.

Sorry, I don't buy this 'freedom of information' when there is an on going investigation, as in the 'Duke case' fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

Does anyone here believe that these parents deserve a fair trial? Or do you think that this misuse of the media is just part of the 'game'?

The game is win at all costs....We should do away with juries, let the media pick and choose who is guilty and who is not...

Sorry, that is not the American justice system I hope that exists in this country.

And frankly, no one else should be comfortable with that either.

I like open courtrooms and freedom of the press. Those are the two most important rights that go straight to the heart of the freedoms people fought for and died for so that we can enjoy them in America.

Truth should be able to stand up to scrutiny.

[Jute]

The Bishop's list has been floating around for awhile - seems to me it was one of the first documents released to the public. It's a fascinating read, in a macabre sort of way.

I think it will prove very useful to the state as they attempt to pull together the names, ages and familial relationships of the FLDS group - especially since it is probably about as much truth as they'll get from those folks, seeing as how it was a report requested by the YFZ Bishop of his flock. I'm quite sure if they'd ever thought for a moment that it would fall into the hands of 'outsiders,' they would never have compiled it.

IIRC, much of the information attributed to 'media leaks' about underage 'marriages,' pregnancies and childbirth came from the Bishop's list.

The general public weren't the only ones surprised when the Bishop's list was released. I recall reading an article about another FLDS group, Colorado City I think, that was a bit shaken up by the news of what was going on in Texas-and surprised to read that Nielson had 21 wives in Texas in addition to the ones he had there. They don't even know what is going on in different locations of their own group.

I don't know if I can find the article, but I'll look around.

[Jute]

80-year-old Texas polygamy cult member's 21 wives

May 7 2008 By Lachlan Mackinnon

A MEMBER of a religious cult in Texas has 21 wives - aged from 24 to 80 - and 36 children, it was revealed yesterday.

Polygamist Wendell Loy Neison, 67, is a member of a sect which allows multiple marriages.

His oldest child is 21 and his youngest just six months.

Wendell's amazing brood emerged after a court review of the so-called [B]"Bishop's List" .

-snip-

COLORADO CITY, Ariz. — As the supper dishes were being cleared away and the rice pudding brought out for dessert, Marvin Wyler’s two wives, along with some of their children and a group of friends, began poring over the list.

The 44-page document, from a court in Texas, gives a glimpse of who is married to whom in the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, or F.L.D.S. — and in the hothouse world of religious polygamy, a list like that is a sort of Rosetta Stone to the usually hidden relationships of power, politics and piety.

“We are adding up the number of men who may be going to prison,” said Isaac Wyler, 42, the eldest of Mr. Wyler’s 34 children, who was examining the list on Sunday to see which men may have had wives under the legal age when they married.

Scenes like this have played out in recent days in polygamist communities on the Arizona-Utah border as the marriage list and other records, seized last month from the polygamist sect in Eldorado, Tex., along with 462 children in an investigation of possible under-age brides, have filtered west.

The information has families like the Wylers talking about some of polygamy’s best-kept secrets. Who would have guessed, for instance, that Wendell Nielsen, a high-ranking sect official with family here, had 21 wives in Texas, too? Or that he has 35 children on top of those here?

-snip-
The relationship between the sect’s core settlement here and its outpost in Texas called the Yearning for Zion ranch, was complex. Families sent to Texas by the sect’s leadership were favored and said to have been identified by revelation to the leadership from God.

“They were just gradually moving down there as things got ready, but they took the most elite and most chosen first,” said Shannon Price, the director of a group called the Diversity Foundation that works to help people leaving the fundamentalist groups.

Now there is a question, Ms. Price and others said, about who might be coming back from Texas — and whether it might include a few men who do not want to be found by the police.
-snip-
The Wylers here in Colorado City were also particularly astounded to learn that Mr. Nielsen, the high-ranking sect official who everyone at the dinner table believed kept his wives and children in Arizona, had another family cluster in Texas.

According to the records, Mr. Nielsen, who was 67 in August 2007 when his “family information sheet” was completed, had 21 wives, ranging in age from 24 to 79, and 35 children, ranging in age from 6 months to 23, who were living at the Zion ranch until the raid.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/08/us/08raid.html?pagewanted=1&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

[grammybears]

I suspect there is going to be a lot of information coming out that will shock a lot of us. I also think that this whole situation is going to be a long drawn out process. The appeals court did rule about some of the children being given back to the parents but I do not think this over as yet. They still need to finish up the DNA and especially with the 124 children who they cannot find a genetic link to parents as yet. I am also confident that the state has more information about this raid that none of us know about. I think it is bad for even one under age girl to not only be pregnent but have children. I am sure we are going to find out about other abuses and issues going on.
Many of the FLDS here in Utah and Arizona may not even know about some of the so called marriages.
I can well imagine since we have not heard hardly a word from some of the fathers that they are long gone. Hopefully someday they will be caught.
The abuses over the years have gone unchecked by the authorities and I remember in some cases where if the women or girls ran away they were just taken back to this group.
I am sure we are going to hear of more hearings and appeals in the next few months. Whatever the situation is is what it is and it will all have to sorted out.

Also, I really believe that with the drastic steps that Texas has taken, that every other state will be watching what is going to happen and if there are FLDS in any other state the authorities will learn from what is going on in Texas and learn from it and hopefully will not have the problems that we are seeing now.

I for one cannot even imagine how to deal with 464 children. Some days my three girls were a handful. I have a sister in law that has 13 children, no they are not FLDS, and they are the most obedient children I have ever seen. They all do very well in school, they do their chores at home and know very well what is expected of them. My sil home schooled them till they got to junior high and had no problem integrating with the other students.

I do not think there is an easy answer for this case in Texas. I am sure once they figure out which kids belong to what parents then they can work out a plan for each family. But just giving all the kids back and letting them go back to the compound is not the answer.
Someone had mentioned that if Jeffs hadn't lowered the marriage age, this group could have gone on forever with no outside interference. But I guess when a person has absolute control and believes they are above the law is when there is a downfall.

The mainstream society now is more aware of what goes on with this group and for every case of a young girl being forced into a marriage to having babies should outrage the country and demand that someone do something to stop this insanity. For too long this issue has gone unnoticed or ignored. I believe there are a lot of people in our society that say this is not my problem, so why should I get involved. Well it is our tax dollars that are supporting these groups, and the abuse of the women and children need to be addressed and put to a stop or we are going to have another generation of what is going on now or maybe even worse.

jmoo

[awakening2lite]

I hoping the list will open the door to investigate the whereabouts of boys who are rumored to have been driven away/banished during their teen years.