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NANCY GRACE

Police Search Abandoned Car of Missing Toddler`s Mother

Aired July 18, 2008 - 20:00:00 ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, GUEST HOST: Tonight, breaking developments in the search for a beautiful little 2-year-old girl named Caylee Marie Anthony. Police are notified of Caylee`s disappearance after her grandparents report her missing. In the last hours, crime scene technicians now stop digging in the grandparents` back yard. The question is why. An investigator seized electronic equipment from the Anthony home. What are they looking for? And the most important question, where is little Caylee.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The search for a 2-year-old girl has taken a grim turn. Investigators have been digging in the family`s back yard after getting a tip from a neighbor. Police learn that Casey Anthony borrowed a shovel from a neighbor about a month ago, around the time her daughter, Caylee, disappeared. It was weeks before Anthony acknowledged to anyone that her little girl was missing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Casey gave me an explanation where she was, and it was very believable. And I had no reason to ever doubt my daughter. The only thing that raised a red flag to me is the fact that Casey could not tell me where she was at.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And now a possible new lead in the investigation. A Florida TV station is reporting that police are focusing on the car allegedly driven by Casey Anthony, after noticing a strong smell coming from the vehicle.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

<snip>

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Good evening. I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell, in for Nancy Grace. Thanks for being with us tonight. The question: Where is adorable little Caylee Anthony? In fact, that`s the question the entire nation is asking tonight. The missing toddler`s 22-year-old mom sits behind bars, where she is set to undergo a mental evaluation, that after authorities say she told them a pack of lies about the circumstances surrounding her daughter`s disappearance more than a month ago.

Casey Anthony, the young mom, and her 2-year-old child, Caylee, had been living with Casey`s parents until June 9. That`s when she decides, I`m going to take off with the toddler in tow. After several weeks, Casey`s mom demands to see her grandchild, and when her daughter refused to produce her, called authorities. Now an ominous tern as police with cadaver dogs search for that child.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Police are searching the back yard of a woman`s home near Orlando, trying to find her 2-year-old granddaughter. Now, they don`t know whether there`s any evidence about the girl`s disappearance in this yard, but a neighbor says the child`s mother borrowed a shovel about a month ago. Apparently, that is around the that time Caylee Marie Anthony disappeared.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We did have somebody call to tell us that a shovel was borrowed on a day that -- in close proximity to the child being missing. So we thought that this would be a good place to look.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Investigators say that Casey has told them lie after lie. Her story was that she dropped off Caylee, the little girl, on June 9 at a friend`s house, Zenaida Gonzalez, but investigator haven`t been able to find this Zenaida Gonzalez her or know if she even exists.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: WFTV in Orlando is reporting that police have begun to search the car allegedly driven by Casey Anthony, which reports say had a foul smell emanating from it.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Caylee is missing, and that`s the word that I want to get out to everybody. This little girl needs to be found. So instead of thinking that she`s already dead, there`s no answer yet, and we have to find that answer.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So the big question remains, where is Caylee, and is she dead or alive? For the very latest, let`s go straight out to Kendra Oestreich. Kendra, you`re outside the grandmother`s home. What is the very latest there?

KENDRA OESTREICH, WESH 2 NEWS: Well, Jane, investigators have focused much of their investigation the last two days here on the grandparents` home, spending five hours last night with cadaver dogs, searching the back yard, another five hours out here again with dogs, digging in the back yard. But right now, investigators say there is no sign of Caylee back here and have called off this search here at the home. But they`re still really searching for Caylee tonight.

Now, the reason that they came out to look here at the grandparents` home, first of all, Caylee and Casey used to live here together until they left about a month ago to spend some time at a friend`s house, is what she told the grandparents. The reason that they were out here digging in the back yard, the next-door neighbor called investigators when the search for Caylee began, saying that Casey, the mother, came next door and borrowed a shovel from the neighbor and apparently was digging in the back yard, was home alone at the time.

But the grandparents say there`s a logical explanation for this. Apparently, they grow bamboo shoots in the back yard, and they say those shoots hurt little Caylee`s feet when she stepped on them. They keep the shovels locked up here at the house as a method of child-proofing the home, and that`s why the mother went next door to get that shovel. They say they stand behind their daughter. They believe that she had nothing to do with this little girl`s disappearance, and they truly believe that tonight Caylee is still alive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, Kendra, a very good explanation there of the shovel. We all got chills when we heard that she borrowed the shovel. Now the grandma saying, Hey, there`s an innocent explanation. And we do have to stress that this young mom deserves the presumption of innocence. She is not considered a suspect or a person of interest at this time, although she faces three charges, including child neglect, false official statements and obstruction of the investigation. But again, we are in the early stage of this investigation, and she deserves the presumption of innocence.

I want to go to Rory O`Neill, a reporter for Metro Networks, and talk about another possibly ominous development, and that involves the abandoned car and reports that a stench was observed or smelled inside that car. Tell us all about that.

RORY O`NEILL, METRO NETWORKS: Well, Jane, yes, it is the car that Casey would use. It did belong to her parents, the grandparents, the same home where the search has just concluded. And the detectives found the car. It had been abandoned not too far from this house, and it was actually towed by the owner of the business there because it had been sitting abandoned in this parking lot for several days. They had it towed, and then they found out who it belonged to, tracked it down, and realized there was this stench inside.

Now, the car has already been gone through, at least in preliminary terms, so we know that the young girl, luckily, is not in there. But it is something that they`re trying to get a hold of and get their heads around, figure out what that smell is.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: We have Casey Anthony`s attorney, Jose Baez, with us tonight. We`re going to get to him in a second. But one other aspect of this case -- and I want to go back out to Kendra Oestreich -- that is so bizarre are the boyfriends. According to the arrest affidavit, Casey was allegedly living with this boyfriend after June 9, the last time anybody else saw the baby, except for a couple of days later, when a friend says she saw the baby maybe the 12th, 13th or 14th. But he says that Casey never told him that this child was missing, that basically, she`s living with him and saying, Well, the kid`s with the nanny?

OESTREICH: That`s right. She said -- or he told investigators that it seemed to be a logical explanation, where she would tell him that the little girl was with the nanny, maybe at a theme park, the beach, visiting Universal Studios or Disney World. And so he didn`t ever think that there was anything was wrong because she always seemed to have an explanation as where -- where Caylee was.

Now, I mean, it`s just one of the stories that may be being told by this mother here, the main question being, Where is Caylee? But in her arrest affidavit, as you brought up, there are so many lies, investigators say. They went to the apartment. Apparently, no one has been living there. Casey, the mom, took them to Universal, saying, I work there. Come to find out she had been fired back in 2006. They don`t know if this nanny even exists. They talked to a woman named Zenaida Gonzalez. She says she doesn`t know Casey, she doesn`t know Caylee.

And a new turn of events today, her attorney is coming out, saying investigators need to be looking across the country in other areas of Florida for this little girl because of the babysitter in this case apparently has ties and connections to other locations, other cities...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, let me jump in here because we have that attorney with us tonight, Jose Baez, the attorney for this young mom, Casey Anthony. Thank you for joining us, sir. You heard this reporter, Kendra Oestreich, very eloquently outline a list of lies, a pack of lies investigators say your client told them. What`s your explanation for all these discrepancies? I mean, she literally took them to a theme park and then finally admitted, I don`t work here, after walking them around for several minutes.

JOSE BAEZ, ATTORNEY FOR MOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: Well, actually -- thank you, Jane, for having me. I can honestly say that, first off, I haven`t been turned over any type of conversations or discussions that she`s had with police, but I can honestly tell you that in this business, you can`t believe everything you read in a police report. Otherwise everyone...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, the boyfriend says -- the boyfriend says she was living with him and she never told him that her baby was missing. Meantime, she has reportedly told police that she was doing her own investigation into the disappearance of her daughter and that`s why she didn`t call the cops. You`d think she`d tell the boyfriend she was living with.

BAEZ: Well, I can tell you that, based on my conversations with my client, what we ended up discovering, based on these conversations, was that there`s actually a very reasonable explanation for this whole delay in reporting the incident...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to hear that.

BAEZ: ... or the kidnapping.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to hear that reasonable explanation.

BAEZ: Unfortunately, she is under criminal charges at this time. I cannot disclose any of the specific discussions that I`ve had with my client that would possibly lead to a defense. The prosecution nor the police are not telling me everything they know, and I certainly don`t think that as -- launching a proper defense would be disclosing every single thing that we know.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Well, listen, I think that all of America has questions for you. So fasten your seatbelt, Jose Baez, the attorney for this young mom.

The calls are lighting up. Let`s start with Edward from Texas. Your question, sir?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. I have two quick questions. One, is the girl on drugs? Did they give her drug tests? And B, where`s the father of the baby in all of this?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Excellent questions. Jose Baez, your answer, sir?

BAEZ: The -- there`s no evidence of any prior drug use. I don`t think the police have uncovered any type of drug use in this case. And I`ve spoken with friends and family members of her. There doesn`t appear to be any type of past history of drug abuse. And as far as the father is concerned, unfortunately, the father is deceased. He died approximately a year ago in a car crash.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Well, I have to bring in Jeff Gardere, psychologist and author of "Love Prescription." We need a shrink on this one, Jeff. It seems to be sort of a portrait of two different people. The mother of Casey is saying she was a loving mother. She`s a 22-year-old mom, had this child when she was a teenager but was a loving mother, no history, no criminal history for this young lady that we can find. And yet her friends claim in the arrest affidavit that she was a habitual liar. They allege she stole checks and money from them. So we`re getting this sort of wildly different portrait from -- depending on who you talk to.

JEFF GARDERE, PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, this is a very complex young woman, from what we`re finding out. I`m really shocked that there doesn`t seem to be any tears coming from her. We saw her being -- in this film clip right here, walking through court, I guess, being arraigned. And here she is, not crying. She looks like she`s absolutely fine. I would think any mom whose child was missing would be distraught at this point.

But what we do know about this young lady is that, I think, her mother must be in some sort of a denial, if the friends are saying that she has been a habitual liar, there has been issues with checks. So what is going on? Yes, she could be a good mom, but there are a lot of other personality issues that need to be addressed.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, before we get to the attorneys to talk about the mother, I want to show everybody a slo-mo or a tight shot of the expression of Casey as she is led through doors, and she is under arrest and she appears to see that, wow, the cameras are there, recording her every move.

Jeff, it appears to be -- correct me if I`m wrong -- kind of like she`s trying to repress a smile. Or is that a misinterpretation?

GARDERE: No, I think that`s -- that can be a very accurate interpretation. It could be that she`s in shock, for one. Or it could be that she doesn`t know how to react at this point because this is such a strange situation that she`s in. Or it could be that she is in total disconnect from what`s happening with her daughter or what may have happened to her daughter. But this is something that is quite strange. The behavior is strange.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Absolutely. Let`s bring in the lawyers, Holly Hughes, former prosecutor, and Alan Ripka, defense attorney. You know, you have to say the grandmother, the mother of Casey and the grandmother of this little missing toddler, is the hero in all of this because she`s the one who went to authorities and called police in, knowing, of course, that it could very well have gotten her child in trouble. And yet you hear, well, she`s in denial because she`s defending her daughter. Certainly, that`s something, Alan Ripka, that is natural for her to do, right?

ALAN RIPKA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, It may be natural for her to do, but she`s defending her daughter because she`s watched her behavior over the last couple years, when she saw her raise her daughter. And there`s no evidence to show that her daughter has done anything, including the back yard digging, where they found nothing, including the call (ph), where there`s no forensic evidence. And there`s no history of abuse of this child or calls to the police for abuse. And the mother or the grandmother in this case would have called the police if there was abuse, like she called the police here. So now we have nothing against this girl, but she`s being prosecuted like she did it.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Holly Hughes, how long can they keep her in jail on these three charges, the neglect, the obstruction of justice and the lying to investigators, if they don`t file more serious charges?

HOLLY HUGHES, FORMER PROSECUTOR: What they`re going to have to do, Jane, is file their charges against her. They haven`t actually formally done this yet. They need to go ahead and get her accused or indicted within about 30 days. She can be held, actually, until trial if a judge finds during a bond hearing that she runs the risk of either committing another felony, interfering with witnesses or several other factors. And obviously, they found one of those exists because they haven`t let her out on bond yet.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This little girl is our entire life, and I still believe she`s alive because I do not believe that my daughter did any harm to her child. My daughter has been nothing but a loving mother, and I have seen that for the last three years.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Orange County investigators are searching the home of Cindy and George Anthony here in Orange County, Florida. They brought in a couple shovels and they are digging in the back yard. They brought in two large shovels, two smaller shovels. Neighbors in this area apparently told investigators that they saw Casey, the little girl`s mother, here recently alone when her parents, the grandparents in this case, were not here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell, in for Nancy Grace. Investigators desperately searching for missing Florida toddler Caylee Anthony say they have had to unravel an ornate series of lies allegedly told by the young mother of that young toddler. That mom in jail tonight, not considered a suspect in her daughter`s disappearance, but facing charges of lying to investigators and obstructing their investigation.

I want to go back to that mother`s attorney, Jose Baez. Her mother, the grandmother of the missing toddler, says her gut feeling is that this child is alive. What do you think? Is little Caylee alive?

BAEZ: Well, we all believe she`s alive. And in fact, what we`re trying to do with the media is we`re trying to get them to concentrate not necessarily on Casey but on Caylee and on the search for Caylee.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to jump in.

(CROSSTALK)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want you to say it again. Say it again because I think that was very big news. Do you think little Caylee is dead or alive? Can you answer it again?

BAEZ: We believe she`s alive. We believe she`s alive.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: You do believe she`s alive?

BAEZ: Absolutely. Absolutely.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: OK.

BAEZ: And we`re trying to get everybody to focus on the search, rather than on the prosecution of Casey, and that`s exactly what`s going on here. The police are talking about basically searching -- they spent five hours last night and five hours today searching in the back yard. It`s a very small back yard. The neighbors said that they borrowed the shovel -- that she borrowed the shovel for less than an hour. This young lady is 105 pounds, for crying out loud. Anyone would have been able to see, in that small back yard, if there was something dug up...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So who took the child?

BAEZ: ... especially over a month old...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Who took the child, Jose? Because the woman she said she left her with doesn`t know Casey.

BAEZ: Well, actually, that`s some misinformation that`s being laid out. The person that the police spoke with was someone who has absolutely nothing to do with this case, and it is not the Zenaida Gonzalez that my client said was the baby-sitter in this case.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Anybody that looks at this little girl will fall madly in love with her. There`s no -- no way that anybody would not want to have her around because you just -- when you`re around her, all you feel is her magic.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We spent the first day of the investigation with the mother prior to her arrest. We talked to her for a couple of hours. The initial information that she gave us, we followed up on. And of course, a lot of what she told us when we first began talking to her turned out to be false information. Since her arrest, we have not had any contact with her.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell, in for Nancy Grace. The phone lines are lighting up on this missing toddler case out of Florida. Let`s go to Evelyn in Minnesota. Your question, ma`am.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. Since Mom is a habitual liar and the parents are in denial, who`s to say drug use isn`t the culprit? And can the courts force her to take a drug test?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. Well, let`s go to the lawyers. Holly Hughes, former prosecutor?

HUGHES: They can`t force her to take a drug test. And at this point, Jane, it`s too late because what they`ve done is, they`ve had her in custody and they didn`t take the blood right away. They could have gotten a search warrant. You can`t just force her to do it. You have to have probable cause, go to the judge, get him to sign off on the search warrant for her blood, and then they could test it. At this point, it`s been a couple of days. It`s going to be too late to be able to tell if she`s an habitual user, if she used in the past, unless they were to snip hair or something and go back and look at the usage that might show up in the hair follicles.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All very good questions. We don`t have the answers.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CINDY ANTHONY, MISSING 2-YR-OLD GIRL`S GRANDMOTHER: Caylee wasn`t with her like she had told me she was with her for the last month. Then, you know, I asked her, well, let`s go get her because I miss her, I want to go see her. I want to bring her home so she can sleep in her bed.

And when she told me tat, you know, it was too late to go because she`s already sleeping at the babysitter`s house and, you know, why disrupt her because -- you know wake her up and then have to bring her home and then she`ll be up all night. Let`s pick her up in the morning.

I said, no, I`m selfish, I want to see my granddaughter, I haven`t seen her in a month. And I guess a little bit of tone in Casey`s voice -- you know, mom, you know, she was pretty persistent and insistent. Then I got a gut feeling that -- I just knew something was wrong. So I told her that I was going to call the sheriff`s department.

By the time they got there, she had told us that Caylee had been kidnapped.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, GUEST HOST: I`m Jane Velez-Mitchell in for Nancy Grace.

Who knows the truth about what happened to little Caylee Anthony, an adorable Florida toddler missing for more than a month. Her young mom in jail tonight after failing to call police to report her daughter missing. The mom claimed she conducted her own investigation instead, something that is raising a lot of eyebrows.

We are delighted to have with us tonight Erin Runnion, a very courageous mother who tragically lost her own daughter to murder.

I covered that story years ago as a reporter and she is now a leader of the Joyful Child Foundation.

Erin, thank you so much for joining us tonight.

ERIN RUNNION, MOTHER OF MURDER VICTIM SAMANTHA RUNNION: Thank you for having me.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: What do you make of this case, because I know that statistically time is of the essence when it comes to missing children?

RUNNION: It is. And I`m just -- I`m so frustrated given that it`s been five weeks. I mean, that is -- it`s just unheard of to have a parent who refuses to cooperate with the police.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, of course, we all look at the options. And we have to reiterate that this woman, this young mother, is not a suspect. She is not a person of interest in her child`s disappearance, although police say that she did lie to them.

But here are the possibilities. I mean, just speaking logically. Let`s hope, number one is not true, that this child was murdered. God hope that that`s not the case.

RUNNION: Absolutely.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: But perhaps she was given away and is safe. Perhaps she`s given away and is not safe. Perhaps she was sold. Perhaps she was lost. And perhaps she was accidentally killed followed by a cover-up.

What are your thoughts given those possibilities?

RUNNION: Well, I think any of them are possible. I mean, you know, part of my challenge is I`ve been so focused on addressing child exploitation issues and recognizing that, you know, the Internet Crimes Against Children task forces are battling to try and ensure that we`re investigating and prosecuting child pornography, which is driven by new victims.

And I just -- I`m horrified. I`m just horrified that Caylee is in danger and I want her photo everywhere and I want people to be looking for her and I want law enforcement to have the resources to investigate these cases and rescue these kids who get trapped in that kind of trafficking.

You know, and that`s why I -- not just with the Joyful Child Foundation but with the Surviving Parents Coalition, I`ve been advocating for Senate Bill 1738 , the Combating Child Exploitation Act to do just that.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So, Erin, you`re.

RUNNION: We`re heading to Washington next week to do that.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, I hope you`re successfully, but you`re essentially saying possibly she could be involved in some kind of ring abduction that exploits children in some horrifying way.

Let`s hope not but...

RUNNION: And I`m very concerned that this young mother has no concept of the danger that her daughter could be faced. If she gave her away, if she put her in the hands of somebody that she`s afraid to let law enforcement know about for any number of reasons, that it just -- it points to danger for Caylee.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I`d like to bring in Donald Schweitzer, who`s a former detective with Santa Ana PD. This is what doesn`t make sense to me. There are a lot of young mothers -- this woman had her child when she was a teenager -- who don`t want the responsibility. They chaffed at all the obligations and they leave the child with the grandparents and they split.

In this case, this young woman took the toddler with her. So it`s not like she was really trying to escape the responsibility of having a child, because it would have made sense if she had just left the child with her grandmother -- with the grandmother.

DONALD SCHWEITZER, FMR. DETECTIVE SANTA ANA P.D.: Yes, Jane, there`s a lot of things that don`t make sense in this case. The first thing you got to think about is that she didn`t report this for a month. The second thing is when she`s questioned by the police she makes about 10 different lies that lead the police to the opposite direction.

And, finally, right now, she could be helping the police. She doesn`t have to have that attorney saying that she can`t speak because of her Fifth Amendment right. If she wants to fight this child, and we want to find her very badly, she can cooperate right now.

She doesn`t have to hide behind her Fifth Amendment right and the fact that she`s charged with some -- you know, some crimes out there. It`s better that she go to prison for, you know, one year rather than letting her child be at harm`s way. And that`s why I think that there`s something that`s really wrong in this case.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Something is fishy in Denmark. Jose Baez, Casey Anthony`s attorney, your response to that criticism.

JOSE BAEZ, ATTORNEY FOR MISSING GIRL`S MOM: Well, let me tell you. We have opened the line of communication with law enforcement.

What happened in this case was law enforcement basically jumped the gun. Nobody heard about this -- about Caylee`s disappearance until after she was arrested. And I think that was a big blunder on police`s part by arresting her, thereby cutting off any type of communication where you`re going to violate someone`s rights.

What should have been done is they should have allowed her to stay free, maybe perhaps watch her a little bit longer, see if there`s any activity, where she goes, what she`s doing, who she`s talking with. And in addition to that, she doesn`t have to go through a lawyer.

But what they did was they arrested her.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right, let`s allow Donald to respond on that because he`s a former detective.

Should they have let her just roam around while they followed her?

SCHWEITZER: Yes, you can still help the police, sir. You don`t have to have her hide behind her Fifth Amendment right. This is a child that`s missing, for god`s sake. Do whatever you can to help her. Get this little -- get your client to start talking to the police rather than hiding behind you. There`s no need for that.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right.

BAEZ: Well, first of all, I don`t think you really know what you`re talking about because we are the ones who actually spoke out to the police. We`ve asked for the police to come and give us access to a -- sketch artist where she can actually describe the babysitter and actually go out and put some type of leads out there.

But that`s not what`s happening. Police hasn`t contacted us to specifically ask her any questions or to show.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: But, Jose, she lied about where she dropped the child off. Authorities determined that the house where she said she left the child with this mysterious babysitter was -- that apartment was unoccupied for something like 142 days, since February 28th. So she`s lying about key components of the story.

BAEZ: Some of the representations that were made to the police are -- there`s actually a very reasonable explanation for that. But unfortunately, due to the fact that she`s facing criminal charges, I can`t allow her to specifically lay out her entire defense and to.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right. I hear what you`re saying.

Beth in North Carolina, your question. Want to get that in.

BETH, NORTH CAROLINA RESIDENT: Yes, as a grandparent, I cannot understand how a grandmother that is so close to her grandchild could allow 30 days to go by without laying eyes on or hands on this precious child. And if she was so close to her daughter, why can she not convince the daughter that she needs to tell her?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right, Kendra Oestreich, your explanation from what you know about this case.

KENDRA OESTREICH, REPORTER, WESH: I can tell you that investigators right now are frustrated with Mr. Baez as well as Casey. Apparently the attorney has come forward telling media these investigators need to be looking at other cities and other places for this little girl.

However, they`re telling me that he has not gone to them, allowing them to question and talk to Casey again or telling them directly this information. So they, on the other hand, are frustrated, feeling it`s not a two-way street when it comes to communication.

They`re going to be handing out flyers tomorrow.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: All right, we got to jump in right there.

OESTREICH: . in this neighborhood to find this little girl.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: We hope this child is found.

When we come back, a mother of two found murdered at a construction site near her North Carolina home. Nancy Cooper`s husband tells cops she went out for jogging, never came back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWSBREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: (INAUDIBLE) for a North Carolina mother found dead near her home. No suspects have been named in Nancy Cooper`s death but her parents are asking the killer to speak up if the person has, quote, "any shred of decency."

Cooper`s husband told police his wife went jogging Saturday and never came back. But her body was found Monday at a construction site less than three miles from her home in a Raleigh suburb.

And Cooper`s family has been granted temporary custody of her two young daughters. Cooper`s parents claim their son-in-law is emotionally unstable, was having an affair, and poses a danger to the children.

Now her husband Bradley Cooper`s attorneys say he is distraught by his wife`s death and will continue to assist police.

(END VIDEOTAPE)
<Snip>

[ReddCurrlz]

NANCY GRACE

Man Threatens to Jump From Senate Building/Caylee`s Grandmother Says Jailed Mom Knows Where She Is

Aired July 21, 2008 - 20:00:00 ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Police desperately searching for a beautiful 2-year-old little Florida girl after grandparents report her missing. It`s a story that has become more and more convoluted. We now learn Caylee hasn`t been seen in five long weeks, last seen with her mother. So why, why didn`t Mommy call police? Breaking developments as we go to air. Where is 2-year-old Caylee?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The 2-year-old girl missing for a month before her mother reports it. Now Mom`s in jail, and grandma says her daughter knows who has Caylee. So why doesn`t she tell the cops?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think that it`s someone very close to Casey that she`s known for a period of time. At least three or four years she`s known this person and has trusted Caylee with this person in the past. I think Casey has been betrayed. This person that, you know, thinks that they`re doing the right thing by, you know, taking Caylee, that they`re not doing the right thing because Caylee is confused. Caylee is scared.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: OK, that doesn`t even make any sense.
<snip>

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Investigators focus their attention on this parking lot at East Colonial Drive and Goldenrod Road. Deputies say Caylee`s mother, Casey, abandoned her white 1998 Pontiac, much like this one, in the parking lot. Eyewitness News has learned there might have been evidence indicating there was a body in the car, a stench.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: The story becomes more and more convoluted by the minute. And as we go to air, we learn a significant development in the story, the search for little 2-year-old Caylee. Take a look at this little girl. Who would want to hurt this little angel? Look at her. She is precious.

We now learn the grandmother, who has been with us, was with us last week, has been all over the media in her efforts to try to find her little granddaughter, is now saying she`s ready to forgive her daughter for whatever she did wrong.

Out to Rory O`Neill with Metro Networks. What`s happening?

RORY O`NEILL, METRO NETWORKS: Well, as of today, the police have spent today really regrouping because over the weekend, they gave up on the dig in the back yard of the family home, perhaps looking for evidence. So today was a bunch of old-fashioned police work and going back and looking at all the phone calls, the clues that have developed with the tip line over the past week, really, and trying to find out where Caylee is.

GRACE: Well, Rory, it`s my understanding that the mom, who I thought, according to the grandmother, took the little girl to go bonding (ph) -- she was living there with her mother. She`s been gone for about five weeks or so, with the little girl, her daughter, and then the grandmother says, Where`s Caylee? Now, here`s the mom. She`s being held right now behind bars. It`s my understanding, Rory, she refuses to name who has the little girl?

O`NEILL: She has bee -- she`s had no conversations with police since her arrest. And this is really one of the things that her attorney is most upset about. He wants -- because the charges have been filed, he says any statements could be used against her, so now he has offered police to act as the go-between between his client and the police so that they can find...

GRACE: Well, you know what...

O`NEILL: ... better description...

GRACE: That`s really funny. Out to the lawyers. We`re talking your calls live. To Anne Bremner, high-profile lawyer out of the Seattle jurisdiction, and Doug Burns, the veteran defense attorney out of New York. To you Anne Bremner. Why does she need a go-between? Why can`t she just tell police where the little girl is?

ANNE BREMNER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Nancy, it`s a long way from a lie to life in prison, and anything she says to the police can be used against her and she`s smart to have a go-between. If they really want to look for this little girl, that`s one thing. If they want to implicate her, that`s quite another.

GRACE: So are you telling me with that answer, Anne Bremner, that you believe the mother is responsible for the little girl`s death?

BREMNER: Absolutely not. I think that...

GRACE: Well, then, what you said doesn`t even make any sense.

BREMNER: Well, because -- no, because everyone`s trying to say that this girl`s dead and the mother`s responsible, and that`s why it`s all over the national news.

GRACE: Yes. Well, that`s not what I asked you.

BREMNER: It could be a totally different explanation.

GRACE: I asked you, if you want to help find your daughter, why do you have to use a go-between?

BREMNER: Because she is being accused of something far more sinister, something like a homicide, and they`re not believing here when she`s saying she can help. That`s why.

GRACE: Doug Burns, from what I`m just hearing from Anne Bremner -- Anne, you need to run on down to Florida right now because, you know, you`re on the bandwagon. That doesn`t even make any sense to me, Doug Burns. If you want to find your daughter...

DOUG BURNS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Right.

GRACE: ... why wouldn`t you talk to police, tell them what you know?

BURNS: Well, this thing`s apples and oranges. She has been locked up for obstruction of justice and not helping out.

GRACE: Yes?

BURNS: This is a situation of some type of bizarre -- I`m theorizing -- problem between the mother and the grandmother, and something really bizarre took place, and the mother doesn`t want to say what it is. And she`s behind bars.

GRACE: OK. Straight back out to Rory O`Neill. Let me tie down some facts. Number one, I understand that the mother, Casey, borrowed the neighbor`s shovel. Why?

O`NEILL: Well, the family had explained that because there are bamboo shoots that grow up in the backyard, the shovel was frequently used to dig them up. The bamboo shoots would hurt little baby Caylee`s feet. So they were often frequently dug up, and that Casey went next door to borrow the shovel. Police seized the shovel. That`s what -- it was a two-day search of the back yard. They dug up parts of the back yard and found absolutely nothing.

GRACE: And Rory, it is also my understanding that the mom, Casey, says that she received a call from the person that has the little girl recently and she actually spoke to the little girl. Have police looked at her cell phone records? Have they tried to trace that call?

O`NEILL: Well, that`s the sort of gumshoe work that`s taking place today. That story really just came to light because it was the grandmother who said that she witnessed that phone call. And police over the weekend said, really, this was new information for them. So they`re trying pin down the exact date that phone call may have taken place. And the conversation was along the lines of, Caylee, put an adult on the phone, and then, click, the phone went dead. So it was a very brief conversation, and police are trying to track that down.

GRACE: You know, Marc Klaas, the other night, I spoke personally with the grandmother. I didn`t hear anything about that phone call. I asked her, When was the last time you saw Caylee? What`s the last contact you had? I don`t recall anything about a phone call where the phone went dead.

MARC KLAAS, BEYONDMISSING.COM: No, nor neither do I, Nancy.

GRACE: Weren`t you here with me that night?

KLAAS: Yes, I was. No, absolutely. I was hearing a lot of things, none of which made sense. I still have no idea what the story of this thing is, where Casey has been for the last five weeks, why she`s lying to everybody. And I think probably the worst possible thing that can happen right now is for this lawyer of hers to put himself in the middle of this investigation.

If the goal really is to find the little girl, then that individual should allow law enforcement to interrogate her with him present, if he needs that. But he`s serving a secondary goal. His goal is to somehow protect Casey, when the overarching goal of this entire investigation is to find Caylee. The way he`s positioned this, he`s making her look more and more guilty every minute.

GRACE: And the other thing we heard, Marc Klaas -- or reporters discovered that they were searching Casey`s vehicle, that there was a horrible stench in the vehicle. There was also a child seat in the car. Apparently, nothing has turned up. It was not hit on by cadaver dogs, so that led to nowhere. I also don`t understand why this woman abandoned her car. In the midst of this five-week odyssey, she abandons her car.

Out to the lines. Liz, in Florida. Hi, Liz.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I`m so glad I get to talk to you.

GRACE: Thank you for calling.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You`re welcome. What is wrong with the grandmother? Can she not get through to her daughter about where that child is?

GRACE: I don`t...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Does the grandmother know where she is?

GRACE: I don`t know. And I spoke with the grandmother and the more I asked her about Casey, the less she would answer me. She wanted her appearance to be all about searching for Caylee. And I understand that, but maybe she is getting a -- running into a dead end, just like police are.

Back to Rory O`Neill with Metro Networks. I believe the grandmother has tried everything she could. She had the daughter and the granddaughter living with her, Casey and Caylee. They left for a period of weeks, allegedly to go out of town. Then no sign of Caylee. Now, what can you tell me about abandoning the car?

O`NEILL: Well, this is where it gets funny because there seems to be -- every time there`s something that`s suspicious that comes up, there`s an automatic excuse. The stench in the back of the car? That was a rotten pizza. The shovel for the back yard? That was the bamboo shoots. And now for the car that was abandoned, it ran out of gas. So there`s always something that seems to follow with the -- every time the hairs on the back of your neck go up. So it`s just a series of coincidence.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I will walk every inch of this earth and open every door and knock on every door, and I will look in every nook and cranny until I find her!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Casey couldn`t tell me or couldn`t feel that she could tell me that something had gone awry, that on a normal day that she was going to take her to this person that she always trusted Caylee in, and then she goes back and the person`s not there. And for whatever reason, you know, she feels it`s in Caylee`s best interests right now not to reveal who that person is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Then why all the lies to police, even about innocent facts like where she was working? Isn`t it correct, Marc Klaas, that they were supposed to go to this woman, the mother, Casey`s, job -- I believe it was Epcot -- and they get all the way there -- she`s sticking to the lie. They out of the car. They start walking to her job. They get all the way up to the door and she goes, Hey, you know what? I don`t really work here anymore. I was fired.

KLAAS: Yes.

GRACE: I mean, on every avenue, not just the job, there`s been a lie that she extends for quite a period of time until finally she`s busted. She goes, OK, I was lying. Do you believe anything she says?

KLAAS: Well, the thing is, Nancy, that Casey has absolutely no credibility whatsoever, and anything that she tells law enforcement means they have to follow up on it to see if they can verify it one way or the other. So certainly, it`s in her best interests to be telling the truth. But I think what the police have to do now is they have to find out where she`s been. Again, it`s more secrets. There are secrets. Everybody`s keeping secrets. Find out where she`s been for the past five weeks and then start verifying her actions from that point.

GRACE: Can`t they figure that out by pinging her cell phone, John Lucich? Can`t you figure all that out?

JOHN LUCICH, FORMER INVESTIGATOR: Oh, absolutely. That data`s out there, and it`s all going to depend on what records the networks are actually keeping. But there`s so many things that -- you know, she`s leading these people down the wrong road. Everything she says is a lie. The only thing going forward -- you know, in my heart of hearts, I hope this little girl`s alive. But the longer this goes on, the more it means this little girl`s dead. And the only time you could believe her is when she brings the police to this little girl`s body.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When Caylee was with her family, this is what she enjoyed doing the most, reading a book. The Anthony family is hoping that if people see this newly released video, someone will have a better chance of recognizing the child, who will be 3 years old next month.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s the brightest little star. She has the most amount of energy. She is -- she`s extremely curious. She is somebody that -- boy, how she can just figure things out. She is a very smart little girl, and it`s just -- it`s -- we can attribute that to the way that she`s been brought up by my sister.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: If you have any information on this little girl, please, please call the tip line. It`s 800-423-TIPS, 423-8477. There`s also www.Helpfindcaylee.com.

Out to the lines. To Karen in Florida. Hi, Karen.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. How are you, Nancy?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My question is, when they took the mother into custody, why didn`t they interrogate her right away before she was able to get an attorney?

GRACE: Rory O`Neill, joining us from Metro Networks, it`s my understanding they did interrogate her. Hint -- leading them on this wild goose chase over to Universal Studios -- that`s where it was that she said she worked -- and many other things that were all lies, Rory.

O`NEILL: Right. They spoke to her for almost a full day before they finally gave up and said, Look, we`ve gotten so much misinformation, we have to resort now to charging you with endangering a child, as well as obstruction of justice and other charges related to delaying this investigation.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CINDY ANTHONY, MISSING 2-YEAR-OLD`S GRANDMOTHER: If Casey cannot trust the authorities with the truth then the people have to find Caylee so that we can sort the truth out after Caylee has been found.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The grandmother of missing 2-year-old Florida girl says her daughter knows who has the toddler and should be released from jail. So she can help with the investigation.

Casey Anthony was arrested last week and charged with child neglect and criminal obstruction for allegedly lying to detectives. She told them she`d dropped 2-year-old Caylee Marie Anthony off with a babysitter last month but hasn`t seen her since.

Caylee`s grandmother says she last saw the little girl on June 9th. Investigators are following up on a few leads including the mother`s claim she had received a mysterious call from her daughter last Tuesday.

Investigators say it`s possible Caylee is still alive.

ANTHONY: I know in my heart she`s alive and I know in my heart that Casey feels that she`s alive.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRACE: This is absolutely outrageous. This little girl may still be alive, but mommy, who is in lock up right now, will not cooperate with police.

Now our sources tell us that the lawyer -- her defense lawyer keeps saying we want to talk to police.

Well, guess what, the cops tell us they have called her lawyer repeatedly and do not get a return phone call. That`s how much they want to cooperate.

Out to the lines, Pam in Illinois, hi, Pam.

PAM, ILLINOIS RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy. Great show.

I was wondering, where`s the fraternal grandparents? Have they`ve been questioned? Are they in the little girl`s life at all?

GRACE: Rory O`Neill, what do we know?

RORY O`NEILL, REPORTER, METRO NETWORKS: We don`t know much about the father of the child. He was killed in a car wreck about a year ago. So that side of the family really hasn`t been involved in the girl`s disappearance.

GRACE: From the very beginning basically.

Out to the lines to Haila, Indiana. Hi, dear.

HAILA, INDIANA RESIDENT: Hello.

GRACE: What`s your question?

HAILA: My question is, let`s say for instance, that the little girl is with a friend of Casey and they do find her, and she finally does report where she`s been, then what can happen to the mom after that or maybe even the person who has her even if it was with the mom`s permission to have her?

GRACE: Excellent question.

Let`s unleash the lawyers.

To Anne Bremner out of the Seattle jurisdiction and Doug Burns out of the New

Let`s unleash the lawyers.

To Anne Bremner out of the Seattle jurisdiction and Doug Burns out of the New York jurisdiction -- Doug Burns, under that scenario, could there be any charges?

DOUG BURNS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: That`s a very good question. I think they would see through the obstruction of justice, the lying stuff, and just finish that up, they would be able to convict her of that if they can establish and prove, as I`m sure they can, that what she told them.

GRACE: Doug.

BURNS: . wasn`t true.

GRACE: Doug.

BURNS: Yes?

GRACE: You say they`ll see through it.

BURNS: Yes.

GRACE: You know what? There are thousands of crimes being committed every minute.

BURNS: Right. Right.

GRACE: So this lady takes police on the wild goose chase for hours on end to her office that didn`t exist, to the apartment, where she said she left the baby, nobody had lived there in months -- it goes on and on and on.

BURNS: Nancy.

GRACE: So you don`t see a tiny little obstruction charges in the middle of all that?

BURNS: Yes, I just said that. I`m a lawyer so I`m telling you -- you just asked me a question, what will they charge them with.

GRACE: I know you`re a lawyer and your answer was, they`ll see through it. Now correct me if I`m wrong.

BURNS: No, no, you misunderstood me.

GRACE: But that`s not a legal term.

BURNS: Totally misunderstood me.

GRACE: They`ll see through it. OK. Explain.

BURNS: OK. I guess it`s sort of shoptalk. You were a prosecutor, so was I for nine years. They`re going to see the case through to the end. That`s what I meant.

In other words, they have her on a very good obstruction charge. As you`ve explained the whole night, brilliantly, this is an absurd. This is a mother who is lying about the whereabouts of her own child.

If, thank God, from my mouth to God is, the child is alive and safe and well, then they will see through or finish -- is what I meant, not apologize -- finish the conviction for obstruction of justice.

GRACE: Anne Bremner?

ANNE BREMNER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, I mean -- now I want to go back where I started, deja vu all over again.

You know, you don`t go from a lie to life imprisonment. I mean she`s in jail for supposedly lying, but the bottom line is here, I mean, is that there`s nothing -- there`s no crime.

GRACE: Who ever said anything life imprisonment because if this little girl is dead.

BREMNER: Nancy, but we.

GRACE: . forget about life in prison. This is Florida. Old Sparky, remember?

BREMNER: OK. (INAUDIBLE) death penalty, OK. There`s been one woman on that, but.

GRACE: DP, death penalty?

BREMNER: I think there`s been one that was on death row and executed. But that aside, they made a movie about such an anomaly. But the fact is, Nancy, is that you`ve got some lies and some lies and then some lies. That`s it. There`s no body and the fact of the matter is, one more thing, her lawyer is her advocate. The French word for an advocate is avocat. You stand in the shoes of your client.

GRACE: OK. You know what?

BREMNER: That lawyer -- one more thing, Nancy. That lawyer is there for her.

GRACE: Save me -- spare me the French pronunciations for tonight, OK?

BREMNER: No, I`m not going to do the French, but Nancy, he`s there for her, not for law enforcement. And we have to remember that.

GRACE: So, in translation, since you`re translating tonight.

BREMNER: A little there.

GRACE: . he`s there to keep her from going to jail.

BREMNER: He`s there to protect.

GRACE: Not to find the little girl.

BREMNER: He`s there to protect her interest as every lawyer does in America.

GRACE: OK, you know what, Dr. Robi.

BREMNER: I do it. Everyone does that.

GRACE: She`s right. That`s what the lawyers are there for. But what about the mom? What is she there for?

ROBI LUDWIG, PSYCHOTHERAPIST, AUTHOR OF "TILL DEATH DO US PART": Yes.

You know, the mother seems to be covering up and it doesn`t make sense. Why would this mother cover up for her daughter when it seems like something fishy is going on. So either the grandmother has a hope that her granddaughter is alive, she`s enabling, or she`s in complete denial that her daughter could do something this heinous. That`s my.

GRACE: I can tell you right now, Marc Klaas -- Marc Klaas, everybody, you know, is the founder of BeyondMissing.com.

Marc, to me, day one, ping the cell calls, find out where she`s been. If she knows who has the baby, why wouldn`t she give police their cell number? Their location? We find out the location she gave police, nobody has lived there in months.

It`s all BS. Now there`s a technical legal term for you. Everything she says is a lie. When you start lying about the whereabouts of your children, that`s just to me that -- that`s not where they are.

How do I even know this little girl is alive?

MARC KLAAS, FOUNDER, BEYONDMISSING.COM, FATHER OF MURDER VICTIM POLLY KLAAS: Well, you don`t. Nobody does and that`s why she should be kept in jail where she is to protect herself from herself and if there is some sort of diabolical conspiracy out there to protect her from whoever might be behind that. But certainly don`t let that woman go and certainly don`t make her cooperation a precondition of her release.

GRACE: I know. She says now, through her lawyer, her mouthpiece, yes, I want to cooperate with police, but only when I`m out of jail. I can`t really talk here.

To Brenda in Canada, hi, Brenda.

BRENDA, CANADIAN RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy. I just love you.

GRACE: Thank you.

BRENDA: You just alluded to what I was going to say, it`s that, I don`t believe the grandmother for a second. I think grandma`s up to something here. I think that grandma`s involved and I`m surprised that up until just now nobody really said anything like that.

GRACE: Well, it`s interesting to me, along those lines -- out to you, Anne Bremner, Doug Burns -- that if the grandmother was somehow involved in some plot regarding a cover-up of the child`s death or kidnapping, I find it hard to believe, Anne Bremner, that she would go on national TV and answer questions, although she did clam up when I started asking her questions about her daughter.

BREMNER: Yes.

GRACE: That`s a pretty big risk that she took.

BREMNER: Well, I think of Drew Peterson, but that aside, grandma`s not in jail and she did go on national television and we have to look at her that she`s got the best of intentions.

GRACE: What about it, Doug?

BURNS: No, I honestly can`t figure the situation out, but I said earlier -- and I agree with the caller -- there is some dynamic between the grandmother and the mother which really lays at the heart of this thing.

GRACE: And also, one of our sources, Rory O`Neill, said that the mom states -- the grandmother stated, you know, everyone said that my daughter and I had a big argument, that is simply not true, just before she left with Caylee.

What do we know about that?

O`NEILL: No, there was not a particular incident that caused this to happen. And they said over the five weeks, they had frequent phone conversations and would actually talk about Caylee, and Casey would give explanations, oh she`s at the beach, she`s with a friend, or she can`t come to the phone at the moment.

So the grandmother has been -- has not said there`s any immediate problems. She actually said there are problems going back to the actual birth of Caylee and the instances in the birthing room when the infant was given over to the grandmother rather than the mother, because she was still (INAUDIBLE) with doctors at the time.

And she thinks there`s a psychological impact to the fact that it was the grandmother who held the child first before her own mother did. So she`s really opening up every possible avenue to try to explain her daughter`s behavior.

GRACE: That`s very interesting. A psychological impact.

To the Dr. Zhongxue Hua, joining us from Union County -- he`s a New Jersey medical examiner there -- Doctor, thank you for being with us.

Reports say investigators have gone back to the scene where Caylee`s vehicle was discovered. It had been abandoned, which I also find very tough to reconcile with her story.

Why would you just leave your car somewhere with a child`s seat in it. Whoever had the child, wouldn`t they want the child seat? What would they be looking for back at the abandoned vehicle, Doctor?

DR. ZHONGXUE HUA, UNION CO., N.J. MEDICAL EXAMINER: Detail forensic examination including any evidence of blood, any evidence of hair, any other evidence, I mean, everything have to be looked in detail.

GRACE: To Ginger in Arkansas, hi, Ginger.

GINGER, ARKANSAS RESIDENT: Hello.

GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?

GINGER: First of all, congratulations on your babies.

GRACE: Thank you very much.

GINGER: You`re truly beautiful. Your (INAUDIBLE) life that gorgeous.

My question is, does anyone know whether this mother has a history of drug abuse or even as farfetched as it sounds, maybe kind of sold her child or.

GRACE: You know, interesting theory.

You know, Marc Klaas, the other night when you and I were together and we were talking to the grandmother, I asked, does Casey have any history of mental illness, and she very carefully worded her answer and said no history of mental illness.

KLAAS: That`s very true, but you know, like everybody is suggesting, there are too many little secrets and too many little things going on for any of this to be credible.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWSBREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTHONY: Anybody that looks at this little girl will fall madly in love with her. And there`s no, no way that anybody would not want to have her around because you just -- when you`re around her all you feel is her magic.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Where is 2-year-old little Caylee? We are taking your calls.

To Ginger in Arkansas, hi, Ginger. Ginger, are you with me?

OK, let`s go on to Louise in West Virginia. Hi, Louise.

LOUISE, WEST VIRGINIAN RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy. Love your show.

GRACE: Thank you, dear.

LOUISE: What I want to -- do you think that Casey, the mother, was jealous of her parents with the little girl and maybe she done something to the little girl?

GRACE: Well, Louise, that`s very analytical by you and very astute because I noticed when the grandmother was on the other night, she stated that Casey wanted to take Caylee to bond with her that because the grandmother spend so much time with her, she didn`t get to bond with her.

My view is, my parents or the children`s other grandparents are there, the more love the better. You can`t give a child too much love. But apparently, there was an issue on that front.

What about it, Dr. Robi?

LUDWIG: Well, it could be that Casey felt that her mother was criticizing her. And what concerns is that the mother of this little girl didn`t feel bonded to her daughter. So did she resent her daughter in some way? Did she feel her daughter was stopping her from living a life that she wanted to live?

This girl, this mother`s only 22 years old. That`s not old. Maybe she wanted to go out and have a good time and felt her daughter was stopping her in some way.

GRACE: Well, you know what, a lot of people would like to be fancy free with no responsibilities, but when you have a child, that changes everything. And from my vantage point, it seems like the grandmother and grandfather stepped in to help raise the child.

The girl was living there, too. Casey, the daughter was living there, too.

Everyone, we are switching gears, but before we do, I want to remind you of the tip line. It is 1-800-423-TIPS, 8477.

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http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../21/ng.01.html

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NANCY GRACE

Missing Florida 2-Year-Old`s Mother Named Person of Interest

Aired July 22, 2008 - 20:00:00 ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Police desperately searching for a beautiful little 2-year-old Florida girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing. It`s a story that becomes more and more convoluted every moment. Little Caylee hasn`t been seen in five long weeks, last seen with her mother. So why didn`t Mommy call police?
Headlines tonight. In the last hour, bombshell. A lead detective testifies the mom`s car reeked -- reeked! -- of human decomposition, specifically in the car trunk. Do hairs taken from the trunk match little Caylee`s? And the timeline now in complete disarray after the grandmother changes her story! Does an ex-boyfriend place little Caylee alive, alive as late as June 24. Tonight, police name the mom, Casey Anthony, a person of interest. Where is 2-year-old Caylee?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was the first Orange County detective to talk to 22-year-old Casey Anthony. Yuri says when they finally got permission to search the car, they opened it up and it smelled of death.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I actually went into the car to smell what the smell smelled like. Briefly, just before I came into the job (INAUDIBLE) I was homicide detective for two years with Lawrence (ph) County sheriff`s office. In my experience, the smell that I smelled inside that car was the smell of decomposition.

CYNTHIA ANTHONY, MISSING GIRL`S GRANDMOTHER: When Casey said that she wasn`t going to take me to Caylee right away because Caylee had been with the sitter and she didn`t want her to be disrupted that night by seeing me after so long, I got a little anxious because I thought Caylee was with Casey.

I told her, Tell me where Caylee is, or I`m going to go to the police. She said, She`s with Danny (ph). Do what you want.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: And tonight, "Batman" star in holy dust-up? Did Hollywood superstar Christian Bale go from caped crusader on screen to the dark side off screen? After walking the red carpet, Christian Bale heads straight to a London police station. He`s accused of assaulting his mother and sister at an upscale London hotel. But explain this. Why didn`t they call police at the time of the alleged incident? Why did they time their complaint to coincide with the world premier of "The Dark Knight"? Bale, squeaky clean, with no arrest record whatsoever, gives his story to police.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Christian Bale, the star of the hottest movie right now in the world, was arrested in London. Bale`s mother and older sister allege that Bale assaulted them on Sunday night. That was the day before the European premier of "The Dark Knight," which stars Bale as Batman.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s real mature (ph). He`s somebody with the responsibility of power now, and he`s also come across the archetypal enemy, somebody who has no rules. You can`t leverage him with anything.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Christian Bale was staying at a suite on Sunday when the alleged assault took place. It`s thought (ph) his mother and sister told officers he lashed out at them when they reported the allegation at the police station in Hampshire. The film star should have been back here this afternoon to do more promotional interviews. Instead, he was subjected to a rather different form of interrogation. The 34-year- old was released from Belgravia police station on bail this evening, pending further inquiries. After the death of co-star Heath Ledger, it`s a second strange development connected to this film.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Breaking news tonight. A beautiful 2-year-old little Florida girl, Caylee, still missing in a story that becomes more and more convoluted by the moment. In the last hours, bombshell. Mom`s car reeks of decomposition, according to trained cadaver dogs. Where is 2-year-old Caylee?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Police testified at her mother, Casey Anthony`s, bail hearing in Orlando today. Now, the officer says her mom`s car smelled like a decomposing body. The white Pontiac was abandoned at a check- cashing business. Police say they found Caylee`s hair in the trunk, and that`s when investigators called in a cadaver dog.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) jumped up into the trunk, front paws, stuck his head in, backed back up, did the eye contact and moved to the right rear passenger side, rear fender/trunk-taillight area and gave me a fine (ph) train (ph) of alert.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What`s that mean?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He alerted to the odor of human decomposition.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Casey Anthony (INAUDIBLE) suspect in that circumstance.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I wouldn`t use the word "suspect." I would use the word "person of interest."

ANTHONY: Casey has lied to me in the past, and when she`s lied, she`s told me the truth. We`ve always gotten to the bottom of the truth.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You called the police that night...

ANTHONY: Correct.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... for a reason.

ANTHONY: Correct.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What reason?

ANTHONY: Because after speaking with Casey, I did not get to see Caylee. I was not satisfied with her answers. It was my opinion that something was wrong that I called the police. Call it a hunch. I had a pretty good hunch that night. I have a pretty good hunch now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Straight out to Rory O`Neill. We are taking your calls live. Rory in court today. What happened?

RORY O`NEILL, METRO NETWORKS: Oh, so much, Nancy. Probably the most significant developments involved the decomposition smell that you already talked about, plus this change of the timeline. It was because the police last night had actually made a phone call to Caylee`s grandmother, asking her if she`s sure about the last time she saw Caylee. That`s because videotape that the family released over the weekend showed the young girl was actually with her great-grandfather on Father`s Day. That would be the 15th, almost a full week after they thought was the last time they saw her alive.

GRACE: Now, let me get something straight, Rory O`Neill -- Rory joining us from Metro Networks. He was in court today. The grandmother apparently took Caylee to visit the great-grandfather in a rest home or an assisted living facility on Father`s Day, is that correct?

O`NEILL: That`s right, and that`s the videotape now that we`ve seen - - we`ve gotten a lot of still photos, but the videotape that came out over the weekend. The police looked at that, determined the date of it was filmed on the 15th. And then it was a lightbulb for the grandmother, who said, That`s right. I took that video on the 15th, so the 9th of June is not the last time I saw Caylee.

GRACE: To Marc Klaas, child advocate. He`s the founder of Beyondmissing.com. How can you confuse that, Father`s Day, seeing the baby alive on Father`s Day?

MARC KLAAS, BEYONDMISSING.COM: I don`t have any idea how she could do that. Unfortunately, it just calls into question the credibility of this family more and more. But what I think is happening here is I think that Cindy Anthony`s world is crashing in around her as these new revelations are being made known.

GRACE: You know what? I think you`re right about that, Marc Klaas. We are taking your calls live. Out to the lines. Geri in Florida. Hi, Geri.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. Good evening.

GRACE: Thank you, dear. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, first of all, I want to thank you for all you`re doing and your inspiration.

GRACE: Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And if you ever come to Boca, I`d be glad to take the pictures of your gorgeous twins (INAUDIBLE)

GRACE: Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My question is, are we sure that the father has passed away, and whether he is or not, that this could be some kind of custody thing or that they don`t want the other grandparents to see the child and that`s why the grandmother is helping cover up?

GRACE: Rory O`Neill, where is the dad, for once and for all?

O`NEILL: Well, the police say that they believe Caylee`s story that - - rather, Casey`s story that the father of the baby was killed one year ago in a traffic accident. They say that`s their story that they were told, and that`s one of the few tales from Casey that they actually believe.

GRACE: OK, Rory, tell me about the cadaver dog. That is significant, significant evidence.

O`NEILL: Very much so because -- the family had tried to explain away the cadaver smell -- or the stench, rather, in the car as saying it was an old pizza that was left in the abandoned car, and it was a maggot-filled pizza that caused the odor.

Well, this is the first time we heard Detective Melich on the stand today saying, no, when he smelled it -- he`s a trained -- he`s an old homicide detective. He knows that smell. And then they brought the dogs in, and a cadaver dog, a specially trained dog, also picked up on that same odor. It was an odor of, really, decomposing flesh. And that`s what the dog found both in trunk of the car and at the back yard of the Anthony home.

GRACE: So was there a decayed, maggot-filled pizza in the back yard, too?

O`NEILL: Well, the family was not there. Actually, at the time the digging was taking place, the grandmother was here at the time, so you know, she was actually surprised to see just as -- she was being interviewed by you at the time, so it was -- so she wasn`t there to clear out a pizza, that`s for sure.

GRACE: To Sergeant Scott Haines, sheriff`s officer, Santa Rosa County, Florida. Sergeant, thank you for being with us. Nobody`s story -- nobody`s story -- fits together. The mother`s doesn`t fit with the grandmother`s. Their story doesn`t fit with the ex-boyfriend -- a former cop, I might add, that states he hears little Caylee, 100 percent certain it`s her, on June 28. June 28, he places the girl alive. The phone record has checked out. There was an 18-minute phone call to this woman, the mother, Casey. The girl, the baby, is in the background, alive.

Now this is blowing the timeline wide open. What do you think?

SGT. SCOTT HAINES, SHERIFF`S OFFICER, SANTA ROSA COUNTY, FLORIDA: It`s hard to know what to think. Like you stated before, no one in this whole situation is being truthful in reference to this whole thing. The stories have changed...

GRACE: OK, Sergeant, Sergeant, Sergeant -- I`m just a trial lawyer. You`re the expert. OK. Don`t rehash what we already know. Tell me what you think. What is your professional opinion, Sergeant?

HAINES: My professional opinion is she`s lying and she knows exactly where her child is at. And unfortunately, I don`t think it`s a good situation.

GRACE: Sergeant, I think you`re right.

Speaking of the cadaver dogs, the biggest bombshell to hit the courtroom today, we learned that cadaver dogs hit -- hit -- alerted in the -- specifically in the trunk of Casey Anthony`s vehicle.

And with us tonight, we have two very special guests to explain to you how a cadaver dog functions. With us is Tracy Sargent. She is with Homeland Security, joining us tonight, and with her, her cadaver dog, called a detection dog, Cinco. How long did Cinco train, Tracy?

TRACY SARGENT, K-9 HANDLER: He`s 3 years old, and he`s been in training since he was 4 months old.

GRACE: And tonight you`re going to show us a demonstration. What is the object you believe Cinco will alert on?

SARGENT: Yes, Nancy, we have here in the studio scented material that has been in a body bag with a decomposing person. The dog will show us, in this case sit down, and tell us there is human remains scent in this area. And he`ll demonstrate that for us.

GRACE: So Tracy Sargent is with from Homeland Security. Tracy, you`re telling me that this is a cloth material, I believe you said part of a sheet earlier, that was in a body bag. Yes, no?

SARGENT: Yes, ma`am, that is correct.

GRACE: OK, please proceed with Cinco. I`d like to see this.

SARGENT: Cinco, sit. Hunt!

What you notice, Nancy, he`s sitting down. The pillow that he`s facing, there is an article there that is human remains scent. And we`ll show that to you. This container, again, has a sheet from a cadaver. So this right here tells us there is human remains scent in this area, based upon the dog`s trained alert.

GRACE: OK, Tracy, you`re telling me that the material -- please, camera, go back to Cinco and Tracy. You`re telling me the material is inside that container?

SARGENT: Yes, ma`am. What you see, it`s a sheet directly from a person where they died in their bed. This sheet has been soaked with cadaver fluids. And the dog tells us there`s human remains scent in this location.

GRACE: And Cinco, who is a male, smelled that through the container and through the plastic wrapping you have in your hand, correct?

SARGENT: Yes, ma`am, that`s correct. Their sense of smell is so great that it`s almost impossible to cover up any scent, be it drugs or a decomposing person, from a dog.

GRACE: And every type of dog, be it a fire dog, a drug dog, a cadaver dog, they are trained to a specific scent. Like, Cinco would not hit on drugs.

SARGENT: That`s correct. He is specifically trained to find people, dead or alive -- in this case, human remains. Also animal remains, they are trained not to alert on that, as well.

GRACE: Oh, really? Now, that`s something I wanted to ask you about because the dog in Caylee`s case hit specifically in the trunk of her mother`s vehicle. Now, if there had been an accident where an animal was run over, for instance -- I`m hypothesizing here -- the dog wouldn`t hit on any remain other than a human remain, Tracy?

SARGENT: That`s correct. A dead animal and a dead person is totally different to a dog.

GRACE: Out to Dr. Lawrence Kobilinsky, forensic scientist joining us tonight. Cadaver fluid -- what is it?

LAWRENCE KOBILINSKY, FORENSIC SCIENTIST: Well, Nancy, what happens after a person dies is that there`s a breakdown of proteins and a synthesis of two very pungent breakdown products, or amino acids. One is called putrescine, the other is called cadaverine, very pungent smells. Once you smell it, you never forget it and you know exactly what the smell of death is. And that is what these dogs are recognizing, putrescine and cadaverine.

And furthermore, the homicide detective that has had apparently vast experience dealing with death recognized the same smell. So I`m very suspicious at this point and it`s a very bad sign, ominous sign, at this stage.

GRACE: You`re seeing again Tracy Sargent with Cinco from Homeland Security. Tracy, I know that you are familiar with the facts of the missing little girl in Florida. The cadaver dog hit specifically on the trunk of the car of the mother, the car belonging to the mother, in the trunk just above the right taillight. Now, your dog is trained to sit in the area on which it hits. What about other dogs? Do they bark? Do they scratch? Do they alert in any other manner?

SARGENT: Yes, ma`am. There`s a variety of ways we can train these dogs to indicate to us there is scent. In Cinco`s case, it`s a sit. Other dogs, it may be a bark, lie down or scratch.

GRACE: And you reward the dog with what?

SARGENT: Generally, we reward them with a toy. In this case, Cinco, it`s a baseball.

GRACE: I want to go back out to Rory O`Neill, reporter with Metro Networks, in court today. From my vantage point of what was happening in court, I noticed that the mother and the grandmother cried throughout until the evidence regarding the cadaver dog came in. Then both of the wells dried up. What happened?

O`NEILL: Well, that was an interesting time because that was really the first time we`d heard any of that evidence. And I think also for the grandmother, perhaps, it`s a sign of, you know, the hope that she may have been holding on may start to fade, if you start hearing reports of cadaver dogs finding scent in this car and in the back yard. So I think for her, it might have been that. I couldn`t really tell Casey`s immediate reaction to the news of the cadaver dog. But it obviously was a sobering moment for anyone who was in that courtroom.

GRACE: Out to the lines. Let`s go to Sheeba in Illinois. Hi, Sheeba.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy, dear. I wanted to ask a couple of questions. One of them, that they said she borrowed the neighbor`s shovel to dig up some bamboo or something that hurt the baby`s feet?

GRACE: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And then she took it back. Well, it looks like to me she would have probably had to have her own shovel if this was an ongoing thing. So maybe she could have -- I hate to think of it -- buried this baby somewhere else.

GRACE: It`s my understanding that the day Casey Anthony needed a shovel, for whatever reason, the tool house in their back yard was locked. She couldn`t get to the shovel, Sheeba. So that is the explanation for using a neighbor`s shovel.

But very quickly, Rory O`Neill, who came up with the pizza explanation for the reeking car?

O`NEILL: That was the grandparents who said there was an old pizza in the back causing the smell, and they had actually gotten rid of it in a bag. But the cadaver dog smelled something very different.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The crime scene investigators are working on the car, trying to determine the -- where the -- where the smell is coming from, if it`s coming from a particular area of the car. And one of the areas that they focused on now is the trunk of the car.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why is that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because they found hair samples in the trunk of the car that are similar in length and color to that of Caylee. They also found a stain inside the trunk of the car that came up under black light that`s questionable that we need to process. They also found some dirt inside the trunk of the car that needs to be processed.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Bombshell tonight, and there`s nothing good about it. Cadaver dogs hit on the vehicle belonging to Caylee`s mother, specifically the trunk. According to Rory O`Neill from Metro Networks, in court today, he says the whole theory that the -- there was an old pizza in the car that made the dog hit on it came from the grandparents.

Back out to Tracy Sargent. She`s here with her detection dog, Cinco. They`re both from Homeland Security. Tracy, do cadaver dogs actually alert on food ever?

SARGENT: No, ma`am, they do not. That`s one of the training things we do with these dogs, that any distraction we may find out there, they are trained also that they are only to alert to human remains scent.

GRACE: And to the lawyers, Raymond Giudice, Courtney Anderson. What about the bond, Ray Giudice?

RAY GIUDICE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, look, Nancy, bond is not a law enforcement tool to sweat out a confession. It`s a tool for the court to make sure the defendant will come back to court. This judge found that a half a million dollar bond, which is certainly significant, plus a GPS restriction, is enough to insure her return to court to face these charges, which right now are not high.

GRACE: Courtney?

COURTNEY ANDERSON, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, I`m going to put on my defense attorney hat here very vigorously. If I understand correctly, today in the bond hearing that the police detective did -- under questioning, did say that there`s nothing at this point linking the mother to the disappearance of the child. Now, there`s a lot happening. Certainly, the bottom line is the child is missing. But I think it`s important that we not rush to conclusion.

GRACE: A cadaver dog hits. The mom is lying about the location of her children. I don`t know what you mean by rushing to conclusion. We`ll be right back. We`re taking your calls live.

To tonight`s Amber Alert. The search for a missing 4-year-old girl, Manassas, Virginia, Decareyonna Bryche Walker-Mays, last seen July 12. Police say the girl`s mom, not the legal custodian, claims to take the baby to lunch, never returns. They may be headed to Rock Island, Illinois, or Davenport, Iowa. Please take a look. The little girl 3-6, 40 pounds, brown hair, brown eyes, pierced ears. If you have information, please call the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, 1-800-THE-LOST.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There was a tip that came in that we followed up on, indicating that somebody -- a hairdresser, in particular -- had seen Caylee with bruises on her arms, bruises on her body and a mark on her eye. Reason that concerned me was that I retrieved a photo from another witness on a cell phone (INAUDIBLE) cell phone photograph or a phone photograph, that showed Caylee with a mark underneath her eye. So obviously, that witness, not knowing I had this photo, making mention of that, I started looking at, Well, maybe there`s something underlying that I haven`t been asking about. And that`s why I approached the family about it last night.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Straight back to Rory O`Neill with Metro Networks, in court today. What can you tell me about the mom allegedly being seen hitting little Caylee in the past, and about this photo?

O`NEILL: Well, that was -- that was the two pieces of information the detective was trying to put together, and that was the last conversation he had with the grandmother. So he hears this story from the hairdresser that the child had multiple injuries. He has this -- or bruises -- I shouldn`t -- maybe not a severe as injuries. He has this photo of the girl with another mark on her cheek. So that forced him to call the grandparents last night. he didn`t get too much further about that on the stand, though, during his testimony today.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On the 15th, Casey maintained for the majority of 45 minutes before my mother called the authorities that she knew where Caylee was and she would take her there in the morning.

It was at that time when the police came. My mother was very frustrated that it came to that. When my mom removed herself from the situation, I, at that time, pleaded with my sister, made her aware -- she wasn`t aware -- that my mom was outside and that she couldn`t hear us.

At that time when I asked her, what are you going to do when the police get here? Because there`s nothing in this for you right now if Caylee is OK. That`s when Casey broke down and cried and she told me at that time, I have not seen my daughter in 31 days.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: That is the brother of mom Casey Anthony, and even that was a lie. Not what he`s saying on the stand, but apparently what his sister, the mother, recounted to him, because she says she hasn`t seen her daughter in 31 days.

But according to an ex-boyfriend who is a former cop, and a -- phone record backs up his story -- on June 24 he hears the little girl in the background on the phone. He`s 100 percent sure that that was Caylee, which totally torpedoes the story she told her own brother who swore to it under oath.

It`s a convoluted story that at the heart of it all is the location and possibly the life of a 2-year-old little Florida girl.

We are taking your calls. To Bonnie in Canada, hi, Bonnie.

BONNIE, CANADIAN RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy Grace. You are such a blessing for us. Thank you.

GRACE: Thank you. What is your question, dear?

BONNIE: I was wondering, because the grandmother was so curious -- she was -- not curious. She became alert about the disappearance of her -- not being able to see her granddaughter for such a long time. Is there a history -- is there a child protective services file on the mom?

GRACE: Very interesting. Based on the mother, the grandmother being so concerned.

Rory O`Neill, has DFACS, Department of Family and Children Services, ever been called in on Casey Anthony, the mother?

RORY O`NEILL, REPORTER, METRO NETWORKS: No, there`s been no record of any trouble at all. But the child -- and you know, is seemingly a very happy household. Very stayable with the grandparents, living in the house, and really young Caylee living in that house basically full time.

So it had been a very stable, simple family home until all of this happened, I guess, now five weeks ago.

GRACE: To Sergeant Scott Haines, officer with Santa Rosa County Sheriff`s Office there in Florida -- Sergeant, the grandmother has now changed the story. She`s placing Caylee alive one week later. How does this affect the search for the little girl?

SERGEANT SCOTT HAINES, SHERIFF`S OFFICER, SANTA ROSA COUNTY, FL.: I don`t think it`s actually going to affect the search of the little girl. The detectives seem like they`re doing a good job. And with all the evidence that they have and the cadaver dogs in this thing, that one week is not going to play a part.

It goes down to she waited that long. And she knows things that she`s more worried about saving for her defense than saving her girl. And that`s a very disturbing fact.

GRACE: Are you referring to the grandmother?

HAINES: I`m referring to everybody involved. The defense attorney is saying that they have all this information, that they can`t disclose because it may incriminate their client, and they`re wanting immunity.

If there`s going to be consequences for this woman, she should be more worried about her child and saving her child than worrying about if she`s going to spend a little bit time in jail for something if, in fact, her child is alive.

GRACE: You know what, Sergeant Scott Haines, you just brought up an interesting point. I`m going to go to Marc Klaas now.

Did you hear Haines mention the mother will talk to police if she`s granted immunity?

MARC KLAAS, FOUNDER, BEYONDMISSING.COM, FATHER OF MURDER VICTIM POLLY KLAAS: Well, her -- that should never be a condition of her release, if, in fact, she is concerned about finding her daughter.

One of the problems is that this investigation is no longer expanding. It`s contracting. We have numerous individuals who were acquaintances of Casey who have contacted law enforcement to either repute her timeline to show evidence of physical abuse, or to state that she is a pathological liar.

Her mother has now suggested that she may not any longer cooperate with law enforcement. There was a body in the trunk of the car. Caylee is still missing and nobody knows where she is.

This is just a terrible situation.

GRACE: Very quickly, Rory O`Neill. Marc Klaas touched on an important issue. The grandmother suggesting she may no longer cooperate with police. Why?

O`NEILL: I talked to the attorney -- her -- the attorney who represents Casey. He says that`s absolutely not true. The family is willing to cooperate. And he doesn`t agree with the testimony that was heard in today`s bond hearing.

GRACE: To psychotherapist Lauren Howard joining us out of New York -- Lauren, the grandmother has appeared defensive and combative. Why?

LAUREN HOWARD, PSYCHOTHERAPIST: It`s very difficult to figure out if they`re -- if they`re closing ranks and protecting one another, or if they`re both complicit.

What the attorney is telling us is that they have information, or at least the mother has information. So on the one hand grandmother is the one who alerted the police. On the other hand she`s kind of running for cover.

So, as this unfolds, and it will unfold, it will probably be a simpler story than our -- than the crisis for imagination will lead us to believe. It will be revealed. But at this point to conjecture and figure it out, it`s so sort of almost diabolical.

And to me, it speaks of a certain enmeshment between the mother and daughter, you know, a kind of -- where the boundaries don`t begin and end appropriately.

GRACE: I think you`re right, because the grandmother told me pointblank that Casey says she wanted to go away on a vacation with her daughter Caylee so they could bond. That she wasn`t able to bond with her 2-year-old little girl living there in the house with the grandmother. The grandmother told me that.

Let`s unleash the lawyers, Raymond Giudice out of Atlanta, child lawyer Courtney Anderson, out of Austin, Texas.

To Raymond Giudice, both you and Courtney suggested, there`s very little evidence. Well, I find it very strong evidence that Casey Anthony`s car was abandoned by her and now cadaver dogs hit in her car.

RAY GIUDICE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well.

GRACE: They only hit on human remains, Raymond.

GIUDICE: Well, so I assume the district attorney is preparing an indictment for homicide right now, because if there`s enough probable cause, according to you, that`s what they should be doing.

GRACE: No, that`s not what I said. I said that there`s very strong evidence.

GIUDICE: OK. But.

GRACE: You and Courtney suggest there`s no evidence whatsoever.

GIUDICE: But there`s not even probable cause.

GRACE: Why don`t we just call it like it is?

GIUDICE: There`s not even probably cause.

GRACE: Did I say probable cause? Is that what I just said?

GIUDICE: That`s the lowest.

GRACE: No, it`s not. I said there`s a strong evidence.

GIUDICE: Nancy, the lowest form of evidence in a courtroom is probable cause, and they don`t even have that yet.

GRACE: Let me rephrase my question to Courtney Anderson. We`re not in court. We`re not battling it our in court. Let`s just talk about the facts as they really exist. Let`s not pretend about what`s going on here. This is a search for a little girl.

There is strong evidence. And I`m referring specifically to the issue of bond. We have a mother who is lying about the location of her child or withholding evidence. She won`t speak without immunity. Her lawyer says they want to talk, but he won`t return the sheriff`s phone calls. She abandons her car. And now a cadaver dog hits on her car.

What more do you think we need for probable cause, Courtney?

COURTNEY ANDERSON, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Look, the bottom line is we all want the little girl to be found. This is a reprehensible person. No matter what`s happened, no matter what has happened, whether she herself intentionally did something to the child or accidentally did something to the child, or she knows someone who did something to the child. For her to lying and playing games, it`s unbelievable.

We have to understand, the attorneys, the police, everyone is doing their job in this system. And doing it, it appears to be, to the best of their ability.

But I -- you know, we can`t expect that this woman who`s -- this kind of reprehensible person to do something that is reasonable.

GRACE: Yes, you know what? The both of you are right in the sense that we -- the three of us are trying to apply logic to an illogical situation.

To Dr. Lawrence Kobilinsky, joining us, forensic scientist, about the hair, the hair found in the trunk, what can you tell me? Why haven`t -- or tried to do a DNA match to hair from the little girl from the home?

LAWRENCE KOBILINSKY, FORENSIC SCIENTIST: Well, hair analysis for identification should only be done by comparing a question and a known. And you can do that visually, you can do it microscopically, or you can do it through DNA, as you just pointed out.

However, mitochondrial DNA is maternally inherited, which means that, Caylee`s mitochondrial DNA profile is shared by Casey, by Casey`s brother, by her mother. So it`s not unique.

So here, we have to look at this microscopically and visually, and determine if there is a match or not, then we can say.

GRACE: Yes, no? Dr. Kobilinsky, if they have nucleus from the hair in the trunk and you have a nucleus of the little girl`s hair from a brush or comb in the home, can you make a mitochondrial match?

KOBILINSKY: No, it -- well, if the hair is Caylee`s, and they`re comparing it to the mother`s, they can determine that there`s commonality here. If there`s nuclear DNA, that will make a difference, yes.

GRACE: Everybody, when we come back, switching gears. Did Hollywood superstar Christian Bale go from "Caped Crusader" on screen to the dark side off-screen?

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../22/ng.01.html

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NANCY GRACE

Tipster Says Missing Toddler Spotted on Flight to Atlanta

Aired July 23, 2008 - 20:00:00 ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Police desperately searching for a beautiful little 2-year-old Florida girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing. It`s a story that becomes more and more convoluted. Little Caylee hasn`t been seen in five long weeks, last seen with her mother. So why didn`t Mommy call police?
Tonight, bombshell. We now learn trained cadaver dogs hit on not only the mom`s car trunk but in the grandmother`s back yard, as well, police so concerned they bring in another cadaver dog, who independently hits on the same two areas. Cops also reveal a tipster claims she saw little Caylee boarding a flight to Atlanta. The 2-year-old`s mom, Casey Anthony, named a person of interest. She says she`ll help police, all right, but only if granted full immunity from prosecution. Tonight, where is 2-year-old Caylee?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Missing 2-year-old Caylee Anthony likely will not be found alive. Even prosecutors are now saying this is beginning to look more and more like a homicide. Her mom, Casey Anthony, is charged with child neglect, lying to detectives. Cops testified in court yesterday that her car smelled like death. But Caylee`s grandmother had a different explanation for that. Just listen to what she said. Watch this exchange as she`s walking out of the courthouse.

CYNTHIA ANTHONY, MISSING GIRL`S GRANDMOTHER: Caylee is missing. And continue to look for Caylee. She is not dead.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How do you deal with what they`re saying about in the trunk of the car?

ANTHONY: There was a bag of pizza for, what, 12 days in the back of the car, full of maggots, that stunk so bad. You know how hot it`s been.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Did you ever see bruises on Caylee?

ANTHONY: I have a bruise. Am I abused?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Cadavers (SIC) don`t hit on pizza. Cadaver dogs do not hit on pizza.

And tonight, the mystery surrounding 23-year-old mom Stacy Peterson, vanishing up scale Chicago suburbs, husband/cop Drew Peterson the prime suspect in his fourth wife`s disappearance, the suspicious bathtub drowning of wife three officially ruled homicide. Tonight, is there finally a break in the case?

Long-time friends say -- of Peterson`s -- they were wired secretly by police for months, allegedly catching Peterson mocking the cops and wishing he had wife three cremated. Peterson then allegedly states on tape by the time Stacy`s body is found, he`ll be acquitted of her murder and escape justice because of double jeopardy. Peterson allegedly goes on to ask friends to sabotage a boat used in the search for Stacy and to destroy a memorial garden in Stacy`s memory.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Two of Drew Peterson`s former long-time friends are talking to "The Sun-Times."` They told the paper they were undercover informants, wearing wires for months to help authorities build a case against the ex-Bollingbrook cop.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No way that this happened. The Illinois State Police and the prosecutors would never allow a witness, an undercover witness, for seven months to talk to the media like this.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All this starts (ph) as Peterson mocks investigators, saying she was in a dry bathtub. What a bunch of expletive idiots. Len Wawczak also recalls Peterson telling them, I should have had that "expletive" cremated. It would have cost me less, and I wouldn`t be going through this trouble. According to the paper, Wawczak also says that Peterson told him he wasn`t worried about them finding Stacy`s remains down the road because he figured by that time, he would have been tried and acquitted.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This morning, Drew Peterson spoke to reporters through his front door.

DREW PETERSON, SUSPECTED IN WIFE STACY`S DISAPPEARANCE: I`d love to talk to you, but my attorney has instructed me not to make any comments today.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You have to be thinking something about those comments that they made that they say on tape. They say, you know, this is going to be the end of you.

PETERSON: OK. We`ll see.

(LAUGHTER)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us tonight. Police desperately searching for a beautiful little 2- year-old Florida girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing. It`s a story that becomes more and more convoluted. Little Caylee hasn`t been seen in five long weeks, last seen with her mother. So why didn`t Mommy call police? Cadaver dogs hit on the mom`s car. Was there a Caylee sighting on a flight to Atlanta? Tonight, the lawyer for mom Casey Anthony is with us live and taking your calls.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The family is investigating a possible sighting of Caylee at Orlando International Airport. Three members of the same family contacted the Anthonys, saying they spoke to the missing toddler and even asked her name as they all boarded a flight to Atlanta July 2.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She knows exactly which date, which flight. They can figure it out. You know, she knows approximately which row they were sitting at.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Investigators, however, believe Caylee may be dead, based in part on an odor inside the mother`s car.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My husband is a deputy sheriff. Years ago, he was a homicide investigator, as well. And the first thing he thought was human decomposition. I`m a nurse. I thought human decomposition.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: However, the family now believes that smell was merely a rotten slice of pizza. Today, they`re questioning the credibility of a sheriff`s cadaver dog that detected decomposition in the car, as well as in the grandparents` back yard.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t care what America thinks of me. If they think that I`m a (DELETED) because I`m standing up to the media that want to attack me, OK? If they want to take the focus on this face, if they want to do that, they can live with themselves.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: With us tonight, a special guest. The lawyer, Jose Baez, the attorney for Casey Anthony, little Caylee`s mother, is with us live. We are taking your calls live tonight.

First to Rory O`Neill with Metro Networks. Rory, what`s the latest?

RORY O`NEILL, METRO NETWORKS: Well, good evening, Nancy. There is a bit more hope today, especially for the whole Anthony family. That`s because of that new lead coming out of Orlando International Airport, where a family says they saw little Caylee getting on a plane bound for Atlanta. They met with detectives this afternoon, even a sketch artist trying to put information together. They actually reached out, contacted the grandparents directly, and then they were referred to police. And it`s really given the Anthony family hope that Caylee is still alive and was seen as recently as July the 2nd.

GRACE: Let`s go out to Casey Anthony`s attorney joining us tonight. He`s a veteran trial lawyer out of the Orlando, Florida, area. We`re happy to have with us tonight Jose Baez. Mr. Baez, thank you for being with us.

JOSE BAEZ, ATTORNEY FOR CASEY ANTHONY: Thank you for having me.

GRACE: Mr. Baez, it`s my understanding that police have discounted the tipster because the tipster, a woman, could not give a flight number or a date for the flight to Atlanta. Is that true?

BAEZ: No, that`s not true at all. In fact, we know the dates. We know the airline. We know the destination. So I believe that`s all being worked out. This is the first I`m hearing that they`ve discounted it. In fact, we find it to be a very credible lead because the entire family spoke with Caylee.

GRACE: Could you give us, then, that information, the date, the airline? We know the destination was Atlanta.

BAEZ: Well, unfortunately, I wrote it down and I don`t have it with me right now. But I do know that that is a very credible lead. And some of the things that -- what we find very credible about it is, A, it`s an entire family. It`s not just one person. B, the information that was gathered -- apparently, the way Caylee said her name is what really is encouraging the family because only the family would know exactly how she would say her name and...

GRACE: Without the H, "Antony."

BAEZ: Exactly. Antony, exactly. And not only that, she also includes her middle name when she says her name. When someone asks her what`s her name, she says, Caylee Marie Anthony.

GRACE: Marie. Well, anyone who`s watched this news story knows her name is Caylee Marie Anthony.

BAEZ: Yes, but someone -- you know, you`d have to make the conclusion that she wouldn`t just say Caylee Anthony. And also the "Antony" is also very encouraging. We`re also -- you know, this all happened in an airport, so we`re going to be able to verify certain things. But everything that we`ve -- all the information we`ve been given and everything indicates that this seems to be a credible lead.

GRACE: Well, sheriff`s investigators have told our producers that the tip does not lead them to be optimistic because, again, they state that there`s not a flight number, that there is not a date. And I find that very -- you know, that`s a complete dichotomy with what you`re telling me.

BAEZ: It certainly sounds that way.

GRACE: But you cannot remember even the flight carrier? You don`t know if it was Delta or Airtran coming out of Orlando?

BAEZ: I believe it was Airtran, but unfortunately...

GRACE: Well, that narrows it down to just a few flights a day, then.

BAEZ: Correct. No, I -- like I said, I wrote it down. I have it in my file. I didn`t know I was going to be asked about that, just, you know, the exact information. But I know for a fact that we have that information and we`re following through with it and following up.

GRACE: Question. When the tipster asked the little girl her name, did the tipster know that Caylee Anthony was missing?

BAEZ: No, she did not.

GRACE: And so she only put two and two together after seeing news reports.

BAEZ: Correct.

GRACE: Question. Why did she not go to police? Why did she contact Casey Anthony directly?

BAEZ: I believe she tried contacting police through the tip line, and unfortunately, we`ve had a couple of reports that they`re not -- they weren`t able to get through. And this isn`t the first person we`ve heard this from. So they took it a step further and contacted the Anthonys directly.

GRACE: Interesting because we`ve called the tip line and we got straight through. I want to ask you a couple of questions regarding your client. And I completely understand the attorney-client privilege. It`s my understanding that your client will not meet with police until she`s granted immunity. Is that true?

BAEZ: That`s totally not true. That`s 100 percent false. And I heard that in the beginning of your broadcast, and I was hoping to have an opportunity to clear that up. We have never, ever, ever told the police, Look, she`ll talk, but only if she`s released or granted immunity. Nothing like that ever transpired, and I...

GRACE: Well, Mr. Baez, why hasn`t she spoken and sat down with police since she was first interrogated?

BAEZ: Well, the police have not contacted me with any specific information that they want to ask her. I`ve instructed the police, and I even sent -- after there was a whole debate of going back and forth as to what I said and what they said, I decided to put it down on paper. I sent them a letter explaining to them, Look, I`m willing to have her accessible to you. We`re willing to assist in the search, so long as it`s concentrating on the search and not on her prosecution.

GRACE: Well, you know, it`s interesting...

BAEZ: I can`t expose my client to that.

GRACE: ... because Orange County sheriff`s deputy Carlos Padilla (ph) says that you, Jose Baez, have not returned detectives` calls to set up a meeting.

BAEZ: That`s untrue. And Mr. Padilla and I have had a couple of disagreements over the last week, and this is just another one of those.

GRACE: Well, if you`re agreeing to meet with them with your client, then why hasn`t it happened?

BAEZ: Well, you`d have to ask the detectives that. I mean, they`re the detectives. They`re supposed to be investigating this case. I don`t know what they`re doing, but it appears from every report that I get that they`re just simply concentrating on prosecuting Casey. For example...

GRACE: Well, don`t you believe, if that were true, Mr. Baez, that they would leap at the chance to be alone with you and your client in a squad car driving around town in a search for Caylee?

BAEZ: Well, they haven`t requested that, so maybe you`re a little bit ahead of them.

GRACE: So Padilla is completely lying when he says you have not returned his phone calls?

BAEZ: One hundred percent. One hundred percent.

GRACE: A couple of questions about your client`s earlier statements to police, for instance, claiming that she dropped her daughter, little Caylee, off at a baby-sitter`s house on June the 9th, and when she came back, they were gone.

BAEZ: Correct.

GRACE: Well, that`s not true.

BAEZ: Well, you know, I wasn`t privy to the conversations that she`s had with police. My conversations with her is that she dropped the baby off with the baby-sitter and she has not seen her since. And that`s...

GRACE: So she told you that, as well? Because her mother told us on air that that was her story, when, in fact, police did track down the so- called baby-sitter, Zenaida Gonzalez, who says she never even met Caylee or Casey Anthony and has never baby-sat for them ever in life.

BAEZ: And you can also refer to the same police report, where it says they showed her a photograph of the person they spoke with, and my client said that that is not the Zenaida Gonzalez.

GRACE: I`m sorry. I couldn`t hear you. Your client said what?

BAEZ: If you refer -- I guess you`re referring to the police report. But in that same police report, it states that they showed a photograph to my client and she stated that that was not Zenaida Gonzalez, the same Zenaida Gonzalez.

GRACE: She also told the police that the apartment where she dropped the child off -- she showed them the apartment -- that apartment has been vacant since February 29, Mr. Baez.

BAEZ: I`ve certainly heard -- I`ve seen that in the report, and that`s what the police are saying she said. I- unfortunately, she is locked up right now. I haven`t had the opportunity to go with her to specific locations to show me where she told the police that she dropped the child off and to verify a lot of these things. Unfortunately...

GRACE: You have had the opportunity to meet with her. You were in court with her...

BAEZ: Absolutely.

GRACE: ... and you also had time to prepare with her. And the jail allows attorney-client visits. You have had the opportunity to meet with her, so...

BAEZ: I didn`t say I haven`t had the opportunity to meet with her. I said I haven`t had the opportunity to go to these places with her to verify that what the police are saying she told them is the truth.

GRACE: So you`re...

BAEZ: Unfortunately...

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: ... the theory that the police may be...

BAEZ: I`m sorry? I`m sorry. I couldn`t hear you. I was talking over you.

GRACE: So you`re functioning under the belief that the police have fabricated this?

BAEZ: No, no. I`m under the belief and it`s my experience that, number one, you don`t always believe everything you read in a police report. You verify it and you do your job and you do your investigation. So that`s part of my investigation that I have not had the opportunity to do yet because my client is locked up. And the only one who can take me to where she took the police would be my client. And I`m hoping to have the opportunity to do that relatively shortly.

GRACE: Well, another thing that is concerning, Mr. Baez -- everyone, with us tonight is the attorney for Caylee`s mom, Casey Anthony, a veteran trial lawyer, Jose Baez, joining us out of the Orlando, Florida, jurisdiction. It`s my understanding that she also told police she worked at Universal Studios and actually took them there, all the way there in the car, got out of the car, walked up to where she said she worked, and then finally turns around and says, You know what? I don`t work here. As it turns out, she was fired from there. So why would she lie about something as innocent as where she worked?

BAEZ: You know, again, that`s another -- that goes along the same lines. I don`t know if she actually told that to the police. I don`t know if that actually occurred the way they say it occurred. And I`d like to certainly look into that a little bit further. If there are audio recordings of their conversations, I`d like to be able to play them for my client and ask her about those things. But that is part of the process of defending a case. And that`s part of the things that I, unfortunately, because we`re not at the discovery phase, haven`t had the opportunity to do.

GRACE: You don`t have to be in the discovery phase preparing for trial to find out the truth from your client.

BAEZ: Well, you have to be in the discovery phase to get everything you need from the police, like audio recordings, so that way, you can go over them with your client and verify the accuracy...

GRACE: Mr. Baez...

BAEZ: ... or any interpretations or to see if any of this stuff was taken out of context.

GRACE: Yes. Mr. Baez...

BAEZ: That`s part of the job.

GRACE: ... where was your client for the four weeks that Caylee has been missing?

BAEZ: That`s -- part of that is some of the things that I simply can`t discuss because it`s protected by attorney-client privilege.

GRACE: But why? Why is that a secret, if she wants to find her little girl alive?

GRACE: Well, I`m certain -- you know, you`re an attorney, as well, and you wouldn`t violate the attorney-client privilege...

GRACE: I would want to find the little girl alive, Mr. Baez!

BAEZ: I`m a little confused as to why you would ask that question.

GRACE: Because I want to find Caylee alive.

BAEZ: If she knows where...

GRACE: And obviously, you and your client do not.

BAEZ: She does not know where Caylee is and...

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is not the news you wanted though, Cindy.

ANTHONY: Well, of course not. Of course not. This is ridiculous. I didn`t want anybody to think that my daughter did anything to harm her child because she hasn`t.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) in the car (INAUDIBLE)

ANTHONY: I already documented that. You guys look back in the (INAUDIBLE) what I told you about the car and the smell and why it stunk so bad.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They`re saying about in the trunk of the car.

ANTHONY: There was a bag of pizza for, what, 12 days in the back of the car, full of maggots, and it stunk so bad. You know how hot it`s been. That smell was terrible.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Cindy, but these dogs are trained to find dead bodies, Cindy.

ANTHONY: The same dogs that cleared our house cleared (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But they`re not saying the house is cleared.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: The case becoming more and more bizarre, but at the heart of it is this 2-year-old little girl, Caylee Anthony. With us tonight, her mother`s lawyer. Jose Baez, the attorney for Casey Anthony, is with us.

And we are taking your calls. Out to the lines. Sharon in Alabama. Hi, Sharon.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. Thank you for taking my call.

GRACE: Yes, ma`am.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I would like to know if the police have checked the local hospitals to see if Caylee has ever been brought into the ER for any reason.

GRACE: To Rory O`Neill with Metro Networks. What do we know? I specifically asked a question the other night regarding whether DFACS, department of family and children`s services, had ever been called in and was told point-blank no, no reports from DFACS. But what about local hospitals? Have they been checked, Rory?

O`NEILL: I haven`t seen anything particular. I would assume that`s part of the standard procedure, but no specific reports of them investigating hospitals.

GRACE: Mike Brooks, what about it?

MIKE BROOKS, FORMER D.C. POLICE, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: ... be part of the initial investigation, Nancy, absolutely, especially on a missing person`s case like this, to make sure no one`s been to the hospital with any kind of injuries.

GRACE: Back to Jose Baez, the attorney for Casey Anthony. Sir, you keep telling me over and over that your client, the mother, does not know where Caylee is.

BAEZ: Correct.

GRACE: Where did she leave her?

BAEZ: With the baby-sitter. And we believe...

GRACE: What baby-sitter?

BAEZ: ... she`s been kidnapped. Zenaida Fernandez (ph) Gonzalez.

GRACE: Where?

BAEZ: She gave me a specific location. I`ve -- all I have is an address. But I want to verify...

GRACE: What`s the address?

BAEZ: I certainly don`t have it with me, if that`s what you`re looking to get.

GRACE: You don`t want me to know it because it`s the same place the cops went and checked out and she didn`t live there. It was vacant.

BAEZ: No, that`s not the case.

GRACE: Then what is it?

BAEZ: Well, you know, if you had told me you were going to ask me this question, I would have certainly had it with me and...

GRACE: I would assume you would know the facts like the back of your hand.

BAEZ: Well, you know, that`s why -- I`m human. I write with a pen and paper. And that`s -- hello?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTHONY: America can think what they want, as long as they continue to look for my granddaughter. You know, I don`t care what America thinks of me. If they think that I`m a (DELETED) because I`m standing up to the media that want to attack me, OK, if they want to take the focus on this face, if they want to do that, they can live with themselves, OK? I don`t care what they think about me. As long as this picture gets out and people like this lady, who keeps trying to get through to the authorities that swears to God she saw my granddaughter alive.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: The tip line in this case, 800-423-TIPS, 423-8477.

Straight back out to Jose Baez, the attorney for the girl`s mom, Casey Anthony. Your client, according to you, says she dropped her child off on June 9. But that`s not true. The grandmother saw them together on June 15.

BAEZ: Yes. Absolutely. Apparently, they were mistaken on those dates. Everyone seemed to be mistaken on those dates. And we certainly were able to confirm that the time has been shorter than that.

GRACE: Well, don`t you think your client should know the last time she was with her own daughter?

BAEZ: Well, everyone who -- since this was so long ago, it was just simply a confusion...

GRACE: It was last month!

BAEZ: ... of dates.

GRACE: It was last month!

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Prosecutors say the case of a missing 2-year- old Florida girl is beginning to look like a homicide.

Caylee Anthony was last seen more than a month ago but was reported missing just last week. Her mother, 22-year-old Casey Anthony, is considered a person of interest in the case.

Now investigators searched her car. And at a hearing yesterday a detective testified that her car smelled of death.

Investigators say they found a stain, dirt and what seems to be Caylee`s hair in the car`s trunk.

Caylee`s mother is currently charged with child neglect and obstruction. Her bond is set at half a million dollars.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRACE: With us tonight is the attorney for Caylee`s mother, Casey Anthony. Jose Baez is joining us out of Orlando, Florida.

So, Mr. Baez, you are telling me point blank your client nor you have asked for immunity for her?

JOSE BAEZ, ATTORNEY FOR MISSING TOT`S MOTHER CASEY ANTHONY: Absolutely not.

GRACE: Under any circumstance?

BAEZ: Under any circumstance.

GRACE: And you claim the fact you have not met with her and investigators is simply a failure in communication?

BAEZ: No. I don`t think that they`re -- for some reason, you know, there`s a lot going back and forth, and -- but I`ve reached out to them. I`ve expressed it, I put it in writing, and.

GRACE: Well, actually, sir.

BAEZ: . they have yet to respond.

GRACE: Our control room has them on the phone right now.

BAEZ: Perfect.

GRACE: And they`re happy to arrange a meeting between you, your client and police. When would you like to do it?

BAEZ: Well, I -- where are they? Put them on the phone. Let`s talk.

GRACE: Give me a date and a time.

BAEZ: Well, I`ll meet them at the jail right now. If they have.

GRACE: Well.

BAEZ: If they have any credible belief.

GRACE: Can you wait for about 10 minutes.

BAEZ: Hold on a second, hold on.

GRACE: . until we get to commercial break.

BAEZ: Again, I didn`t hear you because I was talking. If they have any credible leads that they want to bounce me -- they want me to bounce off of my client, they can meet me at the jail in about half an hour. And I`d be more hand happy to go inside, talk to my client and find out exactly what the answer is to any of those leads that will help find Caylee.

GRACE: So will you sit down with you, your client and police, and go through the evidence?

BAEZ: If there`s any leads they want me to go over. Now I`m not -- I`m not going to be there to prosecute my client or to assist them in prosecuting my client. I will be there to.

GRACE: How about assisting in finding Caylee?

BAEZ: I will be there to ensure that my client`s rights are protected. But I`m there to help find Caylee. That`s the only reason I`d be willing to meet with law enforcement.

GRACE: Because, it`s 8:32.

BAEZ: Not for anything other than trying to Caylee.

GRACE: It`s 8:32.40 and that`s the first time tonight, sir, that you have stated you`re here to help find Caylee.

BAEZ: Well, I -- no, no, apparently on your show, because I`ve been saying it all along. I -- you might be able to (INAUDIBLE) in the times on that one.

GRACE: Good to know. Good to know.

Out to the lines, to Martha in Tennessee. Hi, Martha?

MARTHA, TENNESSEE RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy this is Martha Dugger(ph).

GRACE: Hello. Nice to talk to you. What`s your question, dear?

MARTHA: First of all, I want to say thank you for all you do for victims and God bless you.

I`d like to know, could it be possible that she had Caylee buried in the backyard and then dug her up and put her in the back of the car?

GRACE: Interesting theory, Martha Dugger, joining us out of Tennessee.

To Mike Brooks, police now have a theory that the -- because the cadaver dogs hit in the southeast corner of the backyard -- of the grandmother and the mother`s back yard.

MIKE BROOKS, FMR. DC POLICE DETECTIVE SERVED ON FBI TERRORISM TASK FORCE: Right.

GRACE: It also hit in the trunk of the mother`s car over the right taillight.

BROOKS: Right.

GRACE: Their theory is -- explain.

BROOKS: There`s a very good possibility that could be true, Nancy, because, number one, in the trunk of that car, you had a stain. They used an alternate light source and they`re doing additional testing. But that stain came up positive. They use an ultra light source.

They also had hair from Caylee. They also had dirt. Now they can take a comparison of the dirt that was in the trunk and the dirt from that back yard, do a soil comparison to see if, possibly, there was transference from that scene in the backyard into the car.

And they`re also not saying, Nancy, what other evidence they found there at the scene. They could have found more hair, more DNA and other evidence there at the scene of the house.

GRACE: To Dr. Michael Arnall, board certified forensic pathologist, he is joining us from Denver tonight.

Dr. Arnall, thank you for being with us. Very quickly, if a body was decomposing in the trunk of Casey Anthony`s car, is it possible to find human cells from the decomposition fluids?

DR. MICHAEL ARNALL, BOARD CERTIFIED FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Yes, sure it is. Sure it is.

GRACE: Explain. How would it work?

ARNALL: If the body was placed in the trunk immediately after death, it might take a couple of days to decompose in that type of heat. During that time period, the cells that begin to slip off the body could be deposited on the carpet.

If the body had been buried in the backyard and was in the process of decomposition before it was placed in the trunk, then when it was placed in the trunk, the -- there`s a process of skin slippage and.

GRACE: Right.

ARNALL: . and softening of the tissue, that`s going to deposit on the carpet in a relatively short period of time, perhaps minutes. So there`s going to be cells and fluid from that body on the carpet.

GRACE: Dr. Arnall, yes, no -- from those fluids, from DNA, can scientists determine whether the body is dead or alive?

ARNALL: No, I don`t think they can determine.

GRACE: OK.

ARNALL: Well, in the sense, they can`t determine whether it was dead or alive when it`s placed there. But it`s obvious, if the body is decomposed, it`s dead.

GRACE: Correct. Correct.

Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining us in addition to Jose Baez, the attorney for Casey Anthony, is Susan Moss out of New York, Randy Zelin, New York, Daniel Horowitz out of San Francisco.

Susan Moss, weigh in.

SUSAN MOSS, CHILD ADVOCATE, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: If your child is missing, there isn`t anyone you wouldn`t tell your full story to again and again and again.

Her silence is deafening. This is all a bunch of hooey. And I think we`re going to find that out in the end.

GRACE: Randy Zelin?

RANDY ZELIN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: As a parent I agree with Susan. As a lawyer I couldn`t disagree more. Your obligation is to your client. Your obligation, as Jose said, is to protect the best interest of your client. You don`t help the prosecution prosecute your client.

GRACE: To Daniel Horowitz - Daniel, you and I have both been victims of violent crime. (INAUDIBLE). Weigh in.

DANIEL HOROWITZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, it seems like this case has (INAUDIBLE) Mr. Baez`s client about (INAUDIBLE).

BAEZ: . told the police, she would have told me. She is most interested in getting her daughter found. And that`s something that we`re trying and we`re focusing on right now.

GRACE: Everyone, we are switching gears -- Mr. Baez, thank you very much for being with us.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../23/ng.01.html

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NANCY GRACE
Missing Orlando Toddler 911 Calls Released
Aired July 24, 2008 - 20:00:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Police desperately searching for a beautiful little 2-year-old girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing. Little Caylee hasn`t been seen in five long weeks, last seen with her mother. So why didn`t Mommy call police?

Tonight, bombshell. A stunning 911 call released where the grandmother tells police Caylee`s mom stole both money and a car and tells police that the car now smells like a dead body. A tipster claims a new slab of concrete was poured behind the Anthony family home, this on the heels of cadaver dogs hitting on Mom`s car trunk and the grandmother`s back yard. Police so concerned, they bring in another cadaver dog, who independently hit from the same two spots.

And tonight: Caylee`s grandmother says the little girl may now have blond hair? A tipster claims she saw the 2-year-old boarding a flight to Atlanta. Was Caylee sighted in a restaurant in north Georgia? Tonight: Where is 2-year-old Caylee?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

911 OPERATOR: 911. What`s your emergency?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY, GRANDMOTHER OF MISSING CHILD: I called a little bit ago. The deputy sheriff (INAUDIBLE) I found out my granddaughter has been taken. She has been missing for a month. Her mother finally admitted that she`s been missing.

911 OPERATOR: OK, what...

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Get someone here now!

911 OPERATOR: OK. What is the address that you`re calling from?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: We`re talking about a 3-year-old little girl! My daughter finally admitted that the baby-sitter stole her. I need to find her.

911 OPERATOR: Your daughter admitted that the baby is where?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: The baby-sitter took her a month ago, that my daughter`s been looking for her. I told you my daughter was missing for a month. I just found her today, but I can`t find my granddaughter. She just admitted to me that she`s been trying to find her herself. There`s something wrong. I found my daughter`s car today, and it smells like there`s been a dead body in the damn car!

(END AUDIO CLIP)

<snip>

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Tonight, police desperately searching for a beautiful little 2- year-old Florida girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing. Little Caylee hasn`t been seen in five long weeks, last seen with her mother.

Tonight, bombshell. Stunning revelations in the 911 call reporting Caylee gone. A tipster claims a new slab of cement poured behind the Anthony home. And tonight: Caylee`s grandmother says the little girl may now have blond hair? Are any of the alleged Caylee sightings legitimate?

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

911 OPERATOR: Is your daughter there?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: I`m on the phone with them!

911 OPERATOR: Is your daughter there?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Yes.

911 OPERATOR: Can I speak with her? Do you mind if I speak with her? Thank you.

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: I called them two hours ago, and they haven`t gotten here. She finally admitted that Zanny took her a month ago (INAUDIBLE)

911 OPERATOR: Ma`am? Ma`am?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Casey (INAUDIBLE) they want to talk to you. Answer their questions.

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: Hello?

911 OPERATOR: Hello?

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes.

911 OPERATOR: Hi. What can you -- can you tell me what`s going on a little bit?

CASEY ANTHONY: I`m sorry?

911 OPERATOR: Can you tell me a little bit what`s going on?

CASEY ANTHONY: My daughter`s been missing for the last 31 days.

911 OPERATOR: And you know who has her?

CASEY ANTHONY: I know who has her. I`ve tried to contact her. I actually received a phone call today now from a number that is no longer in service. I did get to speak to my daughter for about a moment, about a minute.

911 OPERATOR: And you last saw her a month ago?

CASEY ANTHONY: Thirty-one days. Thirty-one days.

911 OPERATOR: Who has her? Do you have a name?

CASEY ANTHONY: Her name is Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez.

911 OPERATOR: Who is that, the baby-sitter?

CASEY ANTHONY: She`s been my nanny for about a year-and-a-half, almost two years.

GRACE: And why are you calling now? Why didn`t you call 31 days ago?

CASEY ANTHONY: I`ve been looking for her and have gone through other resources to try to find her, which was stupid.

911 OPERATOR: OK. Can you give me the name of the nanny again, like, spell it out for me?

CASEY ANTHONY: Zenaida, Z-E-N-A-I-D-A.

911 OPERATOR: Last name?

CASEY ANTHONY: Fernandez...

911 OPERATOR: Fernandez.

CASEY ANTHONY: ... hyphen Gonzalez. I think the officers are here.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Stunning allegations now revealed in the 911 calls placed by the grandmother -- repeat, the grandmother, not the mother.

Straight out to Mark Williams, news director with WNDB. What`s the latest?

MARK WILLIAMS, WNDB NEWSTALK 1150: Well, the latest, of course, is the revelation that they thought that -- some tipster called a local media outlet saying that concrete or pavers had been put down in the back of the Anthony`s back yard. That has turned out right now to be false. As a matter of fact, investigators were out the at scene last Friday with those cadaver dogs and moving everything and doing a lot of digging, and they don`t plan to come back. They have already cleared that back yard. And the Orange County, Florida, zoning board says they`ve never issued a permit back there.

Again, you`ve mentioned the two Caylee sightings here at the Orlando International Airport. The question is, nobody has seen the videotape or - - or -- because once you go into the Orlando International Airport, as you know, you`re on videocameras and on video screens constantly. That`s how they got astronaut Lisa Nowak earlier this year in that love triangle.

And of course, the sighting in north Georgia, in Cleveland, Georgia, where somebody thought they had a Caylee sighting. The police department went back there a couple of days ago and they talked to the wait staff, they talked to other people, and nobody could remember seeing Caylee whatsoever.

Again, the 911 tapes were released. That was the first time I had heard those tapes because as of late this afternoon, they had not been released.

And thus far, it`s a pretty interesting case, Nancy, and it has a lot of people baffled down here.

GRACE: Mark Williams, everyone, is joining us from WNDB there in Orlando. Mark, I`m sure the police have been to the Orlando airport and have looked at that videotape. As you pointed out, astronaut Lisa Nowak was caught that way. Nothing has turned up, that we know of, of little Caylee at the airport, correct?

WILLIAMS: That`s right. There`s been no release of any videotape. The authorities haven`t mentioned anything about any videotape. And thus far, if there was videotape to be had, I would think that it would be released, such as it was in the Nowak case, which came out just a couple of days after Ms. Nowak was arrested. So right now, it is an absolute mystery.

The grandmother, of course, Cindy Anthony, says her daughter`s (SIC) alive. Casey isn`t talking at all. But during a bond hearing the other day, it was one of the detectives saying that they think little Caylee is dead because they found -- the cadaver dogs hit on several different places, and of course, Casey`s Pontiac Grand Prix had that smell of decomposition in the trunk.

GRACE: Well, you know, repeatedly -- out to you, Mike Brooks, former fed with the FBI. Repeatedly, Casey`s mother, the grandmother, keeps telling me that there was nothing wrong, that she was in touch with her daughter throughout those five months (SIC), that she was just out bonding with her daughter. But that night 911 call reveals a completely different story. The grandmother`s been going on and on and on, saying there was an old pizza in the car and that`s what the dogs hit on, cadaver dogs trained to hit on nothing but human remains.

And here we have her saying that day -- it was the 14th -- July 14, she`s telling police, My car smells like there`s been a dead body in the car.

MIKE BROOKS, FORMER D.C. POLICE, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Tell you what, Nancy. She has -- she has she`s given a number of stories to both you, to "Headline Prime" news, to all different people. You know, it doesn`t add up. Her daughter`s not being truthful. You know, the other day, when I was on "Prime News," she was talking about another person that knows where she is. You know, she`s making up so many stories.

And Nancy, also, you know, with the whole airport thing, to shoot that down, you can also look on a manifest to find out if there`s an adult and a child. And also here in Atlanta, they have almost 400 cameras in Hartsfield International Airport.

You know, and the whole thing with her mother, Casey, on this 911 call -- she contradicts herself, Nancy. She said, quote, I actually received a phone call today from a number that`s no longer in service. I did get to speak to my daughter for about a moment, but for a minute." OK, she got a call today, but now it`s -- the number is no longer in service? That doesn`t make sense to me, Nancy.

GRACE: No, it makes no sense whatsoever. And Mike Brooks, having been a cop for as long as you have been, the very first thing the police would do is try to track down that number that the mother, Casey, says she received a call from and actually spoke to her little girl. They can determine was it a cell phone, was it a land line? They can get the location immediately. For Pete`s sake, you can get that off Yahoo!, for Pete`s sake!

(LAUGHTER)

GRACE: And now we`re hearing she has no idea where the woman has gone, took police to the wrong location where the woman allegedly lived. And they`ve actually found -- police found Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez, and she says, I`ve never met them in my life.

BROOKS: Exactly. She`s been -- she has not told one thing that`s been -- that hasn`t been a lie to police. And you know, her mother -- if her mother has information, too, Nancy, she can also be charged with obstruction of justice, if she has some information. You know, and this whole thing about the pizza? I don`t care if you`ve got pizza with sausage, pepperoni and Limburger cheese on it, it`s not going to smell like decomposing flesh. I know that smell. It`s a smell that you never forget.

GRACE: Back to Mark Williams with WNDB, joining us tonight out of Orlando. We also hear in the 911 calls -- just released, everyone. We`re going to play them again for you in just a moment -- the grandmother actually says Caylee`s mom stole not only money but her car.

WILLIAMS: You know, and that`s the information that apparently came out just today, and apparently also took some credit cards and started a shopping binge. So that`s being investigated right now. And why would you take a car and park it in a parking lot just to be towed later or impounded by police so they could go through the thing? And the thing that really strikes me strange is the fact that she waited 31 days before she called 911 here in Orange County.

GRACE: Speaking of the 911 call, take a listen.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: We can`t find my granddaughter -- 5-foot 1-and-a- half.

911 OPERATOR: Thin, medium or heavy built?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Thin.

911 OPERATOR: Color hair?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Brown.

911 OPERATOR: What color shirt is she wearing?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: White.

911 OPERATOR: What color pants?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Oh, they`re shorts. They`re plaid. They`re, like, pink and teal and white and black plaid.

911 OPERATOR: Does she have any weapons on her?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: No.

911 OPERATOR: Is she not telling you where her daughter is?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Correct.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

911 OPERATOR: OK, did you guys call and report a vehicle stolen?

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes, my mom did.

911 OPERATOR: OK. So is it a vehicle stolen, too?

CASEY ANTHONY: No, this was my vehicle.

911 OPERATOR: What vehicle was stolen?

CASEY ANTHONY: It`s a `98 Pontiac Sunfire.

911 OPERATOR: OK. I have deputies on the way to you right now for that. But now your 3-year-old daughter is missing, Caylee Anthony.

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes, Caylee Marie Anthony.

911 OPERATOR: White female.

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes, white female.

911 OPERATOR: Three years old, 8/9/2005 is her date of birth?

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

911 OPERATOR: 911. What`s your emergency?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: I called a little bit ago. The deputy sheriff (INAUDIBLE) I found out my granddaughter has been taken. She has been missing for a month. Her mother finally admitted that she`s been missing.

911 OPERATOR: OK, what...

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Get someone here now!

911 OPERATOR: OK. What is the address that you`re calling from?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: We`re talking about a 3-year-old little girl! My daughter finally admitted that the baby-sitter stole her. I need to find her.

911 OPERATOR: Your daughter admitted that the baby is where?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: The baby-sitter took her a month ago, that my daughter`s been looking for her. I told you my daughter was missing for a month. I just found her today, but I can`t find my granddaughter. She just admitted to me that she`s been trying to find her herself. There`s something wrong. I found my daughter`s car today, and it smells like there`s been a dead body in the damn car!

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Straight back out to Mark Williams with WNDB, Newstalk 1150. Mark, did I hear you say the mom went on a shopping binge?

WILLIAMS: According to some statements that have been made today, Casey Anthony apparently stole her mother`s credit card, unknowingly, of course, to her mother and went on a shopping binge. That is one of the things that we learned today. Don`t know what the amount was, don`t know what they`re talking about, but apparently, police are kind of keeping mum on that.

GRACE: To Dr. Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst and author. Bethany, do you hear that? The baby is gone. The baby is gone, OK? And the mom goes on a shopping binge. Help me, please.

BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST: Sadly, I am not surprised. Nancy, you know the number one reason why women kill their babies or commit infanticide.

GRACE: No.

MARSHALL: It`s because they feel that the child is holding them back from an idealized life, either holding them back from the will love of a man or keeping them at home. That is the number one reason. So this completely fits the profile.

And then with pathological lying, which we know she is, the MO is to deceive and to violate the rights of others and to get your way. She probably had a long history of violating the rights of her own mother and the rights of her own child, and now we`re just seeing the aftereffects.

GRACE: Let`s unleash the lawyers. We`re taking your calls live. With us tonight, Eleanor Dixon, Atlanta, Richard Herman, New York, Mickey Sherman, New York. Mickey Sherman, how are you going to explain your client, when the baby has been stolen, is out on a shopping binge?

MICKEY SHERMAN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You know, I only hope that the baby has been stolen by someone because the baby`s going to be in better hands than these two loons.

GRACE: Shopping binge?

SHERMAN: It`s bizarre. There`s nothing you can do to rationally explain anything either one of these women, the mother or the grandmother, has done. But by the same token, they still don`t have any physical evidence that harm has been done to this child. I mean, everyone has these stories that it smells like a dead body. No proof that of that. The cadaver dogs didn`t find anything...

GRACE: The best witness I ever put on the stand...

SHERMAN: Dogs.

GRACE: ... was a dog.

SHERMAN: Always. You can`t beat them. But here the dogs still have found nothing.

GRACE: To you, Richard Herman. How are you going to explain the shopping binge?

RICHARD HERMAN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, it`s ridiculous. Like Mickey said, both she and her mother...

GRACE: No, no, no, no.

HERMAN: They look...

GRACE: You`re the defense lawyer.

HERMAN: ... nuts to me.

GRACE: You`re supposed to...

HERMAN: I`m not going to explain it.

GRACE: ... explain it.

HERMAN: I`m not going to explain it. She`s not going to say anything. She`s not talking to the police. Her lawyer cannot let them talk to the police. There`s something wrong with this woman.

GRACE: Well...

HERMAN: Thirty-one days!

GRACE: ... you`re right on that. They`re not talking to police. And to you Eleanor Dixon, felony prosecutor. What will they say about this newly discovered shopping binge while the baby is allegedly gone?

ELEANOR DIXON, PROSECUTOR: I think it just goes to the mom`s motive. And think about it, Nancy. They can go look at her credit card records and everything else regarding those stores and place her where the baby wasn`t.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They are saying that...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you know what they`re saying about in the trunk of the car?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: There was a bag of pizza for, what, 12 days in the back of the car, full of maggots. It stunk so bad. You know how hot it`s been. That smell was terrible.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: To Tracy Sargent. She`s here with her detection dog, Cinco. They`re both from Homeland Security. Tracy, do cadaver dogs actually alert on food, ever?

TRACY SARGENT, K-9 HANDLER: No, ma`am, they do not. That`s one of the training things we do with these dogs, that any distraction we might find out there, they are trained off of that. They are only to alert to humane remains scent.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: There`s something wrong. I found my daughter`s car today and it smells like there`s been a dead body in the damn car.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: We are taking your calls live. Let`s go out to the lines. Ashley in New Mexico. Hi, Ashley.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy.

GRACE: What`s your question, dear?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. Yes. I was wondering, has anyone bothered to question if there were any signs of jealousy between -- of the bond between Caylee and the grandparents?

GRACE: That`s an excellent question. What do we know, Mike Brooks?

BROOKS: Really don`t know too much. You know, the grandmother -- the whole story, Nancy, as you say, if you look at the emotion of the grandmother -- you know, before she said, oh, you know, no, she knew where she was. You know, but we really don`t know what the relationship was between the two.

GRACE: Joining us right now, friend of Casey Anthony Tara Graff. Tara, thank you for being with us. You`re a close friend of Casey`s. What do you make of all of this?

TARA GRAFF, FRIEND OF CASEY ANTHONY: Oh! First of all, I`d like to say please forgive my speech. I`m pretty scared to be interviewed. I don`t know -- I don`t want to offend anyone. And if you hear anything in the background, it`s my daughter, so -- I can answer that question that that viewer had right now.

GRACE: Please do.

GRAFF: Well, the last time I heard from Casey, we had talked about that. And hopefully, nobody gets upset (ph), but most of it`s personal. But you know, like, I have a daughter. I`m 21 years old. And it was the same type of arguments that any mother and daughter would have. You know, like, me and my mother would argue about, you know, if there`s -- if she -- my mother wants to give my daughter juice, and I don`t want to give her juice.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When was the last time you saw Caylee?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Well, I thought it was June the 8th. I was adamant it was June the 8th. I know for a fact it`s June 15. The day I shot that video was the last time I saw Caylee, and I believed that I had shot it on the 8th, and now that I found out I shot it on the 15th, I know that was the last time that I saw -- that I saw.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: That would have been Father`s Day. This little girl now missing five long weeks. Joining us right now is a friend of the mom`s, Casey. Her little girl, Caylee, is who you`re looking at right now.

Out to Tara Graff. Tara, I understand that you spoke to her phone in mid-June and you heard Caylee in the background.

GRAFF: Yes.

GRACE: And do you have any idea where Casey was during the five weeks she was gone?

GRAFF: No. No, absolutely not. I do know that she had been visiting friends, other friends of ours.

GRACE: What friends?

GRAFF: I don`t know specifically. But I know that, you know -- we just -- we hang out with everybody, so...

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GRACE: Where was your client for the four weeks that Caylee has been missing?

JOSE BAEZ, ATTORNEY FOR MISSING TOT`S MOTHER CASEY ANTHONY: That`s -- part of that is some of the things that I simply can`t discuss because it`s protected by attorney/client privilege.

GRACE: But why, why is that a secret if she wants to find her little girl alive?

BAEZ: Well, I`m certain -- you know, you`re an attorney as well and you wouldn`t violate the attorney/client privilege. I`m a little.

GRACE: I would want to find the little girl alive, Mr. Baez.

BAEZ: I`m a little confused as to why you would ask that question.

GRACE: Because, I want to find Caylee alive and, obviously.

BAEZ: And she knows where.

GRACE: . you and your client do not.

BAEZ: She does not know where Caylee is.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRACE: Joining us tonight is our panel and along with us tonight a friend of the mom, Casey`s.

With us Tara Graff -- Tara, you stated that Casey was with a group of your friends, various friends, during these five weeks she was lost in combat. What friend?

TARA GRAFF, FRIEND OF CASEY ANTHONY: No, I meant that -- so far as I know she would visit some friends. I mean I don`t know any specifics. She never told me. That`s not something that we discussed so.

GRACE: Have any of the friends come forward and said, yes, she was staying here?

GRAFF: No, I don`t -- as far as I know I don`t know any of that. That`s not what we discussed last time I talked to her.

GRACE: What were you guys talking about?

GRAFF: Well, we just talked about some personal stuff. We talked about some relationship advice and my daughter`s -- well, you can hear her right now, but my daughter`s upcoming birthday. And Caylee was playing in the background and ever so often Casey would tell me to hold on because she was playing with Caylee.

Casey did talk, you know, like I told you, about some of what her mom and her were into. But it wasn`t anything out of the ordinary, you know.

GRACE: What was -- when you say what they were into, you mean what they were arguing about?

GRAFF: Yes, just those things that she was dealing -- you know.

GRACE: What, what were they arguing about?

GRAFF: You know, I mean, it was just little things like, you know, I can`t get into any specifics, but.

GRACE: Why?

GRAFF: It is like -- OK, like juice, kind of thing. It was like, oh -- I don`t -- because I honestly don`t really remember everything.

GRACE: OK, why can`t you get into specifics?

GRAFF: I`m nervous, because I don`t remember them. I`m sorry.

GRACE: OK.

GRAFF: I was really -- I was talking to her -- I was talking more than her and I wasn`t really listening, unfortunately.

GRACE: OK. What do you make of her going on a shopping binge using her mother`s credit card?

GRAFF: That`s the first I`ve heard of that. I don`t know. I can`t explain that. I know -- I don`t think that we have all of the facts from that, I mean.

GRACE: Tara, did she have a job?

GRAFF: That`s -- that touches personally with me. So far as I knew she did but now I`m just -- I`m just, along with the rest of America right now, because.

GRACE: What did she present was your job to you?

GRAFF: (INAUDIBLE) Universal.

GRACE: OK. Well, she was fired from that a couple of years ago so that`s not true. Do you know -- did you ever see a nanny with Caylee?

GRAFF: No, but I`ve watched Caylee sometimes. And our other friends have watched Caylee sometimes.

GRACE: So you -- do you than she had a nanny? Do you know of a nanny?

GRAFF: Baby-sitter, nanny, I mean, it`s all kind of the same thing.

GRACE: Well, then, do you know of a specific baby-sitter? Casey told her.

GRAFF: No.

GRACE: . told people that she had the same baby-sitter or nanny for a year and a half.

GRAFF: No, I don`t -- I don`t know anything about that, I`m sorry.

GRACE: Did you guys hang out in person?

GRAFF: Yes, we have, a couple of times. I mean we -- you know we`ve gone dancing. We`ve hung out at mall. We`ve gone for walks with Caylee. We`ve hung out at the mall mostly sometimes.

GRACE: Who was really raising Caylee? Was it Casey or her mother?

GRAFF: Oh gosh, Casey. Caylee was with Casey all of the time.

GRACE: OK.

GRAFF: Always.

GRACE: So you have no idea where she was those five weeks that she was missing?

GRAFF: I`m in Michigan. I`m -- my husband and I.

GRACE: So would that be no?

GRAFF: No. I`m sorry, no.

GRACE: No. OK.

We are taking your calls live. Out to Laura in Missouri, hi, Laura.

LAURA, MISSOURI RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy.

GRACE: What`s your question, dear?

LAURA: I would like to know, last night`s show, you asked the mother, lawyer, why he had not talking to the police and they were supposed to meet a half an hour after the show. And I was just wondering if they talked to him and if anything got resolved at all?

GRACE: Laura, Laura?

LAURA: Yes.

GRACE: I`m sorry to report to you that they did not meet with police. Didn`t even get close to meeting with police. And Mr. Baez was set to clear all that up tonight. But about two minutes before air, just after the 911 tapes were released, he decided not to give a statement after hearing the 911 tapes.

He says -- here`s his statement. He hasn`t had time to review them but he is disappointed that the police are focusing and allowing the tapes to be distributed instead of looking for Caylee.

Speaking of looking for Caylee, Mark Williams, the two reports of sightings are the police -- or the report at airport and report at a restaurant named The Cottage in White County in north Georgia, correct?

MARK WILLIAMS, NEWS DIRECTOR, WNDB NEWSTALK 1150: That`s correct.

GRACE: And to Mike Brooks, if it were at the airport, if that were true, there would be video. Trust me that one.

MIKE BROOKS, FMR. DC POLICE DETECTIVE SERVED ON FBI TERRORISM TASK FORCE: Oh.

GRACE: You were a fed for years and at White County police went to the location.

BROOKS: Right.

GRACE: They interviewed everybody there that worked there -- restaurant patrons, you name it. Nobody could remember anything about it. But Baez, the attorney, and the grandmother keep saying police aren`t doing their job. Police aren`t doing their job. What else can they do?

BROOKS: Baez couldn`t even remember what airline she was supposed to have been on flying from Orlando to Atlanta. I wasn`t real impressed with the guy last night, I have to say, Nancy, with all the attorneys we`ve had on here.

And you know, all he has to do -- go over to the jail, get his client, sit down with police, and let her tell her story. But he doesn`t want to do that. He`s too busy running his pie hole in the media and not wanting to find the baby. Period.

GRACE: I want to go out to Dr. David Posey, medical examiner, forensic pathologist with the Glen Oaks Pathology Medical Group.

Dr. Posey, the most convincing evidence to me at this juncture is that two independent cadaver dogs hit on two of the same spots, the very same spots. They brought one cadaver dog in, took him and the trainer away. Brought in another cadaver dog and the trainer, did to the reveal what the other dog had done.

The two dogs hit on the same spots. That being the trunk of Casey`s car over the right -- the right rear window, right rear tag and light. And also in the backyard of the grandmother.

Could anything other than a decomposing body have alerted the dog?

DR. DAVID M. POSEY, MEDICAL EXAMINER, GLEN OAKS PATHOLOGY MEDICAL GROUP: No, I don`t believe so. As already been stated, the smell of a decomposing body is distinct by itself. And I think the dogs are well trained to do that and I can`t think of anything else that would cause a similar smell unless by chance an animal was transported in that vehicle. But I think we`re probably thinking of something else.

GRACE: To Mike Brooks, cadaver dogs are trained to hit specifically on human remains. They will not alert on animal remains.

BROOKS: No, they will not, Nancy. And you know this whole concrete slab thing also, you can smell -- cadaver dogs can also detect scent through a concrete slab. But there was a new concrete slab there, and depending on the aggregate, the size of the pebbles that size made up the concrete, they would be able to do that.

And if they have any questions, Nancy, they could also use ground penetrating radar. I`ve used that with the FBI (INAUDIBLE) response team and you can use it to look through concrete.

GRACE: Back to Mark Williams, with WNDB Newstalk 1150.

Mark, the Anthony family came forward with a tipster regarding the alleged flight to Atlanta, spotting Caylee there.

Have police spoken to the tipster?

WILLIAMS: I`m not sure if they have or not. I think that`s still up in the air. But thing that gets me is the fact that some of these tipsters are calling the Anthony family directly instead of calling investigators here in Orange County.

Investigators in Orange County are a top-notch group of people. I worked the news media here. I have seen some of them. I`ve talked to some them. Carlos Padilla, who`s the PIO, is a straight-forward guy. They`re doing their job.

GRACE: Out to Bethany Marshall, what do you think, based on what you have heard so far, Bethany?

BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST, AUTHOR OF "DEALBREAKERS": Well, I mean, I think what I said about often women commit homicide because they have the fantasy that this child is holding them back from a single lifestyle.

I would wonder what did she spend the money on when she went on that spending spree? Was it things associated with being free and single? That would be the number one question I would have on my mind.

GRACE: The stunning 911 calls released just as we go to air tonight reveal a very different story about the disappearance of little Caylee.

As we go to break, a special happy birthday to one of our show`s biggest fans, Michigan friend of the show, Paula Swain. Isn`t she beautiful? Wife and mother of eight, Paula totally deaf her whole life watches our show every night on closed captioning.

Happy 82nd birthday, dear Paula.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: 911, what`s your emergency?

CINDY ANTHONY, MISSING 2-YEAR-OLD`S GRANDMOTHER: I called a little bit ago. The deputy sheriff I found out my granddaughter has been taken. She has been missing for a month. Her mother finally admitted that she`s been missing.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: OK, what is.

ANTHONY: Get someone here now.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: OK. What is the address that you`re calling from?

ANTHONY: We`re talking about a 3-year-old little girl. My daughter finally admitted that the babysitter stole her. I need to find her.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: Your daughter admitted that the baby is where?

ANTHONY: That the babysitter took her a month ago that my daughter`s been looking for her. I told you my daughter`s been missing for a month. I just found her today but I can`t find my granddaughter. She just admitted to me that she`s been trying to find her herself.

There`s something wrong. I found my daughter`s car today and it smells like there`s been a dead body in the damn car.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWSBREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTHONY: I have a 3-year-old that`s been missing for a month.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: A 3-year-old?

ANTHONY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: Have you reported that?

ANTHONY: I`m trying to do that now, ma`am.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: OK, what did the person do that you need arrested?

ANTHONY: My daughter.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: For what?

ANTHONY: For stealing an auto and stealing money.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Not to mention the 2-year-old little girl who is missing, little Caylee.

We`re taking your calls live.

Before I take you to North Carolina and the story of Nancy Cooper, the missing mom found dead, I want to take your calls on this story.

Out to Patricia in Florida, hi, Patricia.

PATRICIA, FLORIDA RESIDENT: Hi, how are you?

GRACE: I`m good, dear, what`s your question?

PATRICIA: Actually, I`m curious about the nanny. There -- you know nannies have to be paid. Is there any kind of a paper trail, checks, money orders? They found her car at an (INAUDIBLE) which is a cash -- check cashing place.

GRACE: You know what that`s a very good point.

What about it, to you, Eleanor Dixon?

ELEANOR DIXON, PROSECUTOR: I think that is a good point and they certainly could check that but I think the best piece of evidence we heard tonight is that the mom`s friend said that Caylee was always with her mom. She never left her. So I wonder if there was really a nanny at all.

GRACE: And Mike Brooks, former fed with the FBI, we also know that the grandmother says that she never saw the nanny. And in the year and a half the daughter claims that she worked for her, she never saw her.

BROOKS: No, the grandmother they -- she would know and so would her friends, the people closest to her, Nancy. But I`m really going to be anxious to find out what the results of the test that they`ve done on the stain that was in that truck -- in that trunk. And also the hair that looked like they said it probably came from -- from Caylee and also the dirt that they found in that car. That`s going to be critical forensic evidence.


(continued below)

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../24/ng.01.html

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GRACE: Let`s unleash the lawyers, Eleanor Dixon, Richard Herman and Mickey Sherman.

To you, Richard Herman, last night, I accused the defense attorney of hiding behind the attorney/client privilege because he refuses to answer questions. He refuses to allow his client to speak with police.

Isn`t it true, Richard, that there`s an ongoing crime, such as kidnap, and your client knows about it -- aren`t you covering up a crime?

RICHARD HERMAN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Not covering up a crime, Nancy. It`s not Grace Law. It`s the United States of America. And he`s representing his client and he`s protecting her interests, and, look, you see, this woman looks like she`s going a loose screw. Her mother`s, her bias. She has no credibility -- the mother. The two of them hate each other.

He`s got to protect this woman. It`s a very serious case. It`s a tragedy. They must find this girl hoping she`s still alive but he has to protect his client, Nancy. Very serious.

GRACE: Mickey, I hope you`ve got a different answer.

MICKEY SHERMAN, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY, AUTHOR OF "HOW CAN YOU DEFEND THOSE PEOPLE?": A little bit. You know you`re assuming that the lawyer`s being told the truth by the client. And I`ve got to tell you that doesn`t exactly always happen. The lawyer has probably no clue as to what went on here. And so the lawyer`s just trying to put a lid on it, keep the woman quiet.

I doubt very much if the lawyer knows anything more than the dribble that we`ve already heard, secondhand here. And the lawyer`s point was really good. And that is, that what he`s ticked off about is they`ve already decided that she`s the guilty one so they`ve stopped the investigation.

GRACE: Well, she`s the last one seen with the little girl, Eleanor. The car gets hit on by a cadaver dog then a second cadaver dog, and everything she tells police is a big fat lie.

DIXON: That`s exactly right. Now attorney/client privilege, fine, we don`t want to waive that. But if you want to help and find your little girl and if you have information, you give it to the police.

<SNIP> she switched gears here.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../24/ng.01.html

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FOXNews.com
A Grandmother's Anguish: 'My Heart Is Broken'

Tuesday , July 22, 2008

This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," July 21, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: Tonight: Where is Caylee Anthony? Two- year-old Caylee Anthony is missing. Now, but here's the strange catch. The baby's grandmother says the baby's mother knows who has the little girl. She vanished more than a month ago. And earlier, the mother's lawyer defended his client.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOSE BAEZ, ATTORNEY FOR CASEY ANTHONY: I'd like to make it clear that my client, Casey Anthony, at no time refused to speak with law enforcement. A lot has been misreported that she's not cooperating and that I am in some way standing in her way.

I'd like to bring everybody -- direct everybody's attention to the arrest report, which clearly states that the police were called out on the 15th of this month and she spoke with them immediately on that day. And then on the following day, practically the entire day she spent with law enforcement. It's only upon being arrested and my being retained that she invoked her right to counsel, as I think anyone would do in this country. We are focused on trying to find Caylee.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VAN SUSTEREN: Joining us live is Cynthia Anthony, grandmother of missing 2-year-old Caylee Anthony. Welcome, Cynthia.

CYNTHIA ANTHONY, GRANDMOTHER OF MISSING CHILD: Hi.

VAN SUSTEREN: Cynthia ...

ANTHONY: Forgive me. I'm running on, like, very little, little sleep. So you know, be gentle with me tonight, OK?

VAN SUSTEREN: All right, I will, indeed. You know, without any doubt, I know that you love your granddaughter very much, and I know you've been going around the clock doing interviews to help find her.

ANTHONY: Today, it's been non-stop. I mean, every day, I've been putting more and more hours in, and today I've been going non-stop. I had less than 45 minutes sleep in the last 48 hours. And before that, I probably had less than eight hours in the last week. So you know, I'm getting my strength from Caylee, and as long as I can continue to talk about her, you know, I can stay focused. But when people, you know, want me to answer questions I can't answer, then I'm losing strength. And if I lose strength, then I can't give tips to people.

Watch Greta's interview

On my way here, the limo ride -- if you would let me elaborate a little bit, I think your followers will really appreciate this, and this is why I'm here. I haven't been able to answer my phone for several hours. So in the limo ride here, I was able to do some voice-mails, and my very first voice-mail was a lead in Dallas because this couple was out at the pool two days ago, and they were admiring this little girl, this beautiful little girl. And you know, she -- you know, just something about it, they started talking to her. And her name and her age is identical to Caylee.

And today for the first time, when they saw me on whatever show -- I can't even remember what they said -- they realized that Caylee was a missing child. Had they known two days ago -- you know, two days ago, if people, you know, in the national news would have just focused on what I wanted to focus (INAUDIBLE) then Caylee might have been home with me two days ago.

So please, you know, let the attorneys talk about and the detectives talk about what's going on with Casey. Let me talk about why we need to bring Caylee home and why we need to focus on that because if I run out of steam, we're going to not -- we're going to lose Caylee. And I can't afford that.

And you know, just search inside yourself, you know, before you ask me a stupid question that I can't answer, please. You know, the only strength I have left is to find my granddaughter, and the only way we're going to do that is if the media focuses on getting her picture out there and telling everybody that doesn't know that she's missing, that she's missing. You have 50 other people you can interview about questions, you know? I don't even know what I'm thinking anymore, except my total focus, my entire strength is just to talk about this child.

VAN SUSTEREN: I hope you'll excuse -- I did laugh for a second when you said, you know, to ask stupid questions. I laughed at myself. I do hope that I don't ask the stupid questions of you. I would like to sort of orient the audience a little bit to the facts because you're living and breathing them, but a lot of the audience might not remember that the last anyone has known where your granddaughter was, was June 9. Or at least, that's the last time you saw her, is that right?

ANTHONY: Well, you know what? Right now, we're not even sure of the timeline. Just before I came here, I thought I might get an hour's sleep, but that was the time the opportunity that the deputies came to the house. So we're talking. And everybody's timeline seems like it's almost a week off. So you know, I don't know.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, let me ask you this...

ANTHONY: I can't elaborate on that right now. I can't. I don't have the strength and I don't have the energy to answer these questions.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. I've got that one.

ANTHONY: So I'm going to pass on that one.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right, so take a pass on that one. So I'm trying to sort of probe and pick your brain, try to get information out there in case anybody...

ANTHONY: That's not (INAUDIBLE)

VAN SUSTEREN: ... Knows anything can -- you know, can help. One of the things that has been reported -- you can correct me if this is wrong, but one of the things that's been reported is that I think you said that your daughter knows where her daughter is.

ANTHONY: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: That's obviously a very important point. Is that wrong?

ANTHONY: OK. Yes, that's a very important point. I at no time ever said I know that Casey knows where Caylee is. What I've stated is Casey knows who she handed her to, to baby-sit her for four hours, the same person that she's trusted her for, for the last year-and-a-half, trusted her as a friend for much longer than that. Casey doesn't know where Caylee's at today, and I believe in my heart, if she did, she would tell us .

VAN SUSTEREN: Have you -- I mean, obviously, the police are suspicious of your daughter's statement about the baby-sitter. So let me ask you. Have you ever seen or met that baby-sitter? Are you able to even corroborate her existence?

ANTHONY: You know what? I have to because I trust my daughter.

VAN SUSTEREN: But you've never -- and I believe that you love your daughter...

ANTHONY: I've never seen her.

VAN SUSTEREN: I believe that ...

(CROSSTALK)

ANTHONY: I've never seen God, but I know he's there, OK? I mean...

VAN SUSTEREN: OK.

ANTHONY: ... That's the only thing I can say.

VAN SUSTEREN: You have faith.

ANTHONY: I have faith.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did your daughter ever talk about her before your granddaughter disappeared?

ANTHONY: Yes, and the police are aware of that. And this person, whether her name is Zani (ph) or whatever, she's been part of conversation, normal conversation, for the last three years prior to Caylee's birth. So I don't think this is somebody that's been fabricated in the last, you know, week or two to cover up tracks that -- So again, I don't have the strength and energy to think about this or focus on that.

VAN SUSTEREN: Then let me switch gears for a second because I -- I want to talk about...

ANTHONY: Thank you.

VAN SUSTEREN: ... I mean, because trying to sort of sort through in the facts -- one of the other things that I read is that your daughter right now is being held in a cell with only a blanket, she doesn't even have her, you know, I think underwear. Is that right or not?

ANTHONY: That's what I was told.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK. The reason why that's sort of an alarm to me is that's usually what happens when people think that you're in a jail facility you're going to be a danger to yourself, that you have problems. Does your daughter have problems because that -- I mean, not always, but sometimes that's -- you know, that's sort of a sign to -- you know, to those that are familiar with jails.

ANTHONY: I don't know any 22-year-old that doesn't have a problem, and...

(CROSSTALK)

VAN SUSTEREN: You know what I mean. You know what I mean.

ANTHONY: No, I don't know what you mean.

(CROSSTALK)

ANTHONY: Greta, I'm not in your head. I don't know what you mean.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you think she's...

ANTHONY: Greta, I don't know what you mean.

VAN SUSTEREN: So outside of this, I mean, has she been a mentally stable person, in your view?

ANTHONY: Casey's never been a mentally unstable person.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK.

ANTHONY: She's never had -- been diagnosed with anything. I say she -- you know, I have depression right now. Am I mentally unstable?

VAN SUSTEREN: I know -- I realize this is stressful. I'm just sort of trying to -- you know, I'm trying to sort out, you know, what (INAUDIBLE) the facts and what's not. All right. Let me ask you this. Does your granddaughter have any distinguishing characteristic...

ANTHONY: Absolutely.

VAN SUSTEREN: ... So that in case anyone -- what -- is there any -- tell me, does she have any imperfections, for instance, on her skin or anything?

ANTHONY: Right. And...

VAN SUSTEREN: Because that helps people.

ANTHONY: Yes, ma'am. It's listed on her fliers. It's listed on her pages that you see. She has a little birthmark. It's just a fine little line, but it's -- you know, when you see it, you've never seen anything like -- I mean, it's unique. It's right here on her left shoulder.

VAN SUSTEREN: Left arm, left shoulder?

ANTHONY: Yes. And it's listed on all of the fliers. Her most unique thing is those eyes. She's got the most beautiful eyes. And you will know that child because she just melts you. I mean, there's something about Caylee, you know?

VAN SUSTEREN: Have you put the question to your daughter -- when you first called the police and said she was missing, did you put the question to your daughter, just real straight up, mother to daughter, Where is Caylee?

ANTHONY: Let me -- let me correct that statement. Casey did not say that she was kidnapped until after -- and this is a fact -- until after we called the police. And Casey told me she was relieved that I'm the one that called the police and not her because Casey...

VAN SUSTEREN: But when she was -- when you knew she wasn't around, your granddaughter, did you look your daughter in the eyes and say, What happened, or, Where is she?

ANTHONY: Well, I actually only had about an hour to look my daughter in the eye and ask the question where was Caylee. Casey had spoken with me for the last month. And again, I'm really losing steam, and if you want me to collapse in your studio so that you'll have sensationalism, I'm really close. So the last little ounce of my breath is, please, everybody just look for Caylee, look at the pictures because I can't answer any more questions. Just keep flashing these pictures, the media.

The Orlando area gets what I'm about. My sole purpose is to put the word about Caylee. We'll have plenty of time to do interviews and answer the questions of why Casey's -- you know, what she did, what she did and why she's holding back.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you understand, Cynthia, that it wasn't my desire to give you a hard time?

ANTHONY: Oh, honey, I know that. It's not. But my heart is aching right now, and I don't have...

VAN SUSTEREN: I got it. I understand that.

(CROSSTALK)

ANTHONY: ... Pain right now. It's probably from no food, lack of sleep, and just sheer exhaustion, but also because my heart is broken. So just help me get out the word, sweetie. I know you know in your heart and just -- you know, I know you've got to do a job, too, but your job can take another turn tonight, and maybe for the first time, you might get some actual...

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, why don't we strike a deal. Let's...

ANTHONY: ... self-gratification from that.

VAN SUSTEREN: Let you and I strike a deal. I'll say good night to you. We put her picture up, and maybe you and I can talk tomorrow or something. But I know you're tired, so...

ANTHONY: I've got a full day tomorrow, dear. I've got a full day. I can't make any promises.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, whatever. I understand that.

ANTHONY: I'll give you another interview, and I'll definitely have some more sleep for it, OK?

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. I hope you get some rest. Thank you, Cynthia, and good luck.

ANTHONY: Thank you. Bye.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,388741,00.html

Content and Programming Copyright 2008 FOX News Network, LLC. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Transcription Copyright 2008 ASC LLC (www.ascllc.net), which takes sole responsibility for the accuracy of the transcription. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. No license is granted to the user of this material except for the user's personal or internal use and, in such case, only one copy may be printed, nor shall user use any material for commercial purposes or in any fashion that may infringe upon FOX News Network, LLC'S and ASC LLC's copyrights or other proprietary rights or interests in the material. This is not a legal transcript for purposes of litigation.

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FOXNews.com
Should Missing Fla. Toddler's Mom Be Released?

Friday , July 25, 2008

This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," July 24, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: Tonight: The missing toddler's mother speaks. For the first time, you will hear from the mother of missing 2- year-old Caylee Anthony. Now, Casey, mother, sits in jail tonight after failing to report her 2-year-old missing for more than a month. And tonight, police have released two 911 calls placed the day Caylee was reported missing. In the first call, Casey Anthony's mother, the child's grandmother, asked police to arrest her daughter for stealing her car.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

911 OPERATOR: 911 (INAUDIBLE) happening?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY, GRANDMOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: I have someone here that I need to be arrested in my home.

911 OPERATOR: In your house?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: And I have a possible missing child. I have a 3- year-old that's been missing for a month.

Watch Greta's interview

911 OPERATOR: A 3-year-old?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Yes.

911 OPERATOR: Have you reported that?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: I'm trying to do that now, ma'am.

911 OPERATOR: OK. What did the person do that you need arrested?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: My daughter.

911 OPERATOR: For what?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: For stealing an auto and stealing money.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

VAN SUSTEREN: Now, the grandmother, Cynthia, called 911 again later that day. And this time, the grandmother called 911 to report her granddaughter missing. Eventually, the grandmother passed the phone to her daughter, who is 2-year-old Caylee's mother. Now, listen closely. The call contains some important clues.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

911 OPERATOR: 911. What's your emergency?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: I called a little bit ago. The deputy sheriff (INAUDIBLE) I found out my granddaughter has been taken. She has been missing for a month. Her mother finally admitted that she's been missing.

911 OPERATOR: OK, what...

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Get someone here now!

911 OPERATOR: OK. What is the address that you're calling from?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: We're talking about a 3-year-old little girl! My daughter finally admitted that the baby-sitter stole her. I need to find her.

911 OPERATOR: Your daughter admitted that your -- the baby is where?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: The baby-sitter took her a month ago, that my daughter's been looking for her. I told you my daughter was missing for a month. I just found her today, but I can't find my granddaughter. She just admitted to me that she's been trying to find her herself. There's something wrong. I found my daughter's car today, and it smells like there's been a dead body in the damn car!

911 OPERATOR: OK. What is the 3-year-old's name?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Caylee, C-A-Y-L-E-E, Anthony.

911 OPERATOR: Caylee Anthony?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK, is she white, black or Hispanic?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: She's white.

911 OPERATOR: How long has she been missing for?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: I have not seen her since the 7th of June.

911 OPERATOR: What is her date of birth?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: It's 8-9-2000 -- oh, God, she's 3. She's 2005. (INAUDIBLE) Casey says Zanny took her a month ago! She's been missing for a month.

911 OPERATOR: OK, I just -- can -- I need -- I understand -- can you just -- can you calm down for me for just a minute? I need to know what's going on, OK? I'm going to try and...

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: I'm sorry! (INAUDIBLE)

911 OPERATOR: Is your daughter there?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: I'm on the phone with them!

911 OPERATOR: Is your daughter there?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Yes.

911 OPERATOR: Can I speak with her? Do you mind if I speak with her? Thank you.

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: I called them two hours ago and they haven't gotten here. [unintelligible] Zanny took her a month ago. (INAUDIBLE) find her.

911 OPERATOR: Ma'am? Ma'am?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: (INAUDIBLE) they want to talk to you.

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: Hello?

911 OPERATOR: Hello?

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes.

911 OPERATOR: Hi. Well, can you tell me what's going on a little bit?

CASEY ANTHONY: I'm sorry?

911 OPERATOR: Can you tell me a little bit what's going on?

CASEY ANTHONY: My daughter has been missing for the last 31 days.

911 OPERATOR: And you know who has her?

CASEY ANTHONY: I know who has her. I've tried to contact her. I actually received a phone call today now from a number that is no longer in service. I did get to speak to my daughter for about a moment, about a minute.

911 OPERATOR: OK, did you guys call and report a vehicle stolen?

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes, my mom did.

911 OPERATOR: (INAUDIBLE) vehicle stolen, too?

CASEY ANTHONY: No, this is my vehicle.

911 OPERATOR: What vehicle was stolen?

CASEY ANTHONY: It's a '98 Pontiac Sunfire.

911 OPERATOR: OK, I have deputies on the way to you right now for that. But now your -- now your 3-year-old (INAUDIBLE) missing, Caylee Anthony.

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes.

911 OPERATOR: White female...

CASEY ANTHONY: Caylee Marie Anthony. Yes, white female.

911 OPERATOR: Three years old, 8-9-2005 is the date of birth?

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes.

911 OPERATOR: And you last saw her a month ago?

CASEY ANTHONY: Thirty-one days. Thirty-one days.

911 OPERATOR: Who has her? Do you have a name?

CASEY ANTHONY: Her name is Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez.

911 OPERATOR: Who is that, the baby-sitter?

CASEY ANTHONY: She's been my nanny for about a year-and-a-half, almost two years.

911 OPERATOR: Why are you calling now? Why didn't you call 31 days ago?

CASEY ANTHONY: I have been looking for her and have gone through other resources to try to find her, which was stupid.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

VAN SUSTEREN: Now, earlier today, the grandmother of the child explained the content of the 911 calls.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: What happens when you go -- you find someone that's not where they said that they were going to be for a couple of weeks, and then does not produce your granddaughter that's supposed to be with her every day? I was upset with her. I told her, Lead me to them. She goes, I can't, Mom. So I said, Well, I'm going to have the police help me find her. And she said thank you because -- she thanked me for calling the police, OK? I called 911 because I did not know what to do, OK?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) more concerned about the car, so much that the granddaughter...

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Well, I didn't know at the time. Casey didn't tell me that she had been kidnapped. All she told me is that she could not take me to her. That wasn't a good enough answer. So I just said to get the police out here, that she did not bring the car back to me. I admit -- and I told them when they came that night that I said that. And then when she told us before they came, I made another 911 phone call and I said, My daughter just admitted that my granddaughter had been kidnapped. Please -- because the first 911 call, they said that they would send someone out whenever they had availability. So as soon as I found out when she said that Caylee had been kidnapped, I called again and I said, We can't wait. You have to send one now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VAN SUSTEREN: Joining us live in Orlando in Rozzie Franco, a reporter for Florida News Network. Rozzie, of course, the first thing that sends a red flag up for just about everybody is in this call, the grandmother says that the smell is like there has been a dead body in the damn car, and then later has been saying that it was some smelly pizza in the car. So I imagine everyone's pretty suspicious down there tonight of somebody.

ROZZIE FRANCO, WFLA, FLORIDA NEWS NETWORK: Absolutely, Greta. And this case gets more and more bizarre as it unfolds. Now, when you referred to the pizza that Cindy Anthony said was left in the car, Deputy Carlos Padilla (ph) from the Orange County sheriff's office says pizza -- a week- old pizza and a dead body do not smell the same. In addition, she mentioned that it could have been the smell of a dead body in that first 911 call.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. What happened between about June 7 and the time of those 911 calls? Where did the grandmother think her daughter was with this child?

FRANCO: According to Cindy Anthony, she was questioning Casey Anthony where Caylee Anthony was. And Casey Anthony kept saying she was asleep, she was at Disney. She would just make excuses for where Caylee was. And then finally, Cindy sat down with her and said -- after she realized her car was impounded, and said, Where is my granddaughter? And then when she realized her granddaughter was -- she did not know the whereabouts of her granddaughter, she decided to call 911.

Now, what's interesting about the first 911 call is that she's very calm. And then in the second 911 call, she's very frantic. She realizes her granddaughter's disappeared. Well, when she passes the phone over to Casey Anthony, the mother of Caylee Anthony, so the 911 dispatcher could get a clear story, Casey Anthony's reaction is almost stoic. I mean, she's reporting this as if she's reporting like she's got a suspended license. She says, My daughter has been missing for 31 days. I mean, anyone that has a daughter that's been missing for 31 days might have a different reaction.

VAN SUSTEREN: The mother is sitting in the jail tonight, has not made bond. Is she talking to the police to -- I mean, I hate to say this word, but help them find the child? I mean, look, everybody's suspicious of the mother, at this point, but what's the -- what's the daughter in jail -- is she talking to the police?

FRANCO: Casey Anthony is not talking to police. Her criminal defense attorney, Jose Baez, has refused Orange County investigators to actually talk to Casey. And she says she's not coming forward. Anything that she comes forward with it's going to be through the attorney. But at this point, she's not come forward. Her bail is set at half a million dollars.

VAN SUSTEREN: Rozzie, thank you.

Now, the jailed mother's family has been trying to get enough money to bail her out of jail. The family needs $50,000. That is the 10 percent required of the $500,000 bond set by the judge. But today, Casey's lawyer said the family -- well, they just can't gather that much cash. He also says the bail is excessive for the crimes the mother's accused of, and he's asking the court to reconsider her bail amount.

Let's bring in the panel. In San Francisco, criminal defense attorney Michael Cardoza, in Los Angeles, attorney Gloria Allred, and here in D.C., criminal defense attorneys Ted Williams and Bernie Grimm.

Gloria, let me go to you first. Do you want to take a pass at this story and tell me -- what do you think?

GLORIA ALLRED, VICTIMS' RIGHTS ATTORNEY: Well, I think that, obviously, there is a cause for concern. If a mother who supposedly is so close to her child, so bonded, that there are photos of the two of them all over the home, doesn't report to the police or to others who could assist, the authorities who could assist in finding the child for such a length of time that her child is missing, well, you know, naturally, it's going to raise an eyebrow. Naturally, everybody's going to be concerned.

Maybe there are mental health issues. Maybe there are drug issues. Maybe there's both. Or maybe there's some other explanation completely. But somebody's got to get to the bottom of where this little baby is.

VAN SUSTEREN: Ted?

TED WILLIAMS, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Boy, I can tell you, these two tapes that you played at the beginning of the show are riveting. I, as a former homicide detective, tried to dissect them in an expeditious manner. And I got to tell you, I would be suspicious at this juncture, to be candid with you, of the grandmother also. I did not like the fact that when she initially called, she talked about a car, and then to know that her grandchild has been missing for all of this time and knowing...

VAN SUSTEREN: You know...

WILLIAMS: Greta, something is...

VAN SUSTEREN: ... What's funny?

WILLIAMS: ... Smelly here.

VAN SUSTEREN: I -- you know, I'm not. I mean, the grandmother's...

WILLIAMS: I am.

VAN SUSTEREN: ... Made some bizarre statements and gone from pizza -- from dead bodies to pizza. I mean, she's in terrible distress. Look, the daughter is stealing cars, stealing money.

WILLIAMS: But Greta, what would she...

(CROSSTALK)

VAN SUSTEREN: Bernie?

BERNIE GRIMM, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You know, I'm with Ted on the grandmother. But like Ted, I listened to the 911 call, the last one, where Grandma says -- the 911 call -- dispatcher says, Can I talk to your daughter if she's there? She says, They want to talk to you. And I'm pretty certain I hear the daughter say, quote, unquote, "Why do they want to talk to me?" I mean, my God, your daughter's been missing for 31 days.

And you know, I hear Gloria saying, you know, well, where is this girl? Where are they going to find her? I mean, I don't think she's going to be found and be on this side with us. It's very, very distressing. When you look at pictures of this poor little girl that are posted now, it breaks your heart.

WILLIAMS: It does.

VAN SUSTEREN: Michael, I can't imagine there's a single person watching the show that isn't enormously suspicion of that mother who sits in jail tonight. If she really cared, she'd be helping the police.

MICHAEL CARDOZA, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: There's no question about that. But on this one, I'm with you, Greta, because I don't think the grandmother's involved with this one, just the way she's acting. And what a horrible position to be in. She's got a daughter that she loves and a granddaughter that she loves. So what does she do? I mean, it's a terrible, terrible position.

And then you get to the bail that they raised, the $500,000 to keep her in jail, you've got an attorney saying it's an onerous bail. It may well be for the charges, but with the daughter missing, I've got to tell you, they're taking an appeal, it won't be reversed.

VAN SUSTEREN: And you know what...

CARDOZA: That $500,000 will stay right in place.

VAN SUSTEREN: I don't know of any mother, if the mother thought a child was kidnapped, would be playing mum tonight in the jail. … You know, they'd be helping the police try to find her. All right, panel, stand by.

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http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,391284,00.html

[Jute]

NANCY GRACE

Missing Person Case Phone Calls Released

Aired July 25, 2008 - 20:00:00 ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Police desperately searching for a beautiful little 2-year-old girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing. Little Caylee hasn`t been seen in five long weeks, last seen with her mother. So why didn`t Mommy call police?
Tonight, another bombshell. Do stunning jailhouse phone calls between mother Casey and grandmother Cindy blow this case wide open? As family and friends on the line beg Mom for info on the little girl, all Mommy wants to talk about is her boyfriend, Casey Anthony confronted on lying about 2- year-old Caylee.

And a newly released 911 call reveals the grandmother threatened -- threatened -- to take Caylee away unless Mommy cooperates, then tells 911 Mom`s car smells like a dead body, this on the heels of two independent cadaver dogs hitting on Mom`s car trunk and back yard. And a tipster claims she saw the 2-year-old boarding a flight to Atlanta. Was Caylee sighted in a restaurant in north Georgia? Tonight, where is 2-year-old Caylee?

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How come everybody`s saying that you`re not upset, that you`re not crying, that you show no caring of where Caylee is at all?

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: Because I`m not sitting here (DELETED) crying every two seconds because I have to stay composed to talk to detectives, to make other phone calls, to do other things. I can`t sit here and be crying every two seconds like I want to. I can`t.

I know you`re on my side. I`m not trying to...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nobody`s saying anything bad about you. Your family is with you 100 percent.

CASEY ANTHONY: No, they`re not.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes...

CASEY ANTHONY: That`s (DELETED) because I just watched the (DELETED) news and heard everything that my mom said. Nobody in my own family is on my side.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, they are. Nobody has said...

CASEY ANTHONY: They just want Caylee back. That`s all they`re worried about right now is getting Caylee back. And you know what? That`s all I care about right now.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY: Waste my call sitting in, oh, the jail.

CINDY ANTHONY, GRANDMOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: Whose fault is you sitting in the jail? You`re blaming me that you`re sitting in the jail?

CASEY ANTHONY: Not my fault.

CINDY ANTHONY: Blame yourself for telling lies.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Tonight, police desperately searching for a beautiful 2-year-old girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing. Little Caylee hasn`t been seen in five long weeks, last seen with her mother. So why didn`t Mommy call police? Tonight, another bombshell. Do stunning jailhouse phone calls between mother, Casey, and grandmother, Cindy, blow this case wide open? Just released, Caylee`s mom caught on tape from jail.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So how come everybody`s saying you`re lying?

CASEY ANTHONY: Because nobody`s (DELETED) listening to anything that I`m saying. The media completely misconstrued everything that I said. The (DELETED) detectives told them (DELETED) (DELETED). They want (ph) all of their information from me, yet at the same time, they`re twisting stuff. They`ve already said they`re going to pin this on me if they don`t find Caylee. They`ve already said that.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well...

CASEY ANTHONY: They arrested me because they said that...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, because they said that the person that you dropped Caylee with doesn`t even exist.

CASEY ANTHONY: Because -- oh, look, they can`t find her in the Florida database. She`s not just from Florida. If they would actually listen to anything that I would have said to them, they would have had their lead. They maybe could have tracked her down. They haven`t listened to a (DELETED) that I`ve said.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Does Tony have anything to do with Caylee?

CASEY ANTHONY: No. Tony had nothing to do with Caylee.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh. So why do you want to talk to him? You probably don`t want to tell me.

CASEY ANTHONY: Because he`s my boyfriend and I want to actually try to sit and talk to him because I didn`t get a chance to talk to him earlier because I got arrested on a (DELETED) whim today because they`re blaming me for stuff that I never would do, that I didn`t do.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Well, I`m on nobody -- I`m on your side. You know that.

CASEY ANTHONY: Oh, honey, I know that. I just want to talk to Tony and get a little bit of...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Casey, you have to tell me if you know anything about Caylee.

CASEY ANTHONY: Sweetheart...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If anything happens to Caylee, Casey, I`ll die! You understand? I`ll die if anything happens to that baby!

CASEY ANTHONY: Whoa. Oh, my God. Calling you guys -- a waste, huge waste. Honey, I love you. You know I would not let anything happen to my daughter. If I knew where she was, this wouldn`t be going on.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CINDY ANTHONY: Casey?

CASEY ANTHONY: Mom.

CINDY ANTHONY: Hey, sweetie.

CASEY ANTHONY: Well, I just saw your nice little cameo on TV.

CINDY ANTHONY: Which one?

CASEY ANTHONY: What do you mean, which one?

CINDY ANTHONY: Which one? I did four different ones, and I don`t know -- I haven`t seen them all. I`ve only seen one or two so far.

CASEY ANTHONY: You don`t know what my involvement is in stuff?

CINDY ANTHONY: Casey...

CASEY ANTHONY: Mom?

CINDY ANTHONY: What?

CASEY ANTHONY: No.

CINDY ANTHONY: I don`t know what your involvement is, sweetheart. You`re not telling me where she`s at.

CASEY ANTHONY: Because I don`t (DELETED) know where she`s at. Are you kidding me?

CINDY ANTHONY: Casey, don`t waste your call to scream and holler at me.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Jailhouse tapes. Apparently, they didn`t realize they were being recorded, even though very plainly, you can hear at the outset that this call is being monitored. These are calls by mom Casey from behind bars that threaten to blow this case wide open. As family and friends on the other line actually break down crying, begging for information from Mommy about the whereabouts of her 2-year-old little girl, all she wants to talk about is her boyfriend, Tony.

Straight out to Mark Williams with WNDB Newstalk 1150. What`s the latest?

MARK WILLIAMS, WNDB NEWSTALK 1150: Well, the latest is, of course, the jailhouse call that was released this afternoon. Also, there`s been a video release this afternoon of that. And you know...

GRACE: We`re showing that right now, Mark. Everyone, you are seeing actual phone calls of mom Casey behind bars, talking. These jailhouse tapes, Mark Williams -- stunning. She never breaks down.

WILLIAMS: No.

GRACE: She never cries. When people ask her about little Caylee, she never answers a single question. She keeps saying, This is a waste. Look, all I want is my boyfriend`s phone number. I don`t want to talk about Caylee.

WILLIAMS: Well, obviously, she is very self-centered for a 22-year- old woman. She won`t accept responsibility for what`s going on. It shows that the Anthony family is pretty much a dysfunctional family between Casey and her mother. Apparently, Casey doesn`t like her mother showing up on television all the time. And you`ve documented the fact that all she wants is the boyfriend`s mother (ph) -- the family`s trying to pump information from her, information that she`s not even giving investigators right now. So it is -- it is just a mosh (ph). I mean, this tape just blew my socks off this afternoon.

GRACE: Well, I got to tell you something, Mark. When the friend, Christina, is saying, Please, please tell me what you can about Caylee, she says, Oh, my God, what an F-ing waste this phone call was. That is her response.

Take a listen to mom Casey Anthony behind bars, being recorded on line with her mother.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY: ... waste my call sitting in, oh, the jail.

CINDY ANTHONY: Whose fault is you sitting in the jail? You`re blaming me that you`re sitting in the jail?

CASEY ANTHONY: Not my fault.

CINDY ANTHONY: Blame yourself for telling lies. What do you mean, it`s not your fault? What do you mean it`s not your fault, sweetheart? If you`d have told them the truth and not lied about everything, they wouldn`t...

CASEY ANTHONY: Do me a favor. Just tell me what Tony`s number is. I don`t want to talk to you right now. Forget it.

CINDY ANTHONY: I don`t have his number.

CASEY ANTHONY: Well, get it from Lee because I know Lee`s at the house. I saw Mallory`s car was out front. It was just on the news. They were just live outside the house.

CINDY ANTHONY: I know they were.

CASEY ANTHONY: Well?

CINDY ANTHONY: Well?

CASEY ANTHONY: Can you get Tony`s number for me so I can call him?

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Does Tony have anything to do with Caylee?

CASEY ANTHONY: No. Tony had nothing to do with Caylee.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh. So why do you want to talk to him? You probably don`t want to tell me.

CASEY ANTHONY: Because he`s my boyfriend and I want to actually try to sit and talk to him because I didn`t get a chance to talk to him earlier because I got arrested on a (DELETED) whim today because they`re blaming me for stuff that I never would do, that I didn`t do.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Well, I`m on nobody -- I`m on your side. You know that.

CASEY ANTHONY: Oh, honey, I know that. I just want to talk to Tony and get a little bit of...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Casey, you have to tell me if you know anything about Caylee.

CASEY ANTHONY: Sweetheart...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If anything happens to Caylee, Casey, I`ll die! You understand? I`ll die if anything happens to that baby!

CASEY ANTHONY: Whoa. Oh, my God. Calling you guys -- a waste, huge waste. Honey, I love you. You know I would not let anything happen to my daughter. If I knew where she was, this wouldn`t be going on.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Incredible. We also learn -- let`s go out to Drew Petrimoulx with WDBO Newsradio. Drew, I think Tony, who she keeps wanting to talk to, may have some answers, not necessarily where Caylee is, but if she were -- if she had been with Tony on and off throughout these five weeks she was missing, did Tony ever see the little girl? We know police have canvassed door to door in Tony, the boyfriend`s, apartment. Now, what they have learned, Drew, is that several residents there in the apartment complex say, Yes, we saw Caylee. We saw her here in the apartment complex swimming pool. The last time any of them saw the little girl was in early June.

What more can you tell us, Drew?

DREW PETRIMOULX, WDBO NEWSRADIO: Well, the thing is, you know, that`s pretty much -- around the middle part of June there was pretty much the last time anyone has seen he. While people in the neighborhood did see -- they had seen her playing in the pool (INAUDIBLE) like that, they haven`t seen her since she, you know, went missing. And while her boyfriend has said that he is helping investigators, he hasn`t to this point revealed any evidence that has led to a break in the case.

GRACE: You know -- back to Mark Williams at WNDB Newstalk 1150. Mark, I think that we can glean a great deal of evidence from what Tony, the boyfriend, observed. For instance, did she continue to tell him the baby was at the beach with the nanny, the baby was at an amusement park with the nanny? Has anybody except mom Casey ever seen the nanny?

WILLIAMS: Nobody has seen the nanny. I mean, you know, police have gone to her alleged address and she is nowhere to be found. Even Casey in that phone call this afternoon mentioned, Well, she may not be in the Florida database. She may be in the North Carolina database...

GRACE: Yes, I heard that.

WILLIAMS: ... or New York state.

GRACE: I heard that.

WILLIAMS: You know...

GRACE: She may not be just from Florida.

WILLIAMS: Yes, but -- well, the other thing is the fact that the father this afternoon, on a local media outlet, said they`re only a couple of thousand dollars away from releasing Casey from jail, which was a stunning revelation for me because that was the first time I had heard about that.

GRACE: Everybody, we are talking your calls live. Out to Ginny in Florida. Hi, Ginny.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. How`re you doing tonight?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Listen, honey, she had a whole month to get rid of this baby. Is it possible that she dumped it in plastic bags and took it to the dump, and now she feels very confident that no one`s going to find it? And I think the mother, the daughter, the whole family`s playing the system.

GRACE: You know, Ginny, I think that you have a very good point regarding the possibility the body has been disposed of. But I want you to listen to what the grandmother, grandmother Cindy, says. She`s trying make a 911 call. They`ve hooked (ph) her. She`s called the wrong jurisdiction. And while they`re waiting to get to the correct jurisdiction, the grandmother says, Listen -- the mother says, Give me one or day, give me one more day to find Caylee. The grandmother says, No, I`ve given you 30 days to find her, and if you don`t -- it goes inaudible. She says, We`re going to get a court order to get her.

So Ginny in Florida, that suggests to me that a grandmother, Cindy Anthony, truly believed at that juncture the little girl was alive.

Liz, do we have that sound? We do. Take a listen.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CINDY ANTHONY: ... because my next thing will be down to child (INAUDIBLE) thing and we`ll have a court order to get her. If that`s the way you want to play it, we`ll do it and you`ll never...

CASEY ANTHONY: That`s not the way I want to play it.

CINDY ANTHONY: Well, then you have to...

CASEY ANTHONY: Give me one more day.

CINDY ANTHONY: No, I`m not giving you another day. I`ve given you a month.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: To Donald Schweitzer, former detective with Santa Ana PD. That one slip right there, when they did not realize they were between phone calls, between the police and the sheriff`s office, they didn`t know they were still being recorded, says to me that Cindy Anthony up until this juncture really believed the little girl was still alive. What do you think?

DONALD SCHWEITZER, FORMER DETECTIVE, SANTA ANA PD: I agree with you, Nancy. I think that she was buying into the story that the child was with a missing nanny. But it also tells me that the mother doesn`t trust the daughter and that she`s questioning her and she`s probing and she`s threatening to report her to the police. So she knows that something`s wrong, as well, at that juncture.

GRACE: I think you`re right.

Back out to the lines. Mary Jo in New Jersey. Hi, Mary Jo.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. How`re you doing, Nancy?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, congratulations on your beautiful miracles.

GRACE: You know what? Thank you very much. I`ve got a photo for you later on tonight. What do you think about this case?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, I was actually wondering, how did Caylee`s father die, were her parents still together at the time?

GRACE: It`s my understanding that -- I think you were talking about Caylee, how did Caylee`s father die -- in a car crash. What do we know, Mark Williams?

WILLIAMS: That`s the information that I know, Nancy, that he died about a year ago in a car accident, and she`s been pretty much, you know, raising the child by herself, along with her parents, in east Orange County. That`s the only information we`ve been able to glean. And Tony came into her life -- this Tony Lazarro (ph) came into her life a couple of months ago, two months ago, so they`ve been an item for a while.

GRACE: And another issue regarding the death of the father of Caylee, Caylee`s father. We learned from police sources that the very first thing they did was reach out to all relatives, all family members and nail down their alibis, the last time they had seen Caylee. All of those relatives, to my understanding, Mary Jo in New Jersey, have been spoken to.

To Dr. Lawrence Kobilinsky, forensic scientist, joining us out of New York. This theory that Ginny called in from Florida, about the disposal of the body -- if there is a body, if it was disposed of in that manner, say, back in June, in a dump, in a trash dump, would there be any way to find it now?

LARRY KOBILINSKY, FORENSIC SCIENTIST: I think it would be exceptionally difficult. There would clearly be a great deal of decomposition and putrefaction. The question is, is could you detect the object in a plastic bag in a dump, and without having any insight into where to look. I mean, some of these dumps are enormous in size. I think it would be almost an impossible task to find that kind of object in a large dump.

GRACE: And back to Donald Schweitzer, former detective with Santa Ana PD. When she said -- and we`re about to play this for you -- the police refused to listen to her -- I`m talking about the recorded phone calls that have just been released as we go to air, jailhouse recordings of mom Casey on the phone with grandmother Cindy. She says on the phone, This woman is not just from Florida. She could be in North Carolina or New York. They`ve got to search the database. What about that?

SCHWEITZER: Nancy, I`ve actually read the police reports, and it appears to me that the police did everything they could to find this woman. They went to the house that this woman claimed to have been living. There`s no such person. They`ve done everything they can.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So how can I find out the information about that girl?

CASEY ANTHONY: Have them look up a New York license for Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez. They`ve just been looking up the last name Gonzalez or the last name Fernandez. If they looked up her entire name, they might actually find her. They haven`t done that. They haven`t listened to anything that I`ve said.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Where does she live? Because they went and looked at her place and...

CASEY ANTHONY: Baby, you`re not telling me anything that I don`t already know. Again, I only have been in jail since, oh, about 8:30 tonight. I was with them...

(END AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You know that whoever has Caylee, nobody`s going to get away with it. Nobody.

CASEY ANTHONY: I know nobody`s going to get away with it. But at the same time, the only way they`re going to find Caylee is if they actually listen to what I`m saying. And I`m trying to help them and they`re not letting me help them.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So how can I help them find her? The best thing you can do, baby, is listen to me.

CASEY ANTHONY: They need to look up her information in the New York database and a North Carolina database, other places that she`s lived outside of Florida. That`s what I told them even again today. I told them that four times today.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining us, Susan Moss, Hugo Rodriguez and Seema Iyer. Susan Moss, weigh in.

SUSAN MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: She has no remorse for this loss. I mean, listen to her. Listen to her speak. It`s all about her. It`s all about her thoughts, her feelings and how the world has done her wrong. If she -- she lost her child, yet she doesn`t make any pleas to try to do more things to try to help find her child, other than looking up this mythical baby-sitter.

GRACE: Hugo?

HUGO RODRIGUEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I don`t disagree. It`s very mysterious. It`s a very troubled young woman.

GRACE: Mysterious?

RODRIGUEZ: Mysterious...

GRACE: What`s mysterious about it?

RODRIGUEZ: I mean her...

GRACE: She`s lying through her teeth. Is that a mystery?

RODRIGUEZ: It is -- if she is really sincere about finding daughter, it is mysterious. I don`t think an ordinary mother would be doing that, Nancy.

GRACE: Seema?

SEEMA IYER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I think you`re all looking at this like this is some smoking gun evidence. None of us are here to judge how she should react to this type of trauma and this type of loss. And this tape is evidence of nothing, zero, zilch.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY: I know you`re on my side, and I`m not trying to...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nobody`s saying anything bad about you. Your family is with you 100 percent.

CASEY ANTHONY: No, they`re not.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes...

CASEY ANTHONY: That`s (DELETED) because I just watched the (DELETED) news and heard everything that my mom said. Nobody in my own family is on my side.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, they are. Nobody has said...

CASEY ANTHONY: They just want Caylee back. That`s all they`re worried about right now is getting Caylee back. And you know what? That`s all I care about right now.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY: I know you`re on my side, and I`m not trying to...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nobody`s saying anything bad about you. Your family is with you 100 percent.

CASEY ANTHONY: No, they`re not.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes...

CASEY ANTHONY: That`s (DELETED) because I just watched the (DELETED) news and heard everything that my mom said. Nobody in my own family is on my side.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, they are. Nobody has said...

CASEY ANTHONY: They just want Caylee back. That`s all they`re worried about right now is getting Caylee back. And you know what? That`s all I care about right now.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Dr. Mark Hillman, clinical psychotherapist and author. Did you hear her say, All they care about is Caylee? That`s all they care about? In other words, they don`t care about me, they only care about her. What is wrong with her?

MARK HILLMAN, PSYCHOTHERAPIST: It`s called schizoid affective disorder. In other words, this is a very, very sick woman.

GRACE: Well, that`s not what I would have called it, but go ahead.

HILLMAN: This woman creates a very fabricated reality and then she occupies it. She says she`s concerned about her daughter. She lies to the police. She does her own investigation for 31 days. She`s cooking for Tony, the boyfriend. And she`s using her mother`s stolen credit card to go on a shopping spree. She lies about the baby-sitter. She lies about the address. She lies about working. And Judge Strickland said it best. The truth and Miss Anthony are complete strangers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: So how can I find out the information about that girl?

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING 2-YEAR-OLD: Have them look up a New York license for Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez. They`ve just been looking up the last name Gonzalez or the last name Fernandez. If they looked up her entire name, they might actually find her. They haven`t done that. They haven`t listened to anything that I`ve said.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: Where does she live? Because they went and looked at her place.

CASEY: Baby, you`re not telling me anything that I don`t already know. Again, I`ve only been in jail since oh about 8:30 tonight. I was with them all day today. I know that. I was with officers, pretty much since 9:00 last night up until today, like up until this evening when I came up here.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: But you`re telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth? Because they`ll find.

CASEY: That it`s, I have no clue where my daughter is? Yes, that is the truth. That is the absolute truth.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: They`ll find out and whoever.

CASEY: OK. Christina, I`m hanging up.

CINDY ANTHONY, MISSING 2-YEAR-OLD`S GRANDMOTHER: I have a 3-year-old that`s been missing for a month.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: A 3-year-old?

CINDY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: Have you reported that?

CINDY: I`m trying to do that now, ma`am.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: OK. What did the person do that you need arrested?

CINDY: My daughter.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: For what?

CINDY: For stealing an auto and stealing money.

Casey?

CASEY: Mom.

CINDY: Hey, sweetie.

CASEY: Well, I just saw your nice little cameo on TV.

CINDY: Which one?

CASEY: What do you mean which one?

CINDY: Which one? I did four different ones and I don`t know -- I haven`t seen them all. I`ve only seen one or two so far.

CASEY: You don`t know what my involvement is in stuff?

CINDY: Casey.

CASEY: Mom.

CINDY: What?

CASEY: No.

CINDY: I don`t know what your involvement is, sweetheart. You`re not telling me where she`s at.

CASEY: Because I don`t (EXPLETIVE DELETED) know where she`s at. Are you kidding me?

CINDY: Casey, don`t waste your call to scream and holler at me.

CASEY: No.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The grandmother, Cindy Anthony, remaining extremely poised and in control, almost placating her daughter behind bars.

You`re seeing newly released videos of Casey Anthony behind bars and these phone calls released as we go to air -- calls that could blow the case wide open while family and friends and family beg for information about missing Caylee, the 2-year-old daughter.

All mommy wants to talk about is her boyfriend.

Straight to the lines, Deidra in West Virginia. Hi, Deidra.

DEIDRA, WEST VIRGINIA RESIDENT: Hi, how are you, Nancy.

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

DEIDRA: First of all, I want to say thank you for having such a great show.

GRACE: Thank you. It`s actually a whole team of us.

DEIDRA: I know that.

GRACE: But I will pass that on, thank you.

DEIDRA: OK. And also, I just want to say that that girl -- mother is so self-differing that she is so self-centered that she`s not really caring where that child is. She is more interested in her boyfriend and such language that she uses.

GRACE: You know -- you know what, Deidra -- don`t you think, Deidra -- Liz, keep Deidra on the line, please. Don`t you think that she`d by saying, have you gotten any tips? Who`s manning the phone calls? What are you guys doing? Have you put out fliers?

DEIDRA: Exactly.

GRACE: Have you looked at this apartment complex? Have you looked in this apartment complex? Did you get the video from the airport? I mean wouldn`t you think she`d be asking those kind of questions? Just think about it. Can you imagine if somebody in your family goes missing, wouldn`t you be out on the street begging people to help you, Deidra?

DEIDRA: Yes, not a month from then, it would be the same day. And that`s the reason I feel that she is behind all this. And she doesn`t care about that little girl.

GRACE: You know let`s go to the defense lawyers. I think Deidra is correct.

Susan Moss with us, family law attorney, child advocate. Also with us, veteran defense attorney out of Miami, Hugo Rodriguez. Also with us, Seema Iyer, defense attorney out of New York.

What about it, Seema?


http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0807/25/ng.01.html

[Jute]

continued - NANCY GRACE

Missing Person Case Phone Calls Released

Aired July 25, 2008 - 20:00:00 ET


SEEMA IYER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: What about it is that you keep getting so excited about this.

GRACE: I`m not excited.

IYER: Yes, you`re very excited. You act like she`s saying.

GRACE: I am convinced.

IYER: . she is guilty.

GRACE: I am convinced that she knows more than what she`s telling us.

IYER: Well, and also the grandmother.

GRACE: If she cared about her daughter, she would tell us.

IYER: Yes, ma`am, but also the grandmother. Let us not forget that the grandmother said, I gave you 31 days. That means to me that the grandmother was in on it, she knew about it, and I would love to defend Casey so I could plan B the grandmother.

GRACE: And you might also notice, Seema, if you take that in context and the grandmother is trying to find out where the little girl is, and believes that she`s still alive, and she`s wanting to get a court order to take the little girl away.

IYER: I disagree. I disagree.

GRACE: You didn`t hear that?

IYER: I heard.

GRACE: OK, Liz, can you queue that up for me?

IYER: I`m listening.

GRACE: Seema appears to only hear in one ear, the bad one.

What about it, Hugo?

HUGO RODRIGUEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY, FMR. FBI AGENT: Listen, we`re focus -- we`re missing the focus. I know where you`re going but I`m going to said it before, let`s not race to judgment. She may be a poor mother. She may be a narcissistic.

GRACE: Not poor.

RODRIGUEZ: She may be involved with her boyfriend. But.

GRACE: She ran up $45,000 worth of debt on her mother`s credit card.

RODRIGUEZ: So that doesn`t mean that she has done anything improper with her child.

GRACE: So why did you say she`s poor?

RODRIGUEZ: I mean she`s poor because she made poor judgment.

GRACE: You feel sorry for her?

RODRIGUEZ: No. She made poor judgment. She may be narcissistic, she may be involved with her self, but let`s not race to judgment.

GRACE: No.

RODRIGUEZ: We`ve got Duke, we`ve got Atlanta. We`ve got Ramsey. Let`s hold on. Let`s hold on yet.

GRACE: What about Ramsey?

RODRIGUEZ: Why did they release all these? Yes, all these crisis.

GRACE: Well, why did you say.

RODRIGUEZ: All these people. We were ready to crucify her parents. And we -- we now know they had nothing to do with it.

GRACE: Whoa, whoa, whoa.

RODRIGUEZ: We were ready to crucify her parents.

GRACE: What are you talking about?

RODRIGUEZ: I`m saying.

GRACE: Focus in, bring it in.

RODRIGUEZ: Let`s focus in.

GRACE: Come on, bring it in. Let`s focus on this.

RODRIGUEZ: She`s been charged with obstructing a police investigation and child endearment.

GRACE: Endangerment.

RODRIGUEZ: Endangerment. I believe they`ve made a mistake in arresting her for these charges. They`re not going to get anywhere. She`s going to invoke her rights and not cooperate any further. What`s the purpose?

GRACE: And Susan Moss, don`t you believe that if she wanted to find her child -- and I appreciate what Seema and Hugo are saying, they`re veteran defense attorneys, that`s what they do for a living.

OK? Got it.

But don`t you think, practically speaking, Sue Moss, if you have a family member missing and you finally get through on that jail phone, there`s a line of 30 people you got to wait on to get to that phone, and it tells you, you`re being recorded, don`t you think she`d be saying, have you tried this? Have you called this person? Have you tried that person?

Nothing, nothing about finding the baby.

SUSAN MOSS, CHILD ADVOCATE, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: Amen. In this case, in this case, the evidence is mounting. I -- her trunk has the hair of the missing tot. My goodness, in jail, she should sit and rot. This woman is going to be crucified because of her own statements, her own doings, her own car and her own backyard.

GRACE: And speaking of that stain -- Dr. Lawrence Kobilinsky, joining us out of New York -- Kobi, it`s been several days now. They found the stain in the trunk with one of the ultraviolet lights. Can`t they at least tell me if it`s blood?

LAWRENCE KOBILINSKY, FORENSIC SCIENTIST: They would know that almost immediately. Nancy, they have field testing. They could have taken a fiber and tested it right there and then at least to get a presumptive determination.

GRACE: What about if it was cadaver fluid? When your body starts decomposing, it leaks.

KOBILISNKY: Yes, you would find the presence of human hemoglobin. They could have cut out that fabric, brought it back to the lab, done all kinds of tests, presumptive test, confirmatory test, species test. They should know what it is at this stage.

GRACE: Larry, you and I have seen whole cars dismantled just to get this much.

KOBILISNKY: Sure.

GRACE: . of a sample. Like you said, they`ll rip up that carpet, they`d take it in, and taken analysis on it immediately.

KOBILISNKY: Absolutely.

GRACE: And do you think they`ve got it and they`re just not telling us?

KOBILISNKY: I don`t -- yes, that`s a good question because these kind of results come back quickly. The issue now is, if it`s biological, if it`s human, is it this young little girl? And that, I mean, you need to have.

GRACE: Right.

KOBILISNKY: . something to compare it to. And they would know that in a matter of day or two.

GRACE: Well then, they would have that in the grandmother`s home.

KOBILISNKY: Yes.

GRACE: Her hair brush, anything to get a nucleus (INAUDIBLE), to get DNA.

KOBILISNKY: Absolutely, absolutely right. And they would know that quickly, a couple of days would be more than enough to bring this whole thing to a conclusion.

GRACE: Out to the lines, Jennifer in Florida. Hi, Jennifer.

JENNIFER, FLORIDA RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy. How are you?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

JENNIFER: Good. I have a question for you - well, first, I love your show.

GRACE: Thank you.

JENNIFER: And second, I remember two years ago, you had extensive coverage on the Trenton Duckett case.

GRACE: Yes.

JENNIFER: And this case, to me, has so many similarities to that one. It`s in the same area. This mother reminds me so much of the uncooperative Melinda Duckett. The kids were the same ages, the mothers were the same ages. I was wondering if there was some type of weird thing going on in that area with small children.

GRACE: You know what, a lot of people have made the comparison to the Duckett case. I don`t think it`s exclusive to the area but a lot of people have made that observation and, as you all know, Miss Duckett went to her grave never revealing what she else knew about the disappearance of her little girl -- of her little boy Trenton.

Everybody, we are taking your calls live.

Quickly to break, tonight, at your request, here is another picture of the twins. Now here they are, they look like they`re sitting up, but what we did. We held them to the last minute, and go one, two, three, and pulled back and take the picture. And then immediately they fell.

But this is such a big deal. This happened this week. Can you remember when they were in intensive care? We were all praying that they would live?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CINDY: Because my next thing will be down to child (INAUDIBLE) and we`ll have a court order to get her. If that`s the way you want to play, we`ll do it and you`ll never.

CASEY: That`s not the way I want to play.

CINDY: Well, then, you have.

CASEY: Give me one more day.

CINDY: No, I`m not giving you another day. I`ve given you a month.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEE: Anyway, you only got a couple of minutes with us so I`m not going to let you completely waste it. Here`s Christina. She thinks she can get through to you.

CASEY: No. No. I want Tony`s number. I`m not talking to anybody else.

CHRISTINA: Hello?

CASEY: Hi, I`m glad everybody`s at my house. I`ll have to call you later or I`ll have to call somebody to get your numbers. Do me a favor, get my brother back because I need Tony`s number.

CHRISTINA: OK. Is there anything I can do for you?

CASEY: I`m sitting in jail. There`s nothing anybody can do right now.

CHRISTINA: Well, I`m just trying to be a.

CASEY: Oh I know you are, honey. I absolutely know that you are and I appreciate everything that you`re trying to do but, I`d like to call Tony. He`s not at my house, is he?

CHRISTINA: No, no.

CASEY: OK.

CHRISTINA: It`s just me and your parents, and Lee.

How come everybody`s saying that you`re not upset, that you`re not crying, that you showed no caring of where Caylee is at all?

CASEY: Because I`m not sitting here (EXPLETIVE DELETED) crying every two seconds, because I have to stay composed to talk to detectives, to make other phone calls, to do other things. I can`t sit here and be crying every two seconds like I want to. I can`t.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Stunning jailhouse phone tapes reveal the state of mind of mom, Casey Anthony. Her little girl Caylee has been missing now for over five weeks.

We`re taking your calls live, Nancy in Georgia, hi, Nancy.

NANCY, GEORGIA RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy. I wondered if there was focus on the car if the mother had left her in the car while she went on the shopping spree or as we did in Atlanta we had a mother that left the child in the car when she went in to do her work, her job and the child died.

GRACE: Interesting question.

To Mark Williams at WNDB Newstalk 1150 -- Mark, if she were using her mother`s credit card, couldn`t they determine where she had been, when she had been there, and whether anyone had seen the little girl with her?

MARK WILLIAMS, NEWS DIRECTOR, WNDB NEWSTALK 1150: Of course. I mean, if she went on the shopping spree and ran up the $45,000, they ought to be able to trace through that banking company where she spent that money, what state she was in.

One of the other things, Nancy, that I want to put out is have police checked the service records of that automobile. People usually get their oil changed every three to five thousand miles. There`s got to be a paper trail just with the car.

GRACE: Mark, Mark, Mark, that`s normal people, logical people, all right? I don`t know if she`s thinking about getting an oil change after 3,000 miles.

Out to the lines, Sally in Florida. Hi, Sally.

SALLY: Hey, Nancy.

GRACE: Hi, dear. What`s your question?

SALLY: My question is, deja vu, I live right here in Leesburg where we -- Trenton Ducket was.

GRACE: Yes.

SALLY: . abducted. And he was taken out a window by a stranger. This little girl is taken by a strange babysitter, and I`m just saying, if they release her from jail, are they sure she won`t be the same as the other one?

GRACE: You know that`s an interesting point because, Susan, the judge did say a condition of her being released from jail was not one but two shrinks, two psychological exams.

MOSS: Absolutely. I have -- I don`t think she`s going to commit suicide but I think she`ll disappear quicker than this mythical babysitter.

GRACE: You know, speaking of the babysitter, it seems to me -- out to you, Donald Schweitzer -- that there would be some record of her. They found the woman, Zenaida Hernandez Gonzales in Florida, but now, she says, well, maybe she`s in North Carolina, maybe she`s in New York.

You`ve got to have some record, a gas bill, an apartment lease, a driver`s license, something.

So, what about it? How would they go about tracking it that quickly?

DONALD SCHWEITZER, FMR. DETECTIVE, SANTA ANA PD: Nancy, determining whether a person exists is pretty easy. It doesn`t take a rocket scientist to investigate that one. They could simply go to where this woman was supposed to have lived and ask neighbors, ask friends. People just don`t exist with being known.

This was an easy one. The police did that and they weren`t able to confirm.

GRACE: And you know, another issue now that you are mentioning that, to Mark Williams with WNDB -- Mark, mom Casey said that she spoke with the little girl right before she goes missing. She was with the nanny, but then when she tried to call back, the phone was out of service.

Wouldn`t they have records of that? Can`t they ping a cell phone if there is one?

WILLIAMS: Yes, they can. And if you`d call 911 today, in this county, they can tell you exactly where that phone is from. They can ping that phone and that`s kind of an easy thing to do. And you can go back to the cell phone provider and.

GRACE: Absolutely.

WILLIAMS: . pull those lists.

GRACE: Which tells me the police are correct that this woman does not exist, this nanny.

To Mindy in Alabama, hi, dear.

MINDY, ALABAMA RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy.

GRACE: What`s your question, dear?

MINDY: Well, I was wondering, if there are any child abandonment laws in the state of Florida, if this is supposedly true that she did leave the toddler.

GRACE: Yes.

MINDY: . with the babysitter, if the babysitter exists.

GRACE: Is that child abandonment? Yes, it would at least be child neglect and she is actually charged with that, Mindy in Alabama. How long they`ll hold her, I don`t know.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0807/25/ng.01.html

[Faith]

And a newly released 911 call reveals the grandmother threatened -- threatened -- to take Caylee away unless Mommy cooperates, then tells 911 Mom`s car smells like a dead body, this on the heels of two independent cadaver dogs hitting on Mom`s car trunk and back yard. And a tipster claims she saw the 2-year-old boarding a flight to Atlanta. Was Caylee sighted in a restaurant in north Georgia? Tonight, where is 2-year-old Caylee?

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How come everybody`s saying that you`re not upset, that you`re not crying, that you show no caring of where Caylee is at all?

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: Because I`m not sitting here (DELETED) crying every two seconds because I have to stay composed to talk to detectives, to make other phone calls, to do other things. I can`t sit here and be crying every two seconds like I want to. I can`t.

I know you`re on my side. I`m not trying to...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nobody`s saying anything bad about you. Your family is with you 100 percent.

CASEY ANTHONY: No, they`re not.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes...

CASEY ANTHONY: That`s (DELETED) because I just watched the (DELETED) news and heard everything that my mom said. Nobody in my own family is on my side.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, they are. Nobody has said...

CASEY ANTHONY: They just want Caylee back. That`s all they`re worried about right now is getting Caylee back. And you know what? That`s all I care about right now.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY: Waste my call sitting in, oh, the jail.

CINDY ANTHONY, GRANDMOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: Whose fault is you sitting in the jail? You`re blaming me that you`re sitting in the jail?

CASEY ANTHONY: Not my fault.

CINDY ANTHONY: Blame yourself for telling lies.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Tonight, police desperately searching for a beautiful 2-year-old girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing. Little Caylee hasn`t been seen in five long weeks, last seen with her mother. So why didn`t Mommy call police? Tonight, another bombshell. Do stunning jailhouse phone calls between mother, Casey, and grandmother, Cindy, blow this case wide open? Just released, Caylee`s mom caught on tape from jail.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So how come everybody`s saying you`re lying?

CASEY ANTHONY: Because nobody`s (DELETED) listening to anything that I`m saying. The media completely misconstrued everything that I said. The (DELETED) detectives told them (DELETED) (DELETED). They want (ph) all of their information from me, yet at the same time, they`re twisting stuff. They`ve already said they`re going to pin this on me if they don`t find Caylee. They`ve already said that.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well...

CASEY ANTHONY: They arrested me because they said that...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, because they said that the person that you dropped Caylee with doesn`t even exist.

CASEY ANTHONY: Because -- oh, look, they can`t find her in the Florida database. She`s not just from Florida. If they would actually listen to anything that I would have said to them, they would have had their lead. They maybe could have tracked her down. They haven`t listened to a (DELETED) that I`ve said.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Does Tony have anything to do with Caylee?

CASEY ANTHONY: No. Tony had nothing to do with Caylee.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh. So why do you want to talk to him? You probably don`t want to tell me.

CASEY ANTHONY: Because he`s my boyfriend and I want to actually try to sit and talk to him because I didn`t get a chance to talk to him earlier because I got arrested on a (DELETED) whim today because they`re blaming me for stuff that I never would do, that I didn`t do.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Well, I`m on nobody -- I`m on your side. You know that.

CASEY ANTHONY: Oh, honey, I know that. I just want to talk to Tony and get a little bit of...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Casey, you have to tell me if you know anything about Caylee.

CASEY ANTHONY: Sweetheart...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If anything happens to Caylee, Casey, I`ll die! You understand? I`ll die if anything happens to that baby!

CASEY ANTHONY: Whoa. Oh, my God. Calling you guys -- a waste, huge waste. Honey, I love you. You know I would not let anything happen to my daughter. If I knew where she was, this wouldn`t be going on.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CINDY ANTHONY: Casey?

CASEY ANTHONY: Mom.

CINDY ANTHONY: Hey, sweetie.

CASEY ANTHONY: Well, I just saw your nice little cameo on TV.

CINDY ANTHONY: Which one?

CASEY ANTHONY: What do you mean, which one?

CINDY ANTHONY: Which one? I did four different ones, and I don`t know -- I haven`t seen them all. I`ve only seen one or two so far.

CASEY ANTHONY: You don`t know what my involvement is in stuff?

CINDY ANTHONY: Casey...

CASEY ANTHONY: Mom?

CINDY ANTHONY: What?

CASEY ANTHONY: No.

CINDY ANTHONY: I don`t know what your involvement is, sweetheart. You`re not telling me where she`s at.

CASEY ANTHONY: Because I don`t (DELETED) know where she`s at. Are you kidding me?

CINDY ANTHONY: Casey, don`t waste your call to scream and holler at me.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Jailhouse tapes. Apparently, they didn`t realize they were being recorded, even though very plainly, you can hear at the outset that this call is being monitored. These are calls by mom Casey from behind bars that threaten to blow this case wide open. As family and friends on the other line actually break down crying, begging for information from Mommy about the whereabouts of her 2-year-old little girl, all she wants to talk about is her boyfriend, Tony.

Straight out to Mark Williams with WNDB Newstalk 1150. What`s the latest?

MARK WILLIAMS, WNDB NEWSTALK 1150: Well, the latest is, of course, the jailhouse call that was released this afternoon. Also, there`s been a video release this afternoon of that. And you know...

GRACE: We`re showing that right now, Mark. Everyone, you are seeing actual phone calls of mom Casey behind bars, talking. These jailhouse tapes, Mark Williams -- stunning. She never breaks down.

WILLIAMS: No.

GRACE: She never cries. When people ask her about little Caylee, she never answers a single question. She keeps saying, This is a waste. Look, all I want is my boyfriend`s phone number. I don`t want to talk about Caylee.

WILLIAMS: Well, obviously, she is very self-centered for a 22-year- old woman. She won`t accept responsibility for what`s going on. It shows that the Anthony family is pretty much a dysfunctional family between Casey and her mother. Apparently, Casey doesn`t like her mother showing up on television all the time. And you`ve documented the fact that all she wants is the boyfriend`s mother (ph) -- the family`s trying to pump information from her, information that she`s not even giving investigators right now. So it is -- it is just a mosh (ph). I mean, this tape just blew my socks off this afternoon.

GRACE: Well, I got to tell you something, Mark. When the friend, Christina, is saying, Please, please tell me what you can about Caylee, she says, Oh, my God, what an F-ing waste this phone call was. That is her response.

Take a listen to mom Casey Anthony behind bars, being recorded on line with her mother.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY: ... waste my call sitting in, oh, the jail.

CINDY ANTHONY: Whose fault is you sitting in the jail? You`re blaming me that you`re sitting in the jail?

CASEY ANTHONY: Not my fault.

CINDY ANTHONY: Blame yourself for telling lies. What do you mean, it`s not your fault? What do you mean it`s not your fault, sweetheart? If you`d have told them the truth and not lied about everything, they wouldn`t...

CASEY ANTHONY: Do me a favor. Just tell me what Tony`s number is. I don`t want to talk to you right now. Forget it.

CINDY ANTHONY: I don`t have his number.

CASEY ANTHONY: Well, get it from Lee because I know Lee`s at the house. I saw Mallory`s car was out front. It was just on the news. They were just live outside the house.

CINDY ANTHONY: I know they were.

CASEY ANTHONY: Well?

CINDY ANTHONY: Well?

CASEY ANTHONY: Can you get Tony`s number for me so I can call him?

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Does Tony have anything to do with Caylee?

CASEY ANTHONY: No. Tony had nothing to do with Caylee.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh. So why do you want to talk to him? You probably don`t want to tell me.

CASEY ANTHONY: Because he`s my boyfriend and I want to actually try to sit and talk to him because I didn`t get a chance to talk to him earlier because I got arrested on a (DELETED) whim today because they`re blaming me for stuff that I never would do, that I didn`t do.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Well, I`m on nobody -- I`m on your side. You know that.

CASEY ANTHONY: Oh, honey, I know that. I just want to talk to Tony and get a little bit of...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Casey, you have to tell me if you know anything about Caylee.

CASEY ANTHONY: Sweetheart...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If anything happens to Caylee, Casey, I`ll die! You understand? I`ll die if anything happens to that baby!

CASEY ANTHONY: Whoa. Oh, my God. Calling you guys -- a waste, huge waste. Honey, I love you. You know I would not let anything happen to my daughter. If I knew where she was, this wouldn`t be going on.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Incredible. We also learn -- let`s go out to Drew Petrimoulx with WDBO Newsradio. Drew, I think Tony, who she keeps wanting to talk to, may have some answers, not necessarily where Caylee is, but if she were -- if she had been with Tony on and off throughout these five weeks she was missing, did Tony ever see the little girl? We know police have canvassed door to door in Tony, the boyfriend`s, apartment. Now, what they have learned, Drew, is that several residents there in the apartment complex say, Yes, we saw Caylee. We saw her here in the apartment complex swimming pool. The last time any of them saw the little girl was in early June.

What more can you tell us, Drew?

DREW PETRIMOULX, WDBO NEWSRADIO: Well, the thing is, you know, that`s pretty much -- around the middle part of June there was pretty much the last time anyone has seen he. While people in the neighborhood did see -- they had seen her playing in the pool (INAUDIBLE) like that, they haven`t seen her since she, you know, went missing. And while her boyfriend has said that he is helping investigators, he hasn`t to this point revealed any evidence that has led to a break in the case.

GRACE: You know -- back to Mark Williams at WNDB Newstalk 1150. Mark, I think that we can glean a great deal of evidence from what Tony, the boyfriend, observed. For instance, did she continue to tell him the baby was at the beach with the nanny, the baby was at an amusement park with the nanny? Has anybody except mom Casey ever seen the nanny?

WILLIAMS: Nobody has seen the nanny. I mean, you know, police have gone to her alleged address and she is nowhere to be found. Even Casey in that phone call this afternoon mentioned, Well, she may not be in the Florida database. She may be in the North Carolina database...

GRACE: Yes, I heard that.

WILLIAMS: ... or New York state.

GRACE: I heard that.

WILLIAMS: You know...

GRACE: She may not be just from Florida.

WILLIAMS: Yes, but -- well, the other thing is the fact that the father this afternoon, on a local media outlet, said they`re only a couple of thousand dollars away from releasing Casey from jail, which was a stunning revelation for me because that was the first time I had heard about that.

GRACE: Everybody, we are talking your calls live. Out to Ginny in Florida. Hi, Ginny.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. How`re you doing tonight?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Listen, honey, she had a whole month to get rid of this baby. Is it possible that she dumped it in plastic bags and took it to the dump, and now she feels very confident that no one`s going to find it? And I think the mother, the daughter, the whole family`s playing the system.

GRACE: You know, Ginny, I think that you have a very good point regarding the possibility the body has been disposed of. But I want you to listen to what the grandmother, grandmother Cindy, says. She`s trying make a 911 call. They`ve hooked (ph) her. She`s called the wrong jurisdiction. And while they`re waiting to get to the correct jurisdiction, the grandmother says, Listen -- the mother says, Give me one or day, give me one more day to find Caylee. The grandmother says, No, I`ve given you 30 days to find her, and if you don`t -- it goes inaudible. She says, We`re going to get a court order to get her.

So Ginny in Florida, that suggests to me that a grandmother, Cindy Anthony, truly believed at that juncture the little girl was alive.

Liz, do we have that sound? We do. Take a listen.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CINDY ANTHONY: ... because my next thing will be down to child (INAUDIBLE) thing and we`ll have a court order to get her. If that`s the way you want to play it, we`ll do it and you`ll never...

CASEY ANTHONY: That`s not the way I want to play it.

CINDY ANTHONY: Well, then you have to...

CASEY ANTHONY: Give me one more day.

CINDY ANTHONY: No, I`m not giving you another day. I`ve given you a month.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: To Donald Schweitzer, former detective with Santa Ana PD. That one slip right there, when they did not realize they were between phone calls, between the police and the sheriff`s office, they didn`t know they were still being recorded, says to me that Cindy Anthony up until this juncture really believed the little girl was still alive. What do you think?

DONALD SCHWEITZER, FORMER DETECTIVE, SANTA ANA PD: I agree with you, Nancy. I think that she was buying into the story that the child was with a missing nanny. But it also tells me that the mother doesn`t trust the daughter and that she`s questioning her and she`s probing and she`s threatening to report her to the police. So she knows that something`s wrong, as well, at that juncture.

GRACE: I think you`re right.

Back out to the lines. Mary Jo in New Jersey. Hi, Mary Jo.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. How`re you doing, Nancy?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, congratulations on your beautiful miracles.

GRACE: You know what? Thank you very much. I`ve got a photo for you later on tonight. What do you think about this case?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, I was actually wondering, how did Caylee`s father die, were her parents still together at the time?

GRACE: It`s my understanding that -- I think you were talking about Caylee, how did Caylee`s father die -- in a car crash. What do we know, Mark Williams?

WILLIAMS: That`s the information that I know, Nancy, that he died about a year ago in a car accident, and she`s been pretty much, you know, raising the child by herself, along with her parents, in east Orange County. That`s the only information we`ve been able to glean. And Tony came into her life -- this Tony Lazarro (ph) came into her life a couple of months ago, two months ago, so they`ve been an item for a while.

GRACE: And another issue regarding the death of the father of Caylee, Caylee`s father. We learned from police sources that the very first thing they did was reach out to all relatives, all family members and nail down their alibis, the last time they had seen Caylee. All of those relatives, to my understanding, Mary Jo in New Jersey, have been spoken to.

To Dr. Lawrence Kobilinsky, forensic scientist, joining us out of New York. This theory that Ginny called in from Florida, about the disposal of the body -- if there is a body, if it was disposed of in that manner, say, back in June, in a dump, in a trash dump, would there be any way to find it now?

LARRY KOBILINSKY, FORENSIC SCIENTIST: I think it would be exceptionally difficult. There would clearly be a great deal of decomposition and putrefaction. The question is, is could you detect the object in a plastic bag in a dump, and without having any insight into where to look. I mean, some of these dumps are enormous in size. I think it would be almost an impossible task to find that kind of object in a large dump.

GRACE: And back to Donald Schweitzer, former detective with Santa Ana PD. When she said -- and we`re about to play this for you -- the police refused to listen to her -- I`m talking about the recorded phone calls that have just been released as we go to air, jailhouse recordings of mom Casey on the phone with grandmother Cindy. She says on the phone, This woman is not just from Florida. She could be in North Carolina or New York. They`ve got to search the database. What about that?

SCHWEITZER: Nancy, I`ve actually read the police reports, and it appears to me that the police did everything they could to find this woman. They went to the house that this woman claimed to have been living. There`s no such person. They`ve done everything they can.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So how can I find out the information about that girl?

CASEY ANTHONY: Have them look up a New York license for Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez. They`ve just been looking up the last name Gonzalez or the last name Fernandez. If they looked up her entire name, they might actually find her. They haven`t done that. They haven`t listened to anything that I`ve said.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Where does she live? Because they went and looked at her place and...

CASEY ANTHONY: Baby, you`re not telling me anything that I don`t already know. Again, I only have been in jail since, oh, about 8:30 tonight. I was with them...

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You know that whoever has Caylee, nobody`s going to get away with it. Nobody.

CASEY ANTHONY: I know nobody`s going to get away with it. But at the same time, the only way they`re going to find Caylee is if they actually listen to what I`m saying. And I`m trying to help them and they`re not letting me help them.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So how can I help them find her? The best thing you can do, baby, is listen to me.

CASEY ANTHONY: They need to look up her information in the New York database and a North Carolina database, other places that she`s lived outside of Florida. That`s what I told them even again today. I told them that four times today.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining us, Susan Moss, Hugo Rodriguez and Seema Iyer. Susan Moss, weigh in.

SUSAN MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: She has no remorse for this loss. I mean, listen to her. Listen to her speak. It`s all about her. It`s all about her thoughts, her feelings and how the world has done her wrong. If she -- she lost her child, yet she doesn`t make any pleas to try to do more things to try to help find her child, other than looking up this mythical baby-sitter.

GRACE: Hugo?

HUGO RODRIGUEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I don`t disagree. It`s very mysterious. It`s a very troubled young woman.

GRACE: Mysterious?

RODRIGUEZ: Mysterious...

GRACE: What`s mysterious about it?

RODRIGUEZ: I mean her...

GRACE: She`s lying through her teeth. Is that a mystery?

RODRIGUEZ: It is -- if she is really sincere about finding daughter, it is mysterious. I don`t think an ordinary mother would be doing that, Nancy.

GRACE: Seema?

SEEMA IYER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I think you`re all looking at this like this is some smoking gun evidence. None of us are here to judge how she should react to this type of trauma and this type of loss. And this tape is evidence of nothing, zero, zilch.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY: I know you`re on my side, and I`m not trying to...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nobody`s saying anything bad about you. Your family is with you 100 percent.

CASEY ANTHONY: No, they`re not.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes...

CASEY ANTHONY: That`s (DELETED) because I just watched the (DELETED) news and heard everything that my mom said. Nobody in my own family is on my side.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, they are. Nobody has said...

CASEY ANTHONY: They just want Caylee back. That`s all they`re worried about right now is getting Caylee back. And you know what? That`s all I care about right now.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY: I know you`re on my side, and I`m not trying to...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nobody`s saying anything bad about you. Your family is with you 100 percent.

CASEY ANTHONY: No, they`re not.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes...

CASEY ANTHONY: That`s (DELETED) because I just watched the (DELETED) news and heard everything that my mom said. Nobody in my own family is on my side.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, they are. Nobody has said...

CASEY ANTHONY: They just want Caylee back. That`s all they`re worried about right now is getting Caylee back. And you know what? That`s all I care about right now.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Dr. Mark Hillman, clinical psychotherapist and author. Did you hear her say, All they care about is Caylee? That`s all they care about? In other words, they don`t care about me, they only care about her. What is wrong with her?

MARK HILLMAN, PSYCHOTHERAPIST: It`s called schizoid affective disorder. In other words, this is a very, very sick woman.

GRACE: Well, that`s not what I would have called it, but go ahead.

HILLMAN: This woman creates a very fabricated reality and then she occupies it. She says she`s concerned about her daughter. She lies to the police. She does her own investigation for 31 days. She`s cooking for Tony, the boyfriend. And she`s using her mother`s stolen credit card to go on a shopping spree. She lies about the baby-sitter. She lies about the address. She lies about working. And Judge Strickland said it best. The truth and Miss Anthony are complete strangers.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: So how can I find out the information about that girl?

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING 2-YEAR-OLD: Have them look up a New York license for Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez. They`ve just been looking up the last name Gonzalez or the last name Fernandez. If they looked up her entire name, they might actually find her. They haven`t done that. They haven`t listened to anything that I`ve said.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: Where does she live? Because they went and looked at her place.

CASEY: Baby, you`re not telling me anything that I don`t already know. Again, I`ve only been in jail since oh about 8:30 tonight. I was with them all day today. I know that. I was with officers, pretty much since 9:00 last night up until today, like up until this evening when I came up here.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: But you`re telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth? Because they`ll find.

CASEY: That it`s, I have no clue where my daughter is? Yes, that is the truth. That is the absolute truth.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: They`ll find out and whoever.

CASEY: OK. Christina, I`m hanging up.

CINDY ANTHONY, MISSING 2-YEAR-OLD`S GRANDMOTHER: I have a 3-year-old that`s been missing for a month.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: A 3-year-old?

CINDY: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: Have you reported that?

CINDY: I`m trying to do that now, ma`am.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: OK. What did the person do that you need arrested?

CINDY: My daughter.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: For what?

CINDY: For stealing an auto and stealing money.

Casey?

CASEY: Mom.

CINDY: Hey, sweetie.

CASEY: Well, I just saw your nice little cameo on TV.

CINDY: Which one?

CASEY: What do you mean which one?

CINDY: Which one? I did four different ones and I don`t know -- I haven`t seen them all. I`ve only seen one or two so far.

CASEY: You don`t know what my involvement is in stuff?

CINDY: Casey.

CASEY: Mom.

CINDY: What?

CASEY: No.

CINDY: I don`t know what your involvement is, sweetheart. You`re not telling me where she`s at.

CASEY: Because I don`t (EXPLETIVE DELETED) know where she`s at. Are you kidding me?

CINDY: Casey, don`t waste your call to scream and holler at me.

CASEY: No.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The grandmother, Cindy Anthony, remaining extremely poised and in control, almost placating her daughter behind bars.

You`re seeing newly released videos of Casey Anthony behind bars and these phone calls released as we go to air -- calls that could blow the case wide open while family and friends and family beg for information about missing Caylee, the 2-year-old daughter.

All mommy wants to talk about is her boyfriend.

Straight to the lines, Deidra in West Virginia. Hi, Deidra.

DEIDRA, WEST VIRGINIA RESIDENT: Hi, how are you, Nancy.

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

DEIDRA: First of all, I want to say thank you for having such a great show.

GRACE: Thank you. It`s actually a whole team of us.

DEIDRA: I know that.

GRACE: But I will pass that on, thank you.

DEIDRA: OK. And also, I just want to say that that girl -- mother is so self-differing that she is so self-centered that she`s not really caring where that child is. She is more interested in her boyfriend and such language that she uses.

GRACE: You know -- you know what, Deidra -- don`t you think, Deidra -- Liz, keep Deidra on the line, please. Don`t you think that she`d by saying, have you gotten any tips? Who`s manning the phone calls? What are you guys doing? Have you put out fliers?

DEIDRA: Exactly.

GRACE: Have you looked at this apartment complex? Have you looked in this apartment complex? Did you get the video from the airport? I mean wouldn`t you think she`d be asking those kind of questions? Just think about it. Can you imagine if somebody in your family goes missing, wouldn`t you be out on the street begging people to help you, Deidra?

DEIDRA: Yes, not a month from then, it would be the same day. And that`s the reason I feel that she is behind all this. And she doesn`t care about that little girl.

GRACE: You know let`s go to the defense lawyers. I think Deidra is correct.

Susan Moss with us, family law attorney, child advocate. Also with us, veteran defense attorney out of Miami, Hugo Rodriguez. Also with us, Seema Iyer, defense attorney out of New York.

What about it, Seema?

SEEMA IYER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: What about it is that you keep getting so excited about this.

GRACE: I`m not excited.

IYER: Yes, you`re very excited. You act like she`s saying.

GRACE: I am convinced.

IYER: . she is guilty.

GRACE: I am convinced that she knows more than what she`s telling us.

IYER: Well, and also the grandmother.

GRACE: If she cared about her daughter, she would tell us.

IYER: Yes, ma`am, but also the grandmother. Let us not forget that the grandmother said, I gave you 31 days. That means to me that the grandmother was in on it, she knew about it, and I would love to defend Casey so I could plan B the grandmother.

GRACE: And you might also notice, Seema, if you take that in context and the grandmother is trying to find out where the little girl is, and believes that she`s still alive, and she`s wanting to get a court order to take the little girl away.

IYER: I disagree. I disagree.

GRACE: You didn`t hear that?

IYER: I heard.

GRACE: OK, Liz, can you queue that up for me?

IYER: I`m listening.

GRACE: Seema appears to only hear in one ear, the bad one.

What about it, Hugo?

HUGO RODRIGUEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY, FMR. FBI AGENT: Listen, we`re focus -- we`re missing the focus. I know where you`re going but I`m going to said it before, let`s not race to judgment. She may be a poor mother. She may be a narcissistic.

GRACE: Not poor.

RODRIGUEZ: She may be involved with her boyfriend. But.

GRACE: She ran up $45,000 worth of debt on her mother`s credit card.

RODRIGUEZ: So that doesn`t mean that she has done anything improper with her child.

GRACE: So why did you say she`s poor?

RODRIGUEZ: I mean she`s poor because she made poor judgment.

GRACE: You feel sorry for her?

RODRIGUEZ: No. She made poor judgment. She may be narcissistic, she may be involved with her self, but let`s not race to judgment.

GRACE: No.

RODRIGUEZ: We`ve got Duke, we`ve got Atlanta. We`ve got Ramsey. Let`s hold on. Let`s hold on yet.

GRACE: What about Ramsey?

RODRIGUEZ: Why did they release all these? Yes, all these crisis.

GRACE: Well, why did you say.

RODRIGUEZ: All these people. We were ready to crucify her parents. And we -- we now know they had nothing to do with it.

GRACE: Whoa, whoa, whoa.

RODRIGUEZ: We were ready to crucify her parents.

GRACE: What are you talking about?

RODRIGUEZ: I`m saying.

GRACE: Focus in, bring it in.

RODRIGUEZ: Let`s focus in.

GRACE: Come on, bring it in. Let`s focus on this.

RODRIGUEZ: She`s been charged with obstructing a police investigation and child endearment.

GRACE: Endangerment.

RODRIGUEZ: Endangerment. I believe they`ve made a mistake in arresting her for these charges. They`re not going to get anywhere. She`s going to invoke her rights and not cooperate any further. What`s the purpose?

GRACE: And Susan Moss, don`t you believe that if she wanted to find her child -- and I appreciate what Seema and Hugo are saying, they`re veteran defense attorneys, that`s what they do for a living.

OK? Got it.

But don`t you think, practically speaking, Sue Moss, if you have a family member missing and you finally get through on that jail phone, there`s a line of 30 people you got to wait on to get to that phone, and it tells you, you`re being recorded, don`t you think she`d be saying, have you tried this? Have you called this person? Have you tried that person?

Nothing, nothing about finding the baby.

SUSAN MOSS, CHILD ADVOCATE, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: Amen. In this case, in this case, the evidence is mounting. I -- her trunk has the hair of the missing tot. My goodness, in jail, she should sit and rot. This woman is going to be crucified because of her own statements, her own doings, her own car and her own backyard.

GRACE: And speaking of that stain -- Dr. Lawrence Kobilinsky, joining us out of New York -- Kobi, it`s been several days now. They found the stain in the trunk with one of the ultraviolet lights. Can`t they at least tell me if it`s blood?

LAWRENCE KOBILINSKY, FORENSIC SCIENTIST: They would know that almost immediately. Nancy, they have field testing. They could have taken a fiber and tested it right there and then at least to get a presumptive determination.

GRACE: What about if it was cadaver fluid? When your body starts decomposing, it leaks.

KOBILISNKY: Yes, you would find the presence of human hemoglobin. They could have cut out that fabric, brought it back to the lab, done all kinds of tests, presumptive test, confirmatory test, species test. They should know what it is at this stage.

GRACE: Larry, you and I have seen whole cars dismantled just to get this much.

KOBILISNKY: Sure.

GRACE: . of a sample. Like you said, they`ll rip up that carpet, they`d take it in, and taken analysis on it immediately.

KOBILISNKY: Absolutely.

GRACE: And do you think they`ve got it and they`re just not telling us?

KOBILISNKY: I don`t -- yes, that`s a good question because these kind of results come back quickly. The issue now is, if it`s biological, if it`s human, is it this young little girl? And that, I mean, you need to have.

GRACE: Right.

KOBILISNKY: . something to compare it to. And they would know that in a matter of day or two.

GRACE: Well then, they would have that in the grandmother`s home.

KOBILISNKY: Yes.

GRACE: Her hair brush, anything to get a nucleus (INAUDIBLE), to get DNA.

KOBILISNKY: Absolutely, absolutely right. And they would know that quickly, a couple of days would be more than enough to bring this whole thing to a conclusion.

GRACE: Out to the lines, Jennifer in Florida. Hi, Jennifer.

JENNIFER, FLORIDA RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy. How are you?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

JENNIFER: Good. I have a question for you - well, first, I love your show.

GRACE: Thank you.

JENNIFER: And second, I remember two years ago, you had extensive coverage on the Trenton Duckett case.

GRACE: Yes.

JENNIFER: And this case, to me, has so many similarities to that one. It`s in the same area. This mother reminds me so much of the uncooperative Melinda Duckett. The kids were the same ages, the mothers were the same ages. I was wondering if there was some type of weird thing going on in that area with small children.

GRACE: You know what, a lot of people have made the comparison to the Duckett case. I don`t think it`s exclusive to the area but a lot of people have made that observation and, as you all know, Miss Duckett went to her grave never revealing what she else knew about the disappearance of her little girl -- of her little boy Trenton.

Everybody, we are taking your calls live.

Quickly to break, tonight, at your request, here is another picture of the twins. Now here they are, they look like they`re sitting up, but what we did. We held them to the last minute, and go one, two, three, and pulled back and take the picture. And then immediately they fell.

But this is such a big deal. This happened this week. Can you remember when they were in intensive care? We were all praying that they would live?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CINDY: Because my next thing will be down to child (INAUDIBLE) and we`ll have a court order to get her. If that`s the way you want to play, we`ll do it and you`ll never.

CASEY: That`s not the way I want to play.

CINDY: Well, then, you have.

CASEY: Give me one more day.

CINDY: No, I`m not giving you another day. I`ve given you a month.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWSBREAK)


Transcript too long- the rest here:


http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0807/25/ng.01.html

[ReddCurrlz]

FOXNews.com
Missing Florida Girl's Grandmother Asks Police to Arrest Daughter for 'Grand Theft' in 911 Call

Friday , July 25, 2008

The grandmother of a missing 2-year-old Florida girl told a 911 dispatcher that she wanted to press charges against her daughter for "grand theft" after she learned of the tot's disappearance, according to a new recording released Friday.

A frantic Cindy Anthony can also be heard threatening to file a court order against her daughter, Casey Marie Anthony, to get Casey's little girl Caylee Marie Anthony away from her.

The new tape released Friday was of the very first call Cindy Anthony made to 911, which was handled by Orlando police. They then rerouted her to the Orange County Sheriff's Department, which is investigating the case. In all, Cindy Anthony had three conversations with 911 dispatchers July 15.

"I have a 22-year-old person that has, um, grand theft sitting in my auto with me," she said in the first. "My car was stolen. We've retrieved it; today we found out where it was at. We've retrieved it, I've got that. And I've got affidavits from my banking account. I want to bring her in. I want to press charges."

After the emergency responder told her she will be transferred to Orange County sheriffs, Cindy Anthony can be heard warning her daughter Casey in the background.

"My next thing will be child's thing and we'll have a court order to get her if that's what you wanna play. We'll do it and you'll never..." she said.

Casey's reply is inaudible, to which Cindy Anthony retorted: "Well, then, you have ... no, I'm not giving you another day. I've given you a month."

Click here to listen to the first 911 call on MyFOXOrlando.com. (http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/MyFox/pages/sidebar_video.jsp?contentId=7065255&version=1&locale=EN-US)

Click here to listen to the other 911 calls on MyFOXOrlando.com. (http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/MyFox/pages/sidebar_video.jsp?contentId=7061306&version=1&locale=EN-US)

Cindy Anthony said in the calls that her daughter Casey had just admitted that Caylee had been missing for about a month and she didn't know where she was.

"I have someone here that I need to be arrested ... in my home," Cindy Anthony said in the second call. She told the dispatcher that she was referring to her daughter and that it involved the disappearance of a toddler. The 911 responder asked her why she wanted her daughter taken into custody.

"For stealing an auto and stealing money," she replied. "I already spoke with someone. ... I was going to drive her to the police station and no one's open. They said they would bring a deputy to my home when I got home to call them."

Click here for a transcript of the first 911 call. (http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/ContentDetail?contentId=7065515)

Click here for a transcript of the second 911 call. (http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/ContentDetail?contentId=7059935)

Click here for a transcript of the third 911 call. (http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/ContentDetail?contentId=7059944)

The grandmother told an emergency dispatcher in the third call that a car driven by Casey Anthony smelled like there had been a dead body inside.

That candid description by Cindy Anthony was echoed this week by police, but Anthony later changed her story and disputed police testimony that the car's trunk smelled of human decomposition.

The latest twists come as police and family continue their efforts to find Caylee.

Her mother, 22-year-old Casey Anthony, remained in jail Thursday in Orange County, Fla., on a $500,000 bond after investigators said she lied to them and did not report Caylee missing for 31 days.

Prosecutors said in court earlier this week that Casey Anthony also is a person of interest in what is beginning to look like a homicide investigation, though she has not been charged.

Click here for photos. (http://www.foxnews.com/photoessay/0,4644,4590,00.html)

Click here for photos of the bond hearing from MyFOXOrlando.com. (http://media.myfoxorlando.com/photogalleries/072208anthonybondhearing/indexGallery.htm)

In addition to asking that Casey be arrested in Cindy Anthony's first two 911 conversations on July 15, she told dispatchers that she had just found Casey, who had been missing for a month, as well as the car she was driving, which had been towed. She also expressed concern that her granddaughter was not with Casey.

She called 911 again about an hour later, crying, saying Casey Anthony finally told her Caylee had also been missing for a month.

"There's something wrong," Cindy Anthony told the dispatcher. "I found my daughter's car today, and it smells like there's been a dead body in the damn car."

In Cindy's third 911 conversation on July 15, she made her daughter talk to the dispatcher, at which point Casey said the toddler had been taken by a baby sitter who police now believe may not exist.

The dispatcher asked why she hadn't called sooner.

"I've been looking for her and have gone through other resources to try to find her, which was stupid," Casey responded.

Police named Casey Anthony a person of interest in Caylee's disappearance after saying at the Tuesday bond hearing that they detected the odor of human decomposition and found dirt and strands of hair similar to Caylee's in the trunk of the car.

Later Wednesday, Cindy Anthony disputed those claims, suggesting instead that it was the smell of old food or garbage they'd picked up instead.

"Do me a favor," she said. "Put a little piece of pizza or any piece of garbage in your car today and leave it shut up for 15, 16, 17, 18, 19 days in this heat and then come back to me in 19 days and tell me what it smells like."

Orange County Sheriff's Deputy Carlos Padilla told FOX News on Friday that the odor was overwhelming, and was completely different from that of old pizza or other rotting food.

He also said that samples from a mysterious stain found in the trunk were still at a lab for testing, and police were awaiting the results.

Detectives, like the family, are focused on finding Caylee too, according to Padilla — but they've been stymied by the lack of information they've been able to get from her mother. For one thing, they don't have a straight answer about where Casey Anthony was in the month between the time the little girl was last seen and the time she was reported missing.

"We don’t know anything about her exact location because from the beginning she hasn’t told us about the child’s whereabouts," Padilla told FOX on Friday. "We’ve talked to friends and other people, and they themselves didn’t know this child was missing."

He said Casey Anthony sometimes told people Caylee was with her mother and other times said she was with a nanny.

The Anthony family still is mum on a TV station's tip that a new concrete slab was poured in the grandparents' backyard over July 4 weekend, shortly before they reported Caylee's disappearance.

But on Thursday, Cindy Anthony said there have been two reported sightings of 2-year-old Caylee in Georgia and she believes her granddaughter is with someone heading to Charlotte, N.C.

"We know where she's at," Cindy Anthony told FOX News on Thursday before pleading with the person she believes has the child to turn back. "Please don't take her further into the mountains. It looks like she's headed northeast in Georgia close to the North Carolina border. ... This is all very encouraging right now."

Her plea came after her husband, George Anthony, asked the public in an audio message for help in finding their granddaughter before her third birthday. Caylee was last seen on Father's Day, June 15.

Click here to read more on the reported sightings of Caylee from (http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/News/Detail?contentId=7056290&version=8&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=3.1.1)MyFOXOrlando.com.

Cadaver dogs searched the grandparents' property last week after a neighbor told them Casey Anthony borrowed a shovel around the time her small daughter was last seen. Casey and Caylee were living with George and Cindy Anthony, reportedly, until the time the toddler vanished.

Casey Anthony has been charged only with child neglect, making false official statements and obstructing a criminal investigation.

But Circuit Court Judge Stan Strickland ordered her held on an unusually high bond Tuesday after hearing the evidence of possible human decomposition found in her yard and car.

Strickland said she offered investigators no useful information and questioned the truthfulness of the information she did provide.

Casey Anthony's attorney, Jose Baez, has asked to have her bond lowered to $10,000, saying she had a right to freedom while facing lesser charges. He said there was circumstantial evidence of a possible homicide but it hadn't left authorities confident enough to charge her with anything more serious.

Click for here more from MyFOXOrlando.com. (http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/pages/ContentDetail?contentId=7059312)

FOX News' Catherine Donaldson-Evans and The Associated Press contributed to this report.

<snip>
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,391001,00.html

[Faith]

Missing Tot's Mom: 'The Media Misconstrued Everything I Said'

Monday, July 28, 2008

This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," July 25, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

JAMIE COLBY, FOX NEWS HOST: Tonight, a shocking jailhouse call in the case of missing 2-year-old Caylee Anthony. I'm Jamie Colby. Good evening. I'm in for Greta Van Susteren.

Casey Anthony is behind bars tonight after she failed to report her daughter missing for more than a month. Listen to this phone call that was made by Casey to her mother, her brother and her friend, recorded just hours after she was arrested.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CINDY ANTHONY, GRANDMOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: Casey?

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: Mom.

CINDY ANTHONY: Hi, sweetie.

CASEY ANTHONY: Well, I just saw your nice little cameo on TV.

CINDY ANTHONY: Which one?

CASEY ANTHONY: What do you mean, which one?

CINDY ANTHONY: Which one? I did four different ones, and I don't know -- I haven't seen them all. I've only seen one or two so far.

CASEY ANTHONY: You don't know what my involvement is in stuff?

CINDY ANTHONY: Casey...

CASEY ANTHONY: Mom?

CINDY ANTHONY: What?

CASEY ANTHONY: No.

CINDY ANTHONY: I don't know what your involvement is, sweetheart. You're not telling me where she's at.

CASEY ANTHONY: Because I don't (DELETED) know where she's at. Are you kidding me?

CINDY ANTHONY: Casey, don't waste your call to scream and holler at me.

CASEY ANTHONY: ... Waste my call sitting in, oh, the jail.

(CROSSTALK)

CINDY ANTHONY: Whose fault is you sitting in the jail? You're blaming me that you're sitting in the jail?

CASEY ANTHONY: Not my fault.

CINDY ANTHONY: Blame yourself for telling lies. What do you mean, it's not your fault? What do you mean it's not your fault, sweetheart? If you'd have told them the truth and not lied about everything, they wouldn't...

CASEY ANTHONY: Do me a favor. Just tell me what Tony's number is. I don't want to talk to you right now. Forget it. I don't want any of you coming up here when I have my first hearing for bond and everything else. Like, don't even (DELETED) waste your time coming up here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're going to find out, something, whatever's going on, it's going to be found out. So why not do it now, save yourself...

CASEY ANTHONY: There's nothing to find out. There's absolutely nothing to find out (INAUDIBLE) what I told the detectives.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, you know, everything you've been telling them is a lie.

CASEY ANTHONY: I have no clue where Caylee is. If I knew where Caylee was, do you think any of this would be happening? No. And I appreciate everything that you're trying to do, but I'd like to call Tony. He's not at my house, is he?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No. No. It's just me and your parents and Lee.

CASEY ANTHONY: OK. Well, can you do me a favor and get my brother back or get the number from him, please?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Does Tony have anything to do with Caylee?

CASEY ANTHONY: No. Nothing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. So why do you want to talk to Tony? You probably don't want to tell me, do you.

CASEY ANTHONY: Huh?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You probably don't want to tell me, do you.

CASEY ANTHONY: What are you -- I didn't hear what you said.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I said, Does Tony have anything to do with Caylee?

CASEY ANTHONY: No. Tony had nothing to do with Caylee.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh. So why do you want to talk to him?

You probably don't want to tell me.

CASEY ANTHONY: Because he's my boyfriend and I want to actually try to sit and talk to him because I didn't get a chance to talk to him earlier because I got arrested on a (DELETED) whim today because they're blaming me for stuff that I never would do, that I didn't do.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Casey, you have to tell me if you know anything about Caylee.

CASEY ANTHONY: Sweetheart...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If anything happens to Caylee, Casey, I'll die! You understand? I'll die if anything happens to that baby!

CASEY ANTHONY: Whoa. Oh, my God. Calling you guys -- a waste, huge waste. Honey, I love you. You know I would not let anything happen to my daughter. If I knew where she was, this wouldn't be going on.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So how come everybody's saying you're lying?

CASEY ANTHONY: Because nobody's (DELETED) listening to anything that I'm saying. The media completely misconstrued everything that I said. The (DELETED) detectives told them (DELETED) (DELETED). They got all of their information from me, yet at the same time, they're twisting stuff. They've already said they're going to pin this on me if they don't find Caylee. They've already said that.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well...

CASEY ANTHONY: They arrested me because they said that...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, because they said that the person that you dropped Caylee with doesn't even exist.

CASEY ANTHONY: Because -- oh, look, they can't find her in the Florida database. She's not just from Florida. If they would actually listen to anything that I would have said to them, they would have had their lead. They maybe could have tracked her down. They haven't listened to a (DELETED) that I've said.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You know that whoever has Caylee, nobody's going to get away with it. Nobody.

CASEY ANTHONY: I know nobody's going to get away with it. But at the same time, the only way they're going to find Caylee is if they actually listen to what I'm saying. And I'm trying to help them and they're not letting me help them.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So how can I help them find her? The best thing you can do, baby, is listen to me.

CASEY ANTHONY: They need to look up her information in the New York database and a North Carolina database, other places that she's lived outside of Florida. That's what I told them even again today. I told them that four times today. I sat up at the police station, out at the county police station for...

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... Who has Caylee, or she's transferred Caylee to somebody else? Because...

CASEY ANTHONY: Honey, I haven't talked to her! I don't know. I haven't talked to her.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How come everybody's saying that you're not upset, that you're not crying, that you showed no caring of where Caylee is at all?

CASEY ANTHONY: Because I'm not sitting here (DELETED) crying every two seconds because I have to stay composed to talk to detectives, to make other phone calls, to do other things. I can't sit here and be crying every two seconds like I want to. I can't.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK, Casey, don't yell at me. I'm on your side. I'm on your side.

CASEY ANTHONY: I know you're not...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Trust me.

CASEY ANTHONY: I know you're on my side. I'm not trying to...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nobody's saying anything bad about you. Your family is with you 100 percent.

CASEY ANTHONY: No, they're not.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes...

CASEY ANTHONY: That's (DELETED) because I just watched the (DELETED) news and heard everything that my mom said. Nobody in my own family is on my side.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, they are. Nobody has said...

CASEY ANTHONY: They just want Caylee back. That's all they're worried about right now is getting Caylee back. And you know what? That's all I care about right now.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You can't tell me anybody that can find Caylee, nobody?

CASEY ANTHONY: No. Because every number that I've tried, every number that I've called is disconnected. Nothing. I can't get ahold of anybody.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But that -- that girl was the last person to have her?

CASEY ANTHONY: She was the last person to have her. That was the last time I saw Caylee.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But you're telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth? Because they'll find...

CASEY ANTHONY: I said I have no clue where my daughter is? Yes, that is the truth. That is the absolute truth.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

COLBY: Stunning jailhouse calls. Joining me now live in Orlando is Rozzie Franco, reporter for WFLA radio and the Florida News Network. Rozzie, thanks for joining us.

ROZZIE FRANCO, WFLA: Thank you for having me, Jamie. This call is truly shocking. This call came in just hours after she was arrested. You can see how she was highly combative. She was hostile toward her mother and completely callous. When her friend asked her about Caylee, she just completely scoffs (ph) off the question and asked where her boyfriend is. And she just doesn't seem concerned at all. As a matter of fact, when she opened the call, she says, You know, Mom, I saw your cameo on television. It just doesn't -- it really gives insight to the demeanor of Casey Anthony.

COLBY: Yes, Rozzie, let me ask you a little bit about some specifics from the call and what the reaction of people there, as well as authorities, has been. She seemed surprised that her family, all they want right now is Caylee back. What do you hear about that?

FRANCO: Right. It's almost when she asks the question, and she says, All my family wants is Caylee back, she almost sounds contemptuous. And then it's an afterthought when she says, I want Caylee back, as well. She's not been cooperative with Orange County investigators. She's given them information. She's told lie after lie.

Today, the latest that came down was Deputy Carlos Padilla (ph) said that her attorney, Jose Baez, was -- he called and actually asked to speak to Orange County investigators and said that Casey was going to open up. And I just spoke to Casey's mother just minutes ago, and she confirmed that they did have some sort of conversation, but that dialogue has not been released yet. But as of now, she's not been cooperative with investigators.

COLBY: And Rozzie, let me ask you about Caylee's grandmother, who is, I assume, in the house behind you. These calls do not really necessarily make her look -- it could be in a less favorable light because she says, I've given you 30 days, in one of the calls, and I'm not going to give you more time. And there are the 911 calls and then there are also these jailhouse calls. And then all Casey wants is a number for Tony. Who's Tony, and what could he have to do with all of this?

FRANCO: Well, Tony actually has set up a MySpace page and Caylee and missing and finding -- trying to find Caylee. And Tony is actually Casey's boyfriend. And what's ironic about the whole thing is the call -- is she's asking for Tony, which is her boyfriend, and not divulging any kind of information to her friend, to her brother, to her mother on who has Caylee or where Caylee might be.

COLBY: OK, but she seemed shocked when she says to her mother -- and this is what really stood out in my mid -- You don't know what my involvement is, Mom? Does the mother, the grandmother of Caylee, know what the involvement is?

FRANCO: Well, actually, I spoke to Cindy and she says that this situation has brought her and Casey closer than they were before. Now, like you heard in the call, she said, I've given you a month and I'm not giving you one more day. I'm calling authorities, which is -- that was Cindy's frustration. She was trying to find Caylee for an entire month, and Casey was giving her excuse after excuse on where the girl was until she finally called in to authorities.

COLBY: All right. Whatever these parties know, Rozzie, they're not giving it up very easily. Thanks for the latest from the scene.

Coming up, you will hear the newly released 911 call that is related to the disappearance of little Caylee Anthony. How long has Caylee's grandmother, seen pictured here, known that a little girl is missing? There are big questions tonight and new information.

And later, cycling legend Lance Armstrong goes "On the Record." Greta sat down with Lance in Washington. The seven-time Tour de France winner has a mission. And guess what? It's other than cycling. Tonight, that's coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COLBY: How long has Caylee Anthony's grandmother known the little girl was missing? This is a very big question tonight. And there's a third 911 call that's been released related to the disappearance of the 2- year-old girl. Caylee's mother is behind bars for failing to report that her daughter was missing for more than a month.

Well, yesterday, police released two 911 calls that were placed on July 15. Today they've released a third. This is actually the first 911 call that was placed by little Caylee's grandmother.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CINDY ANTHONY: Hi. I'm -- I drove to the police department here on Pershing (ph) but you guys are closed. I need to bring someone in to the police department. Can you tell me where I can -- the closest one I can come into?

911 OPERATOR: What are you trying to accomplish by bringing them to the station?

CINDY ANTHONY: I have a 22-year-old person that has grand theft sitting in my auto with me.

911 OPERATOR: So the 22-year-old person stole something?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

911 OPERATOR: Is this a relative?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

911 OPERATOR: Where did they steal it from?

CINDY ANTHONY: My car and also money.

911 OPERATOR: OK. Is this your son?

CINDY ANTHONY: Daughter.

911 OPERATOR: OK. So your daughter stole money from your car?

CINDY ANTHONY: No, my car was stolen. We've retrieved it today. We found out where it was and retrieved it. I've got that. And I've got an affidavit for my banking account. I want to bring her in. I want to press charges.

911 OPERATOR: OK. Where did all of this happen?

CINDY ANTHONY: Oh, it's been happening.

911 OPERATOR: No, no, but I need to establish a jurisdiction, is what I'm trying...

CINDY ANTHONY: Oh, I live in -- in Orlando.

911 OPERATOR: Yes, but what address did these thefts occur at?

CINDY ANTHONY: Well, I guess my residence.

911 OPERATOR: That's actually going to be in the jurisdiction of the sheriff's office, ma'am...

CINDY ANTHONY: OK.

911 OPERATOR: ... Not the Orlando Police Department.

CINDY ANTHONY: All righty.

911 OPERATOR: Let me transfer you over to the communications section.

CINDY ANTHONY: ... Because my next thing will be down to child (INAUDIBLE) thing and we'll have a court order to get her. If that's the way you want to play it, we'll do it and you'll never...

CASEY ANTHONY: That's not the way I want to play it.

CINDY ANTHONY: Well, then you have to...

CASEY ANTHONY: (INAUDIBLE)

CINDY ANTHONY: No, I'm not giving you another day. I've given you a month.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

COLBY: Let's bring in the panel now. In San Francisco, criminal defense attorney Michael Cardoza. In Los Angeles, attorney Gloria Allred. And in Washington, D.C., criminal defense attorneys Ted Williams and Bernie Grimm. Good to see all of you tonight.

MICHAEL CARDOZA, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You, too, Jamie.

COLBY: Gloria, what is your impression of this call and the fact that the grandmother says, I've given you 30 days, I'm not giving you another day?

GLORIA ALLRED, VICTIMS' RIGHTS ATTORNEY: Jamie, it may be that she was talking with her every day, as she has indicated at another point, and/or sending her text messages. And it may be that the grandmother wanted to see Caylee and kept asking, Where is she? What's happening? When can I see her? Why can't I see her? And maybe there were excuses being given by Casey about why she couldn't yet see Caylee, why she couldn't bring her to her. And she kept putting her off. And finally, apparently, the mom, if you believe her, found her daughter, Casey, and then still couldn't find Caylee. And that's when she decided the police needed to be involved.

COLBY: Ted, I'm still trying to decide, from an investigative standpoint, whether or not this grandmother was initially more concerned about the theft of her car or the fact that her granddaughter hadn't been seen for more than 30 days. What's your impression? And has it changed at all now that you've heard this new call?

TED WILLIAMS, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Jamie, I'm of the impression, and I was last night when we heard the first of the two 911 calls, that the grandmother knows more. And now, when we hear about the fact that she's given Casey the month to come forward with information concerning Caylee, it confirms to me that the grandmother knows more.

Now, listen here. When you listen to these tapes, you hear Casey. She's cool as a cucumber. The fact about it is, I believe that if you go back through a fingerprint (ph) history of Casey, you may find where she's either had in the past psychiatric treatment or she is certainly in need of it now. She is clearly, as I see it, to be a habitual liar as it pertains to where Caylee is.

COLBY: Right. I guess, though, mental illness doesn't necessarily make you a kidnapper or potentially a murderer. We certainly hope that's not the case. But let me ask you, Michael, if the grandmother did know something, maybe not the exact location of Caylee but maybe someone that might be involved in her disappearance, this Zenaida housekeeper, baby- sitter, or somebody else, could she be implicated in the crime, even if she doesn't give specific information?

CARDOZA: Technically, I suppose, she could be implicated in the crime. I mean, she could be an accessory to a crime. Will it happen? No. I prosecuted for 15 years. I don't think there's any DA that would prosecute this grandmother. Listening to that tape, she obviously knows the daughter is not around. She is the mother that's concerned about her daughter and her granddaughter. And she says, Come on, where's my granddaughter? It's been 30 days no. No more. I'm taking you to the police station. Now, in answer to your...

COLBY: And she does. She actually...

CARDOZA: ... Question about...

COLBY: ... Calls the cops on her daughter.

CARDOZA: Sure, she did. And think about how hard that is to do. I mean, that has to be one of the most difficult things in the world to do...

WILLIAMS: No, no, Mike...

CARDOZA: ... Is to call the cops...

WILLIAMS: ... Not for her.

CARDOZA: Come on, Ted. Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: She was more concerned about the automobile.

COLBY: All right, let me let Bernie -- Bernie...

CARDOZA: No.

COLBY: ... Let me let you weigh in...

CARDOZA: Ted, no, that was an excuse to get her to the jail.

COLBY: OK, we're going to come back after the break and talk more. But before we do, Bernie, let me ask you your impression. Casey's in jail. She says she's cooperating. She says, if they'd only listen to what she has to say, they'd know where Caylee is. You buying it?

BERNIE GRIMM, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yes. And this is the best way to listen to her, and a true investigator like Ted Williams would know what I'm talking about. Why in the world did the jail ever leak out that they have this connection, this open line of communication? It's rich. It's genuine. It's detailed. You'd find out probably tomorrow where Caylee is by listening to these phone calls. I'm glad we have them because we can report on them, but now this line of communication is just now shut down. I am shocked...

COLBY: Bernie, great point...

GRIMM: ... And just...

COLBY: We might have learned a lot more if they would have kept it to themselves for a while, but it is so...

WILLIAMS: Absolutely.

COLBY: ... Interesting to hear these calls. And we also have a jailhouse visit that happened today. We've got that to show everyone, as well. Panel, stand by.

In fact, coming up, you will see and you will hear a jailhouse meeting that Casey Anthony had with one of her friends. What did they talk about? The mother of missing Caylee Anthony in her own words.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,392201,00.html

[ReddCurrlz]

NANCY GRACE

Missing Tot`s Mom Thinks Child Is Alive and Close to Home

Aired July 28, 2008 - 20:00:00 ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DIANE DIMOND, GUEST HOST: Breaking news tonight in the case of little Caylee Marie Anthony. As we go to air, new and shocking jailhouse telephone tapes just released. Caylee`s mom just can`t seem to stay off the telephone, and we now learn that she`s told her family she believes her little girl is alive and close to home. This as police are reportedly pouring over a new videotape made of a prison visit between Caylee`s mother and her grandmother that might offer up clues to Caylee`s whereabouts.
Only now does Casey Anthony say she`s ready to talk about the disappearance of her daughter with authorities. She`s kept mum for the 11 days she`s been in jail, according her family, because she doesn`t trust the local police. They`ve said that she would rather talk to the FBI. Is time running out for this beautiful little girl, or is it already too late?

Also tonight, Caylee`s grandmother makes the media rounds, defending her daughter, claiming Casey is keeping quiet to protect her little girl and to protect the entire family. What`s that all about? But the bottom line, the only question that matters right now is, Where is this little girl?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Breaking news. Casey Anthony`s attorney, Jose Baez, has just requested an emergency hearing, scheduled for tomorrow, hoping to prevent investigators and the jail from releasing any more surveillance tapes of Casey Anthony and her visitors.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her attorney has been claiming lately that she`s willing to talk to the FBI, and what we`re hearing about that is nothing is stopping her from doing that. That is her call and her call only. And so far, she hasn`t made a call to the FBI, telling them to come on over to the jail to talk.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Casey, you have to tell me if you know anything about Caylee.

CASEY ANTHONY, MISSING TODDLER`S MOTHER: Sweetheart...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If anything happens to Caylee, Casey, I`ll die! You understand? I`ll die if anything happens to that baby!

CASEY ANTHONY: Whoa. Oh, my God. Calling you guys -- a waste, huge waste. Honey, I love you. You know I would not let anything happen to my daughter. If I knew where she was, this wouldn`t be going on.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

DIMOND: Good evening. I`m Diane Dimond, in tonight for Nancy Grace. Tonight, to the desperate search for a 2-year-old Florida girl, Caylee Marie Anthony. As we go to air, new and shocking jailhouse tapes just released. We will have those tapes for you later in this broadcast.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just moments ago, breaking developments. Casey Anthony`s attorney, Jose Baez, hopes to prevent investigators from releasing any more surveillance tapes of Casey Anthony, Baez requesting a hearing tomorrow to stop the release of any new tapes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Little Caylee Anthony -- the 2-year-old girl has been missing since mid-June. Mom is jail on charges she lied to police about her daughter`s disappearance, didn`t report it until month later, yet she`s the one that doesn`t trust the cops. Apparently, she`s now willing to talk to the FBI.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY: I know you`re on my side. I`m not trying to...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nobody`s saying anything bad about you. Your family is with you 100 percent.

CASEY ANTHONY: No, they`re not.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes...

CASEY ANTHONY: That`s (DELETED) because I just watched the (DELETED) news and heard everything that my mom said. Nobody in my own family is on my side.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, they are. Nobody has said...

CASEY ANTHONY: They just want Caylee back. That`s all they`re worried about right now is getting Caylee back. And you know what? That`s all I care about right now.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

DIMOND: Oh, thanks for joining us tonight. The continuation, it seems, of a national vigil for a tiny girl whose whereabouts are unknown. And it`s inconceivable to most of us that the adults in her life -- her mother, her grandparents, her uncle -- have not yet all officially sat down with police to tell them what they need to know to try to bring this child back to safety.

Tonight, so much to report to you. We have just heard about a surveillance videotape made of this young mother and her mother during a prison interview. There`s going to be a court hearing on that tomorrow. Also just released, some telephone calls that Casey Anthony made home to her parents in which she tells a little bit more about what she says may have happened to her daughter. We will bring those to you later in the broadcast.

Tonight, though, we want to try to bring this story all together, to put some perspective on what we are dealing with here. Who is this 22- year-old, unmarried mother who loses track of her child for 31 days? What`s with the grandmother, who seems to be speaking to every TV camera around, but not in an official conversation with the police? And where`s grandpa, who, by the way, used to be a police officer himself? If he has knowledge or some doubts about his daughter and what happened to his grandchild, if he has any doubts at all about all this, he should be sitting down and talking to authorities.

Let`s start at the very top of a very long list of questions we have with a local reporter from the Orlando, Florida area. Mark Williams is from WNB -- I`m sorry, WNDB Newsradio in Orlando. Hi, Mark. How are you? Let`s play 10 quick questions here, OK?

MARK WILLIAMS, WNDB NEWSTALK 1150: OK.

DIMOND: All right. First of all, before all this happened, where did this mother and her little girl live?

WILLIAMS: Apparently, they lived at the house with George and Cindy Anthony.

DIMOND: The grandparents.

WILLIAMS: Yes, the grandparents, and lived there for a long period of time.

DIMOND: OK. Now, where did she work?

WILLIAMS: She was unemployed. She had told people that she had worked at Universal Studios, but she had not worked there for two-and-a- half years. So she was literally unemployed.

DIMOND: OK, but she told people that she was going to work every day, and she had a, quote, "nanny" or a baby-sitter that she dropped the child off with every day. Where was she going, do we have any idea?

WILLIAMS: No idea whatsoever. And that`s what authorities want to know. There`s that 30-day lapse in there between the time the child disappeared to where we are today, and she cannot account for any of those days.

DIMOND: All right. I want to know more about what the community is saying about this -- this young mother. Let`s bring in Diana Bosch. She`s a reporter with another news radio station in Orlando, WDBO. So Diana, tell me what you have learned from the community. I understand you went to a vigil last night. What are people saying about Casey Anthony? What kind of person is she?

DIANA BOSCH, WDBO NEWSRADIO: Well, last night, there was a vigil held at the Anthony family home. It was at around 8:00 PM. And yes, it was raining, and there wasn`t more than 60 people that showed up. And there were tears. You know, there was a minister there that gave a good sermon and a good prayer about still having hope to find Caylee. The focus was mostly on Caylee. Nobody was talking about Casey or the situation that`s going on in the jail.

DIMOND: OK, now, Diana, let me interrupt you and ask you -- have you, in the course of your reporting -- and I want to ask Mark this, too. Have you learned anything personal about Casey Anthony, talked to high school friends or -- I mean, was she is a wild child? Does she have a police record? What do you know about her character?

BOSCH: Well, the only thing that we`ve learned is that she had been known to be some sort of a composite (SIC) liar. You know, she had -- she had said -- she had been known to say things and then, you know, twist her stories around. But other than that, that was the only thing that we really found out about her personality.

DIMOND: That`s it. Mark, you? Has your station learned anything particular about her character?

WILLIAMS: Well, just what Diana Bosch has just brought up about -- about Casey. But what from what we`ve been able to gather, she`s kind of been a quiet individual, living with the grandmother and the grandfather at their home in east Orange County, and that`s pretty much it.

DIMOND: You know, I`m not the only one with a long list of questions. We`ve already got callers phoning in. Dorothy is calling us from Ohio. Hi, Dorothy.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi.

DIMOND: What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I want to know, did they take a cadaver dog in to the area where her car was stranded or abandoned?

DIMOND: Yes, Dorothy. I can answer that question for you. Not only did they bring a cadaver dog, a sniffer dog, in to smell -- and they alerted on the trunk of Casey Anthony`s car, but they also brought one in - - you can see in the back yard right there, where the grandparents lived. And the dog also alerted there.

Pat Brown, let me go back to you now because I`m still fascinated by who this woman is, who, hello, loses her child for 31 days. Pat Brown, of course, the FBI criminal profiler. What kind of character are we dealing with here, Pat?

PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: Well, from what I`ve seen, we have seen the pathological lying. We have seen a great deal of narcissism. Casey is about herself. Even on telephone, she`s more interested in whether anybody`s paying attention to her, whether her family is concerned about her, not that child. And we`re talking about the desperate search for Caylee, and yet I have seen no desperation from Casey whatsoever. She isn`t concerned, apparently, that her daughter might be crying, that her daughter might be suffering. And she seems to be more trusting of the kidnapper than she is of the police, so she`d rather keep quiet so the kidnapper can keep the child as long as possible.

DIMOND: Yes. See, this, Pat -- this is what I just don`t understand. The mother is saying, in effect, Oh, well, you know, she`s been mum because it`ll keep all of us safe. In other words, she is trusting the person who allegedly has her daughter?

BROWN: Right. Exactly. I mean, this is a ludicrous story, and it`s hard to trust any of this. And what I see is a person who is very self- serving, very narcissistic and possibly psychopathic. And for that reason, my concerns are that the child may not be alive today.

DIMOND: Yes, see, that`s what I`m worried about, too. Who better now to bring in than Robi Ludwig, a psychotherapist. Robi, what do you think is the type of character we`re dealing with? Because everything, everything centers around what that this mother knows at this point, doesn`t it?

ROBI LUDWIG, PSYCHOTHERAPIST: Yes. She`s grossly immature, and I would agree that she does seem to have some narcissistic tendencies. I would want to rule out if she`s a drug addict in any way.

DIMOND: Me, too.

LUDWIG: I mean, it just seems like her behavior is so bizarre and her judgment is so off, I wonder if she`s an addict. Did she sell the baby for money for drugs? There seems to be some type of secret going on that we don`t know, that`s making this whole story really not make any sense whatsoever.

DIMOND: You`re absolutely right. And you know what, Robi? When we hear what that secret is -- maybe, you know, she passed the child off for a payment for a drug debt, I mean, who knows. All of us have heard such bizarre things in the course of our careers. When we learn this secret, we`re all going to go, Oh, now we get it.

LUDWIG: Right.

DIMOND: Let`s go back to the telephone. Richard is calling in from South Carolina. Hi, Richard.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How`re you doing, ma`am?

DIMOND: Good.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was wondering, who -- since they can`t come up with the $50,000 to get Casey out of jail, who`s going to be coming up with the reward for the $225,000?

DIMOND: Oh, that`s a good question. Diana Bosch, local reporter there in Orlando, you were at the vigil last night, and I know they were talking about that reward. How much is in that reward now?

BOSCH: You know, the recent number -- I don`t know it off of the top of my head, unfortunately, because...

DIMOND: It`s, like, $225,000, I think. But didn`t a corporation make that donation?

BOSCH: Yes. And you know, they`ve made that donation, and they`ve had these fliers and stuff, and unfortunately, the name just escapes me.

DIMOND: Well, you know what? I hate to quote the grandmother again because so much of what she says is so wacky and contradictory, but at one point she said, Well, you know, we can`t raise the money, and maybe we`d really rather have Casey in prison because she`d be safer there. OK.

Kim is on the line from West Virginia. Hi, Kim. Welcome to the program.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you for having me on.

DIMOND: Sure.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Tonight, actually, is very interesting, the first time I`ve heard people bringing up such as whether or not she`s on drugs. My question is, could somebody have her held as ransom, being pulled -- her family could (INAUDIBLE) be killed if you open up your mouth, be in some type of drug cartel, or even a child -- you know, where they -- they send the children off and sell them. You know, there`s something else going on, and it does involve the family. I do think she has some narcissistic type of character...

DIMOND: I think that`s clear. But your question is what we`re all talking about here. What is the secret that`s going on here? And you know, Pat Brown, jump in on this because you have profiled some of the most outrageous criminals of our times, and sometimes you just can`t even fathom what the secret might be.

BROWN: Well, I think I can fathom quite well what the secret might be because Casey herself shows a lot of these -- her desires by wanting what she wants. In other words, she wants freedom. She wants to do what she would like to do. She`s more interested in her boyfriend than she is interested in her daughter, apparently.

My guess is that at some point, her life with her boyfriend, her freedom became more of this lifestyle she wanted than of being a mother and having to deal with this child on an everyday basis. So that`s why there is a great fear that perhaps freedom was more important than the child.

I don`t buy the drug theory at all. She didn`t -- during the time that little girl was missing, that 30 days, she did not exhibit any fear to anybody else. And if you think your child has been kidnapped by drug dealers...

DIMOND: I know.

BROWN: ... you`re under so much stress, you would exhibit that kind of -- you know, you would see that. But she was out having a good time. So my guess is she was having a good time because she finally got the life she wanted.

DIMOND: You know, our last caller, Kim, brought up something very interesting about the possibility of this drug connection.

However, let`s bring in Anjali Swenton. Anjali is an FBI forensic expert. Anjali, we can speculate until the cows come home, as they say, but the bottom line is there were sniffer dogs and they alerted on human remains.

ANJALI SWENTON, SCILAWFORENSICS LTD.: That`s correct, Diane. And unfortunately, as had already been said earlier, that circumstantial, at this point, evidence does point toward what nobody really wants to admit, which is more than likely that Caylee may no longer be alive. Those dogs are specifically trained to alert only to human remains.

Some of the excuses that Cindy and Casey talked about, rotting pizza, as explaining the way the smell -- and I think it`s pretty obvious cadaver dogs would not alert to food. They also are specifically trained in uniquely identifying scents of humans, as opposed to, say, a dead animal.

DIMOND: And that`s it, just human remains, is that right, Anjali?

SWENTON: That`s correct.

DIMOND: Yes. I want to talk to you later, coming up, about a theory that I have about those dogs. But right now, I want to go to one of those most outspoken and well-known victims` rights advocates that know. Gloria Allred is with us tonight. Hi, Gloria.

GLORIA ALLRED, VICTIMS` RIGHTS ADVOCATE: Hi, Diane.

DIMOND: Who`s the victim here? Because when you hear all these phone conversations with Casey Anthony in prison, it`s her.

ALLRED: Well, I mean, I guess Casey feels that she is the victim. Clearly, the little girl, Caylee, is the victim. And her mother is less than forthcoming, to put it mildly. But it may -- but apparently, under Florida`s sunshine laws, those jailhouse conversations had to be released. My guess is law enforcement is not very happy about that. And obviously, her attorney`s not happy about that. But apparently, under the law, that`s why they were released.

DIMOND: Yes. Yes. I just -- I hear those phone calls from prison and I just want to strangle this mother. I`m sorry, I just do.

Let`s go out to the phones. And Ruth is calling from Wisconsin. Hi, Ruth.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi.

DIMOND: What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was wondering, if she wasn`t working where she said she was, does she have any proof of where she was working to get the money to pay this so-called nanny in the first place? Through her Social Security card, couldn`t they find out if she had any kind of a job?

DIMOND: Well, you know, that`s what I asked. I wish you could all be on the pre-show meeting here with the NANCY GRACE staff because we were talking about this very thing. If she`s not working, how`s she paying for things? How`s she paying for gas for the car and insurance and whatnot?

Mark Williams, I want you to jump in here because the local police are being very tight-lipped about this. I would have to think they have already checked her employment records. Do we know?

WILLIAMS: Right now, since she says she hasn`t worked in two-and-a- half years, they -- she allegedly stole her mother`s credit card. She went on a shopping binge. And I suspect that they have all the records from all those purchases that she made. That`s how she put the gas in the car, so on and so forth.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You can`t tell me anybody that can find Caylee, nobody?

CASEY ANTHONY: No. Because every number that I`ve tried, every number that I`ve called is disconnected. Nothing. I can`t get ahold of anybody.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But that -- that girl was the last person to have her?

CASEY ANTHONY: She was the last person to have her. That was the last time I saw Caylee.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The cops are just sick and tired of her lies. She lies about everything. Nothing different is going to happen with the FBI because she`s going to continue down the same road with a woman that doesn`t exist, phone numbers that come back disconnected, addresses that people haven`t lived in months. She steals a car, leaves it in a part of town where she was supposed to be in another part of town. Everything is a lie.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DIMOND: Ouch. I`m Diane Dimond, in tonight for Nancy Grace. There`s breaking news in this case of Caylee Anthony and her disappearance. Two things. First of all, we have just learned that there are new telephone tapes that have been released with Casey Anthony talking to her brother, Lee. And in the telephone tapes that we hope to bring to you shortly, Casey Anthony tells her brother that she -- in her gut, she is sure that her little girl is not dead, that she is alive, that she`s very close to home and that everything is going to turn out OK.

The second piece of news we know -- there is a videotape taken of a prison visitation between the mother and the grandmother, and the police told us earlier today they may indeed release that. Well, now there`s going to be a hearing, an emergency hearing, on that tomorrow.

Let`s bring in Robin Sax. She`s our prosecutor on the panel tonight. Robin, you, as a prosecutor -- would you want a prison videotape to be released to the media, to the public?

ROBIN SAX, PROSECUTOR: Well, at this point, everything that goes out in the media just shows exactly the kind of person this mother is. And so having that out there, hopefully, will get people angered enough to maybe want to stop listening to what the family`s bringing about and start listening to looking for where this body is, unfortunately.

DIMOND: Yes, but Alex Sanchez, as a defense attorney, if your client is not guilty, then why not let it be released? He`s going to argue tomorrow, her attorney is, not to release it.

ALEX SANCHEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: You know -- you know, I don`t see why the police would want to release this tape because what are they trying to do? They want her to look bad in the public`s eye? Is that what the police should be doing?

DIMOND: Whoopsie-daisy. Too late for that, I think.

SANCHEZ: Right. So what is the purpose at this point? What are we gaining? How is it going to help us arrive at the truth about what happened here?

DIMOND: Yes, I`m guessing it won`t be released.

Well, now to tonight`s "Case Alert," the search for a 7-year-old Massachusetts girl kidnapped from a Boston playground during a supervised custodial visit. Authorities say Reigh Rockefeller and her father, Clark Rockefeller, last seen in New York, possibly now on a yacht that set sail from Long Island. An arrest warrant issued now for Rockefeller, who was in the middle of a bitter divorce from the little girl`s mom. Police also are on the lookout for a black SUV with a Red Sox license plate. The 7-year- old has blond hair, blue eyes and was last seen wearing a pink and white sundress and red shoes. If you have any information, please call the Boston police, 617-343-4328.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: I have a 3-year-old that`s been missing for a month.

911 OPERATOR: A 3-year-old?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Yes.

911 OPERATOR: Have you reported that?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: I`m trying to do that now, ma`am.

911 OPERATOR: OK. What did the person do that you need arrested?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: My daughter.

911 OPERATOR: For what?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: For stealing an auto and stealing money.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

DIMOND: Oh, yes, and for losing my granddaughter. This family is so emotionless.

I`m Diane Dimond, sitting in tonight for Nancy Grace. This -- this case of Caylee Anthony has galvanized America. Everybody seems to be interested in it, Roberta in Michigan for one. Hi, Roberta.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. How are you tonight?

DIMOND: Good.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My question is -- I`ve been following this case, and no one mentions the birth father`s family. Allegedly, he died a year ago, I understand. But how come nobody`s mentioning his parents or that side of the family?

DIMOND: Yes. Mark Williams, real quick, what do we know about the birth dad? Is he really dead?

WILLIAMS: As far as we know, he died in a car accident about a year ago. No mention about the birth father`s family whatsoever.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY, BROTHER OF CASEY ANTHONY: Do you think that Caylee is OK right now?

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING 2-YEAR-OLD CAYLEE: My gut feeling? As Mom asked me yesterday and they asked me last night and the psychologist asked me this morning, and I`m not sure (INAUDIBLE), in my gut she`s still OK and it still feels like she`s close to home.

LEE: OK.

CASEY: So that is still my best feeling at the moment. Again if that changes, I mean, obviously, I`m going to reach out and say something immediately. But, I know Mom will understand this better than anyone that there is that type of bond that you have with your kid.

LEE: And it`s -- you know, it`s unexplainable, absolutely.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DIMOND: Well, all I can say about that brand-new telephone call that we`ve just are bringing to you now is I hope she`s right. I hope her gut is right that little Caylee Anthony is OK.

Hi, everybody. I`m Diane Dimond in tonight for Nancy Grace.

We have just gotten a portion -- we`ll bring you more later in this broadcast -- of telephone calls made over the weekend but just released by the Orlando Police Department of Casey Anthony speaking to her brother, Lee.

And as you see there, he says, what do you think about her -- what do you think her faith has been in effect? And Casey Anthony, who you see there from a court appearance earlier, said in my gut, I think she`s OK. I think she`s close to home.

I hope she`s right.

Let`s go out to the phones. Eileen is calling us from Massachusetts. Hi, Eileen.

EILEEN, MASSACHUSETTS RESIDENT: Hi, how are you?

DIMOND: Good.

EILEEN: I have a question regarding her sanity. Do you think that she might suffer from psychosis or Munchausen by proxy or something?

DIMOND: That`s a very good question and one I`m not qualified to talk about. You notice, Eileen, in that telephone conversation we just heard, she said she`d been talking to therapist, psychotherapist I think that she said.

So let`s ring in Robi Ludwig who is our own psychotherapist.

Robi, what do you think? First of all what do you think about the caller`s question? And then I have a follow-up.

ROBI LUDWIG, PSYCHOTHERAPIST, AUTHOR OF "TILL DEATH DO US PART": Well, I certainly don`t think she`s psychotic or qualifies for Munchausen by proxy. She does seem to -- you know I wonder if when she is having these phone calls and phone conversations right now, she knows that she`s being listened to. So she`s thinking of it as a way to basically secure her innocence.

And also, you know, I think it`s wishful thinking at most that she`s saying that she thinks her daughter is well. That`s what`s bizarre. Any mother who has not seen her child would automatically go to the worst-case scenario.

Oh my god, what`s wrong her?

DIMOND: Right.

LUDWIG: Instead she seems angry and defensive and that`s what`s so bizarre about this case.

DIMOND: Yes, I listen to some of the phone calls that she made home last week, and you know, well, everybody`s just worrying about Caylee. Yes. That`s right.

LUDWIG: Yes.

DIMOND: You know?

LUDWIG: And shouldn`t you be, too? You know.

DIMOND: Hello?

LUDWIG: Duh? But not all mothers have internal instincts and I think that`s what`s interesting here. Here`s a case where the mother`s maternal instinct is clearly off if she has any at all.

DIMOND: Right. Now, Robi, I want to ask you, too, about the psych evaluation. We have learned that on Wednesday of this week, in just a couple of days, the court is going to receive the evaluation from the psychotherapist, psychologist, whoever is looking at her.

What does that entail? What`s that about?

LUDWIG: Well, they`ll test her. They probably are going to look for mood disorders or a character pathology, so if she is character or logically impaired that would mean something in terms of this case.

If she turns out to have anti-social personality or sociopathy, then here`s a person who has no conscious, who, for example, could eliminate her daughter and still act as if nothing is wrong.

DIMOND: Yes, you know, I`m sorry but I just keep thinking of Susan Smith.

LUDWIG: Right.

DIMOND: . who put her boys in the back of a car, you know, strapped them into their little car seats.

LUDWIG: Right.

DIMOND: . and drove them into a lake.

Let`s go out to the phones again. Payton is calling us from Virginia. Hi, Payton.

PAYTON, VIRGINIA RESIDENT: I`m good. How are you?

DIMOND: I`m good. How are you?

PAYTON: Good. My question is I haven`t heard too much at all about where Casey has been for this month that she went on this mini-vacation to bond with Caylee? Where was she? I mean I would think that that would be a big clue as to where Caylee is.

DIMOND: Right. Now Diana Bosch is a local reporter there in Orlando, WBDO talk radio.

Diana, what do we know about that? And I understand her mother -- the grandmother was talking about this on one of the early morning news shows.

DIANA BOSCH, REPORTER, WBDO NEWSRADIO: Yes, and at the bond hearing that they had last week, Cindy Anthony, as she testified, and in her testimony she said that Caylee had -- or Casey had taken Caylee to Jacksonville, and you know, that she just went on a mini-vacation and when she had talked to her, she said that she was fine and everything was OK, and she just didn`t even question it.

So I mean it`s just kind of interesting, like your 22-year-old daughter just leaves for a mini-vacation and.

DIMOND: Yes, I thought that she had that job that she had to go to. Oh, opsy, daisy she didn`t really have the job. Oh yes.

Say, Mark Williams, what can you tell us about the few days and weeks right before -- or say these 31 days that this little girl was missing. Do we know exactly what Casey was doing? Is this when she was with the boyfriend barbecuing around the pool with all of her friends?

MARK WILLIAMS, NEWS DIRECTOR, WNDB NEWSTALK 1150: Yes, that apparently happened, Diane, during the first part of June. And looking at some information that we received just a short time ago, Casey has told her brother, Lee Anthony, during that jailhouse visit this morning that took place is that she says, all the days ran together.

So she can`t give any specific time, she can`t give any specific dates, or say where she was specifically on what specific day. So it`s a jumbled mess, according to her.

DIMOND: Now the other thing that I find very interesting in the latest conversation that has come out and, again, we`re getting you more of that conversation. I want to talk to Pat Brown about this because it`s a criminal profile question, I think.

Her brother, seems to me, in this conversation to be trying to get out of his sister more information about this nanny, and he says, well, did you ever talk to her on the cell phone? Do you think -- did she ever call you on the cell phone? Oh, yes, she said. And she texted me as well. And I`m sure the number is there.

If she`s lying about the existence of this babysitter/nanny, didn`t she just get herself in the corner there?

PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER, AUTHOR OF "KILLING FOR SPORT": Well, I think she`s been in that corner for a long time, Diane.

DIMOND: You`ve got a point.

BROWN: She`s picked out a name of somebody who apparently doesn`t exist, picked an apartment, apparently, nobody lived at, and I heard earlier on that theoretically this babysitter was a friend of a friend who was watching somebody else`s child, and then would watch their child.

Well, how come not one friend knows this woman? None of the neighbors. Nobody has seen this woman, nobody has seen Caylee with this woman, nobody has seen Caylee.

So the fact that she cannot even come up with the smallest connection to this woman in any way, shape or form which is why, of course, the police are terribly suspicious.

DIMOND: You know, Gloria Allred, you and I have covered a lot of sad stories together. And I know you as a defense attorney. So I`m asking you with your defense attorney hat on for this.

This is a woman who is in so much trouble yet she is still so arrogant when you hear her on the telephone.

As a defense attorney, don`t you sit these people down and say to them, now you`re in prison and everything`s going to be recorded, you better be careful.

GLORIA ALLRED, VICTIM`S RIGHTS ADVOCATE: Well, actually I am a victim`s rights attorney but yes, I think a defense attorney would sit them down, would explain that each and every word they speak about this circumstance surrounding her missing daughter to anyone might come back to haunt her. And so her -- she would be well advised not to be saying anything to anyone because she is facing some serious felony charges.

On the other hand, you know if she just -- if she has nothing to do with the disappearance of her daughter, she`s totally innocent, then she needs to be forthcoming about all of the facts about where her daughter is.

By the way, law enforcement officers, I`m sure, is also checking out her cell phone...

DIMOND: Oh you bet.

ALLRED: . to find out who she was talking to, talking to the people that she was talking to to find out everything about her. And exactly how she was supporting herself, where she was spending her money, and where she was during this time. They`re not going to just depend on what she tells them.

DIMOND: And I`m sure they`ve already checked those phone records.


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Continued from above:

Alex Sanchez, the defense attorney on the panel tonight, what -- how does she ever defend herself after heaping so much suspicion on her own head?

ALEX SANCHEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: No, she`s going to have to rely on the advice of her attorney. But, you know, I`m not so certain we should so easily dismiss the possibility that maybe she`s being blackmailed by somebody, or maybe she got involved in some doc criminal activity whether it`s drugs.

DIMOND: But you don`t put your child up to get out of a jam.

SANCHEZ: No, it could be just raw fear at this point, Diane. You know these people are cut throats and they may have sent a message, you say one word to the police about your daughter, and your daughter`s dead. Don`t rule this out. You`re dealing with some very dark people out there.

DIMOND: Don`t forget the sniffer dogs, though.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

L. ANTHONY: Do you think that Caylee is OK right now?

C. ANTHONY: My gut feeling? As Mom asked me yesterday and they asked me last night and the psychologist asked me this morning, and I`m not sure (INAUDIBLE), in my gut she`s still OK and it still feels like she`s close to home.

L. ANTHONY: OK.

C. ANTHONY: So that is still my best feeling at the moment. Again if that changes, I mean, obviously, I`m going to reach out and say something immediately. But, I know Mom will understand this better than anyone that there is that type of bond that you have with your kid.

L. ANTHONY: Right.

C. ANTHONY: And it`s, you know, it`s unexplainable, absolutely.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWSBREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

L. ANTHONY: Did you speak with Caylee over the phone at any time?

C. ANTHONY: I did one time, yes. And that was actually the day that Mom had called the police.

L. ANTHONY: Do you remember what time you spoke to her?

C. ANTHONY: Around noon? It was through a private call.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DIMOND: Through a private call? Hmm. Brand new -- brand new telephone conversation between Casey Anthony and her brother Lee just released by the Orlando Police Department and a conversation that took place sometime over the weekend.

I`m Diane Dimond in tonight for Nancy Grace.

Casey Anthony -- we should be very careful to say --has been charged with the following -- neglect of a child, false official statements, obstruction of a criminal investigation. Maximum penalty, six years in jail. No kidnapping charges. No homicide charges.

We need to be careful about this. Maybe, just maybe there is a real baby-sitter out there, and maybe, just maybe, this child is fine.

Mark Williams, what do you think the likelihood of that is? You`re the local reporter there.

WILLIAMS: Boy oh boy, you know, this -- this case has had so many twists and turns, Diane, it makes my head spin.

DIMOND: Mine, too.

WILLIAMS: But you know last week I saw the preliminary hearing for the bond hearing. And one of the Orange County detectives got on the stand. He said, listen, I used to be a homicide investigator before I took this job. And I know a -- decomposing body smells like. And, you know, then the cadaver dog hit on it.

Also one other thing, Diane, real quick, you know, in this conversation with her brother, Lee Anthony asks Casey, would your cell phone -- would the cell phone number of the babysitter be on your phone?

DIMOND: Right, we`ve just talked about that.

WILLIAMS: And she said, I don`t know where my phone is. She said the last time I saw it, it was at my boyfriend`s house. Well, the police department and investigators have gone over to Tony Lazarro`s apartment with a fine tooth comb. They have not come up with any sort of a cell phone yet.

So this just throws another log on the fire.

DIMOND: Yes, Robin Sax, you`re the prosecutor on the panel here. How do you decide what to do with this woman? I mean there`s already some substantial charges there. But the goal should be to get this little girl back. And how do you sort it all out?

ROBIN SAX, PROSECUTOR, AUTHOR OF "EVERYTHING PARENTS NEED TO KNOW": Well, of course, the goal is to get the child back.

DIMOND: Right.

SAX: And luckily there is enough here right now that to keep her in custody. Not always are we so lucky to be able to keep the defendant in custody or the suspect -- primary suspect in custody while we`re conducting the investigation.

And here I just look at this case and I, you know, put a stack of all the pieces on one side that`s temping to show that she`s guilty of kidnap and part of something, obviously, a lot worse and perhaps a murder. And look at what the other possibilities are and I just can`t help to think of the old DA expression that we use in closing arguments all the time, which is, you know, if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it`s a duck.

DIMOND: Yes, and what do you think the duck is, homicide?

SAX: I hate to say those words and we`re so careful around those words, but when you look at all the evidence -- the smell, the decomposing body, the mom calling in on the 911 call, the tapes, the lies, the conversation -- I mean you don`t get that much evidence in post-murder cases.

DIMOND: You know I`ve been attempting tonight to try to bring all of the pertinent pieces together and really put this in perspective for people and when they talk about the theories about where this child might be, the bottom line, to me, Angelie Swanton(ph), our forensic expert, is there were sniffer dogs that are rested, not only in the grandparents` backyard, but in the trunk of this woman`s car.

What do you make of that?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, I would like to point out, Diane, one thing that I don`t think has been mentioned, certainly there`s suggestion - - and I said this before -- that Caylee may no longer be alive because cadaver dog would not have alerted. But that doesn`t necessarily mean that she was murdered.

DIMOND: And it doesn`t necessarily mean the remains were Caylee`s?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s correct, too, and I think we`re still waiting on some laboratory tests to tell us whether, you know -- whether the stains and the hairs that were found in the trunk were, in fact, human and then whether they can uniquely identify them and match them to a particular individual.

DIMOND: And there was soil in the back of the trunk, which makes me think, maybe something was buried in the backyard and then unburied and put in the trunk?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Certainly. When you put those pieces together, the fact that the dogs alerted both in the backyard and the trunk and no body has been found, I don`t think it`s too far elite to think that a body had been buried and perhaps transported in the car.

DIMOND: Yes, and again, we`re not saying it`s Caylee. We don`t know if it`s Caylee. But it`s that whole looks-like-a-duck routine.

Sherri is calling in from Ohio with a question. Hi, Sherri.

SHERRI, OHIO RESIDENT: Hi.

DIMOND: Hi.

SHERRI: Good evening. One the questions -- well, the question I have is, we`ve seen many, many pictures of Caylee, just tons of them. And.

DIMOND: Right.

SHERRI: . with Casey being such a young mother and my -- the mother of my two grandchildren have taken pictures of everything and every one they`ve ever been involved with. If you have this nanny who`s been involved in this children -- this child`s life, rather, for a year or a year and a half, wouldn`t you have some kind of photograph, some kind of photographic evidence?

DIMOND: Yes, good -- very good question, Sherri. We have gotten many of the pictures that you see of this little girl off of a -- an Internet site that her mother put up.

And no, Diana Bosch, a local reporter there in Orlando, I haven`t seen any pictures of the nanny. That`s a very good point.

BOSCH: You know we`ve actually -- Cindy said she told reporters today she has actually never met Zenaida. You know, she said Casey would often take Caylee to the babysitter and it was something that she did it on her own, and no one really she had heard Zenaida`s name several times, but, again, it was something that Cindy maintains that Casey would take Caylee to Zenaida on her own.

And she just figured that she was safe there.

DIMOND: Yes, Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzales, and the NANCY GRACE staff has searched high and low and nationwide, they can`t find a Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzales anywhere that matches the age range that Casey said.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

L. ANTHONY: Did you ever call a babysitter on your -- on your cell phone? Ever receive a call from the babysitter on your cell phone number?

C. ANTHONY: I most definitely did.

L. ANTHONY: Can you give me any day or anything that you think you may have received that?

C. ANTHONY: On a specific day? God, a lot of the times it was through text messages so the number would show up even on that.

L. ANTHONY: OK.

C. ANTHONY: I can`t think of any specifics. I mean my days are all thrown together. I at least know what the day is today but as far as from the last couple of months, I have no exact time or date.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

L. ANTHONY: Did you speak with Caylee over the phone at any time?

C. ANTHONY: I did one time, yes. And that was actually the day that Mom had called the police.

L. ANTHONY: Do you remember what time you spoke to her?

C. ANTHONY: Around noon? It was through a private call.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DIMOND: Then why does she say she hasn`t seen her child in 31 days? I just don`t get it. The story just -- it`s like you`re standing on shifting sands.

Everybody has questions about this, including Tia from Indiana.

Hi, Tia, thanks for calling in tonight.

TIA, INDIANA RESIDENT: Thank you, Diane, for taking my call.

DIMOND: Thank you.

TIA: My question is the grandfather is a former police officer.

DIMOND: Yes.

TIA: We have barely heard two words out of this man. He has had no input whatsoever in this case.

DIMOND: Well, you know, I am told by the staff here at the NANCY GRACE show, that the grandparents, the grandfather and the grandmother, have sat down and talked to police, but they don`t know anything. They just know that their daughter lived there and then she moved away to bond with the child.

But let`s bring in one of the local reporters, Mark Williams is news director there in Orlando.

What about grandpa? He`s been involved in some of the vigils?

WILLIAMS: He`s been involved with every one of the vigils. As a matter of fact, he is spending his days handing out fliers and t-shirts at a local supermarket parking lot. And, you know, the guy is caught -- he`s like a deer caught in the headlights. OK? He really doesn`t know -- I don`t think he can comprehend what`s going on.

DIMOND: Yes, and it`s also interesting that two of Casey`s former boyfriends were also former cops.

Tonight, let`s stop now to remember Army Sergeant Phillip Anderson, just 28 years old, Everett, Washington, killed, Iraq, on a second tour of duty. He was awarded the Purple Heart on his first tour after rescuing a fellow soldier. He was also awarded the Army Commendation Medal, Army Achievement medal, and National Defense Service medal.

Anderson loved animals, fast cars and motorcycles. He leaves behind parents, Ken and Raven, sister, Beth, widow Melanie, and son Earner.

Philip Anderson, an American hero.

Thank you to all our guests and to all of you at home for being with us. See you tomorrow right here, 8:00 sharp, when Nancy Grace comes back. Until then, have a great evening.

END

[ReddCurrlz]

FOXNews.com
Missing Tot's Mom: 'It Still Feels Like She's Close to Home'

Tuesday , July 29, 2008

This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," July 28, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

MEGYN KELLY, FOX NEWS HOST: Cindy Anthony speaks, and she is angry. I'm Megyn Kelly, in for Greta Van Susteren. Casey Anthony's mother, Cindy, speaking to FOX News moments ago, saying she is frustrated with the way her missing granddaughter's case is being handled and going "On the Record" with our team on the ground in Florida. This is coming in raw. Bear with us and take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CYNTHIA ANTHONY, GRANDMOTHER OF MISSING CHILD: (INAUDIBLE) Not going to get me in trouble with the deputies, so...

ROZZIE FRANCO, WFLA RADIO: You're not going to get in trouble with the deputies!

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: Oh, I absolutely am because any time I say anything remotely negative, then it just pushes them further away. And they haven't sat down and talked to us since a week ago Saturday -- it's been over a week -- about the status of this case. The only thing that they ever did was come to our house last Monday, telling us that they're going to testify against Casey at her bond hearing, which, you know, I figured they would anyway. And I still don't have my laptop they promised me last Monday. I still don't have my phone back -- or not my phone, my...

Watch the Interview, Pt. 1 (http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,393262,00.html#) | Pt. 2
(http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,393262,00.html#)
FRANCO: Cindy, why do you feel like they're going to testify against Casey?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: They already did. I'm saying when they testified against her at the bond hearing, you know, they came to the house and said, Oh, we have to testify. Well, you know, no kidding. They're the ones that put her there, so I would think they're going to justify their reasons.

But you know, the family is going stir crazy because there's only so many things that I can do to put the word out about Caylee. And until the media and the sheriff's department comes out and starts telling the public that they are actively looking for this little girl and telling us what they're doing about it, it's like they're not doing anything.

FRANCO: Right. We asked them today. We asked them about a grid pattern from your home and why they haven't done that and why they're not searching actively. What do you think? What are your thoughts on that?

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: I don't know. I mean, they had receipts that could have traced my daughter's last actions for the last month. They didn't want them. They didn't even want to go through any of her personal things. It's too late now, guys. I've already put her stuff away. So you know, I let it sit out in her bedroom for the last week-and-a-half, and no one's wanted to comb through any of the stuff that we took from the apartment.

I mean, I don't get it. You know, either you're looking for my granddaughter or you're building a case against my daughter. You know, do something. You know, I'm sick and tired of the fact that we're sitting here, we're in the dark, we're aching every day because we don't have our granddaughter with us. And people out in the public are getting frustrated because, you know, they believe that my daughter's...

FRANCO: Alive.

ANTHONY: ... My granddaughter's alive. They believe in my daughter. Everybody that knows Casey knows that she's going to do everything she can to protect Caylee. She's not going to hurt her.

FRANCO: Talk to us about the receipts. What kind of receipts did the Orange County sheriff...

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: She has receipts from going to the grocery story, from going shopping, from doing whatever. They could have went back at the stores to see if Caylee was with her. They could have done a whole lot of things. They haven't -- you know, they didn't. So it's too late now to go back. I don't have those anymore.

And I'm -- frankly, I'm not holding any more stuff for them. Anything I have I'm going to give to whoever I have, a private investigator, her attorney or whatever that acts like they care about my granddaughter. And I'm frustrated. I just want one of them from the sheriff's department to call me and give me some respect, give my husband some respect, and give us a little update.

They were so good about coming here every day for the first three days and -- because they knew we were giving them everything they wanted, and I've given everything they wanted. I opened my home to them. I let them search my back yard without question. I let them take my computers without question. You know, they said they're done with them. I can't even get on the -- on my daughter's side of our desktop because they changed the password. And I can't get my granddaughter's pictures to even look at them.

And I feel like I'm the one that's being punished for trying to look for my granddaughter. And I can't keep doing this day after day. I'm getting harassed by the media. My son gets chased down on his way to see his sister this morning. And then they wonder why he ran out of there afterwards? I mean, what the hell were they going to get from him on his way, driving? What do you think you're going to get on the expressway from someone that you have to keep speeding up and making someone feel so uncomfortable? My son's a tough person, but he called me this morning, he said, Mom, this is the first time I felt like my life was in danger.

FRANCO: Right. Absolutely. He's been a tough person in media.

CYNTHIA ANTHONY: And you know what? Channel 9, I didn't out you this morning, but I'm outing you now. You know, I never had a chance to call the station or report it to the manager, but I want those people reprimanded. I want them fired because I'm going to bring formal charges again if it happens again because this has to stop. Quit harassing her friends. Her friends trying to speak to the authorities. They won't return their phone calls.

But they don't need to be on the media. They've already said Casey is a great mom, that she's always taken good care of Caylee, she's always been worried about Caylee, that she's been around cigarette smoke or whatever. This Zenaida person's been in Casey's vocabulary for the last three years. Do they think that she's been plotting to murder her child for three years now? Come on. Give me a break! Look at the common sense stuff...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KELLY: And there you have it. And Cindy is not the only one talking, tonight police releasing a jailhouse call that Cindy's daughter, Casey, made to her brother from behind bars. It happened just this past Saturday. Listen closely because this call may contain some important clues.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY, BROTHER: Here's an FYI for you so you can conduct yourself accordingly.

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING CHILD: Yes.

LEE ANTHONY: Everything is public record, including this phone call, including the visitation videos.

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes.

LEE ANTHONY: So all that stuff is going to end up being released at some point.

CASEY ANTHONY: Oh, I know it.

LEE ANTHONY: I had no knowledge of that whatsoever.

CASEY ANTHONY: They told me about it yesterday.

LEE ANTHONY: They told me that after we got on the (INAUDIBLE) we did that. So...

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes.

LEE ANTHONY: ... there's obviously some things that I may have asked in a different -- I would have asked in a different way.

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes. Absolutely.

LEE ANTHONY: And I don't want you to, you know, feel for any reason that, you know, we're not on your side about anything because it's because we are about everything. We are completely behind you.

CASEY ANTHONY: Oh, I know.

LEE ANTHONY: And being completely behind you, our entire focus, all our days, every second of every day is consumed with about what can we do to find Caylee.

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes. Oh, absolutely.

LEE ANTHONY: Is there anything specific -- I know you're going to meet with, you know, the investigators and everything. You know, is there anything specifically, the details that you want to clarify to me now, so when I'm following up on my own leads and my own information, putting this stuff together, you know, then I can start working on it now?

CASEY ANTHONY: At the moment, there's nothing (INAUDIBLE) nothing that, you know (INAUDIBLE) Again, I'll put something together before I see her day (ph) or when I see her day (ph), and you know, make sure that I have something also to put (ph) out.

LEE ANTHONY: Right.

CASEY ANTHONY: (INAUDIBLE) Everything.

LEE ANTHONY: OK. And just remember, when you get to talk to those guys, you know, you mentioned that, you know, you're going to have your prep and everything with Jose. But remember, truth don't hurt.

CASEY ANTHONY: Oh, I know it doesn't, but...

LEE ANTHONY: You know...

CASEY ANTHONY: ... There are things that I have told them (INAUDIBLE) to not use to their benefit. I gave them the same resources that I gave you, and you found out 100 more things than they did...

LEE ANTHONY: Right.

CASEY ANTHONY: ... And they were given the same information.

LEE ANTHONY: Right.

CASEY ANTHONY: So it's just about the approach, I guess, and using the resources to their full extent.

LEE ANTHONY: You think Caylee's OK right now?

CASEY ANTHONY: My gut feeling? Mom asked me yesterday (INAUDIBLE) the psychologist asked me this morning that I met with through the court (ph). In my gut, she is still OK and it still feels like she's close to home.

LEE ANTHONY: OK.

CASEY ANTHONY: So I mean, that's still my best feeling at the moment. Again, if that changes, I mean, obviously, I'm going to reach out and say something that immediately the (INAUDIBLE) I know Mom will understand this better than anyone, that there is that type of bond that you have with your kids.

LEE ANTHONY: Right.

CASEY ANTHONY: And it's -- you know, it's (INAUDIBLE)

LEE ANTHONY: Did you speak with Caylee over the phone at any time?

CASEY ANTHONY: I did one time, yes, and that was actually the day that Mom had called the police.

LEE ANTHONY: OK. Do you remember what time you spoke to her?

CASEY ANTHONY: Around noon. It was through a private (ph) call.

LEE ANTHONY: OK. Did you ever have or did you ever call the baby- sitter on your cell phone or ever receive a call from the baby-sitter on your cell phone?

CASEY ANTHONY: I most definitely did.

LEE ANTHONY: Can you give me any day or anything whenever you think you may have received that?

CASEY ANTHONY: Any specific day? (INAUDIBLE) text messages, so I mean, the number would show up even on that.

LEE ANTHONY: OK.

CASEY ANTHONY: I can't think of any specifics. I mean, my days are all thrown (ph) together. At least I know what the day is today, but as far as from the last couple months, I have no exact, you know, time or date. If I can think of something...

LEE ANTHONY: Do you remember an area code?

CASEY ANTHONY: The last number that she called me from was the 954 number, which (INAUDIBLE) Fort Lauderdale number.

LEE ANTHONY: OK.

CASEY ANTHONY: I know because Amy (ph) is also in a similar (ph) area code.

LEE ANTHONY: Right.

CASEY ANTHONY: She has also called me from a 407 number, from a 321 number. There's been different numbers different times, not necessarily on different days but it just depended on the number that she had at the time.

The phone that I'm currently using, or I guess that the police still have or if you guys have it, I had set it up after the fact to just save things to my sim card (ph). But you can also save it to just the phone or to the sim card and the phone, so there's copies on both.

LEE ANTHONY: OK. So this blackjack (ph) -- where did you -- you said that you reported it missing and (INAUDIBLE) Give me the information so I can find this phone.

CASEY ANTHONY: The last time I know I had it for certain, I was at the Universal.

LEE ANTHONY: For work or for otherwise?

CASEY ANTHONY: I was in through the park, talking to just a couple mutual friends up there.

LEE ANTHONY: So you were up there for fun or whatever.

CASEY ANTHONY: It wasn't necessarily fun, but yes, not through work at that moment.

LEE ANTHONY: I got you. Would you have had her or anybody's information, even this -- even Jeff (ph) that's introduced you, or Juliet (ph), that also, you know -- or correct me. Is there anybody else that knew you were searching for Caylee?

CASEY ANTHONY: Outside of them, no.

LEE ANTHONY: OK. Outside of Zanny (ph), Jeff and Juliet, nobody else knew, correct?

CASEY ANTHONY: I hadn't talked to anyone else about it, no.

LEE ANTHONY: OK. Where did you meet Jeff and Juliet from again?

CASEY ANTHONY: Universal.

LEE ANTHONY: And when you were working for...

CASEY ANTHONY: Jeff through Kodak. I could have met Juliet while I was working for Kodak. I don't remember (INAUDIBLE) known her also for about two-and-a-half, three years.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

KELLY: Well, coming up, analysis of the statements you just heard from both Casey and Cindy Anthony. What clues are there for investigators? We are live on the ground in Florida, digging for answers. We're covering angles you will see nowhere but here.

And later: Shia LeBeouf is in deep trouble tonight. The actor's been arrested and has gone to the hospital in surgery. And who is the actress that was reportedly with LaBeouf when the arrest went down? Here's a hint. Her boyfriend might not be too happy about it. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KELLY: Well, two-year-old Caylee Anthony is missing. Her mother, Casey, is in jail tonight. And this case gets stranger and stranger every day.

Joining us live now in Orlando is Rozzie Franco, reporter for WFLA radio in the Florida News Network. You just heard her interview with Cindy Anthony, the grandmother. Rozzie joins us live tonight. Good evening, Rozzie. Unbelievable anger coming from Cindy Anthony tonight there. She is ticked off at the police. Exactly why?

FRANCO: Exactly, Megyn. This case gets more bizarre or bizarre as it goes on. She has a contempt when she talks about the Orange County sheriff's office, rather, and she says it's because they're not helping her. Now, when I talked to Deputy Carlos Padilla (ph) this evening, he said they're tired of interviewing Casey because they're tired of her lies. Now, I did learn that the FBI is also involved in this case, and I learned that the FBI has not interviewed her. Her attorney, Joe Baez, has restricted most interviews or all interviews that she could very well give to these authorities.

And the latest in the investigation is that Casey's attorney, Jose Baez, says that he's requested a motion that all interaction between the family, through phone calls or any kind of visits to the jail, that they not go into public records. Now, under the...

KELLY: Right. He's upset that they're getting released to the media. Let me interrupt you, Rozzie, because I want to ask you about something you just said. You're telling me that the deputy sheriff told you that the reason they are no longer talking to Casey Anthony, the mother of the missing child, is that they are quote, "tired of her lies."

FRANCO: Well, now, they have tried to talk to Casey, and Jose Baez has restricted their communication. And every time they talk to her, they say it's lie after lie after lie. And we had an interview with Deputy Carlos Padilla earlier today, and you can see that in the interview.

KELLY: And you talked to him about some very interesting things, including the shovel. Tell us about the shovel.

FRANCO: That was very interesting. Now, this was a key piece of evidence that the media has not talked about lately. Now, the shovel is still under forensic examination. And when we asked...

KELLY: It's a shovel that Casey borrowed from a neighbor.

FRANCO: Exactly, the shovel that Casey borrowed from the neighbor. And we asked Deputy Carlos Padilla if there was DNA on the handle of the shovel and also on the blade of the shovel. We asked him if there was possible DNA from Casey on the handle and possible DNA from Caylee on the blade, and he said he could not confirm or deny that. Now, we asked him when that shovel would be back from forensics, and he could not tell us that, either. But it is still in forensics, as a number of other things...

KELLY: Rozzie, was he able to say...

(CROSSTALK)

KELLY: ... Because I spoke with Casey's lawyer earlier today, Jose Baez, and he suggested that shovel was borrowed earlier, before little Caylee went missing. What do the cops say about the timing of when she borrowed it?

FRANCO: They haven't said anything about the timing. They're just focusing in on the fact that it was borrowed and that it was used and that it might have been in the trunk of the car at some point. And they're just focusing on the forensic evidence that will be revealed once it comes out of examination.

KELLY: All right. I think, actually, we have this sound bite cued up with Jose Baez. Let me get you to listen to it and then we'll move on.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KELLY: There were reports surfacing that Casey, your client, borrowed a shovel during the time that little Caylee was missing, from a neighbor. Can you confirm or deny that?

JOSE BAEZ, CASEY ANTHONY'S ATTORNEY: That's incorrect. Now, what happened was, the -- she borrowed the shovel before she moved out of the house. The neighbor said it was around the time that she went disappearing, but she was actually living at the home and that's when she borrowed the shovel, and Caylee was not missing at the time.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FRANCO: Yes, and I'd also like to point out that attorney Jose Baez also said that the Orange County sheriff's department did not return any of his calls when he reached out to them, and he never reached out to them. And the Orange County sheriff's department claims that they reached to attorney Jose Baez, and he never returned any of those calls.

KELLY: Rozzie, before I let you go, let me ask you -- you asked about the grid search. You asked them why they are not performing a grid search, looking for the child. What was the answer to that?

FRANCO: He said they're just not actively searching right now, they're just following up on all the leads that's coming in right now.

KELLY: And quickly, are they checking Casey's cell phone? Because in that call to her brother, she says she heard from her daughter as late as mid-July.

FRANCO: Right. We dug as deep as we could go, and according to Deputy Carlos Padilla, he said that they're checking the cell phone. And we also asked about her bank records, if there was anything unusual, any kind of transaction that was unusual during that time...

KELLY: Right. Quickly.

FRANCO: ... And he said they're checking into all of that.

KELLY: All right, Rozzie Franco...

FRANCO: Also checking into her computer.

KELLY: ... Thanks so much. We got to leave it at that because we're out of time, but great reporting. Thanks very much.




http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,393262,00.html

[Faith]

NANCY GRACE July 29, 2008 Transcript

Judge Denies Request to Bar Release of Jailhouse Tot Mom Phone Calls

Aired July 29, 2008 - 20:00:00 ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Police desperately searching for a beautiful little 2-year-old Florida girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing, little Caylee now not seen for five long weeks, last seen with her mother. So why didn`t Mommy call police?
Headlines tonight. This girl just can`t quit talking! More stunning jailhouse phone calls released. At the same time, the mom`s lawyer calls an emergency hearing, fighting -- fighting -- to stop the release of these very phone calls. They don`t want the world to hear their client uncensored, unedited. Police still report little Caylee`s mom refuses to fully cooperate in the search for the 2-year-old girl. Tonight, the just- released bombshell audiotapes. And a new development. Is a recent break- in at the family home at the time of Caylee`s disappearance somehow connected? Tonight, where is 2-year-old Caylee?

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY, CASEY ANTHONY`S BROTHER: And I don`t want you to, you know, feel for any reason that, you know, we`re not on your side about anything because -- because we are about everything. We`re completely behind you.

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING CHILD: Oh, I know.

LEE ANTHONY: And being completely behind you, our entire focus, all our days, every second of every day is consumed with what can we do to find Caylee.

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes. Oh, absolutely.

LEE ANTHONY: Did you speak with Caylee over the phone at any time?

CASEY ANTHONY: I did one time, yes, and that was actually the day that Mom had called the police.

LEE ANTHONY: OK. Do you remember what time you spoke to her?

CASEY ANTHONY: Around noon. It was through a private call.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Private call. What a coincidence! Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Tonight, police desperately searching for a beautiful 2-year-old Florida girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing. Now, little Caylee hasn`t been seen in five long weeks. In the last hours, bombshell. More stunning jailhouse phone records just released. They`re phone calls from the jail. Caylee`s mom at the same time is fighting in court to stop the public from hearing her uncensored.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: Did you ever call the baby-sitter on your cell phone or ever receive a call from the baby-sitter on your cell phone number?

CASEY ANTHONY: I most definitely did.

LEE ANTHONY: Can you give me any day or anything whenever you think you may have received that?

CASEY ANTHONY: Any specific day? God, a lot of the times, it was through text messages, so I mean, the number would show up even on that.

LEE ANTHONY: OK.

CASEY ANTHONY: I can`t think of any specifics. I mean, my days are all thrown together. At least I know what the day is today, but as far as from the last couple months, I have no exact, you know, time or date.

LEE ANTHONY: Do you think Caylee`s OK right now?

CASEY ANTHONY: My gut feeling? As Mom asked me yesterday and (INAUDIBLE) last night and the psychologist asked me this morning that I met with through the court, in my gut, she`s still OK and it still feels like she`s -- she`s close to home.

LEE ANTHONY: OK.

CASEY ANTHONY: So I mean, that`s still my best feeling at the moment. Again, if that changes, I mean, obviously, I`m going to reach out and say something immediately, but I know Mom will understand this better than anyone, that there is that type of bond that you have with your kids.

LEE ANTHONY: Right.

CASEY ANTHONY: And it`s -- you know, it`s unexplainable, absolutely.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: It`s unexplainable, that bond that you have with your kids, that bond that allows you to not report them missing for 31 days.

Straight out to Rory O`Neill with Metro Networks. More phone recordings from the jail, phone calls between Caylee`s mom and her family released. And at the same time, Rory, we find out the lawyer calls an emergency hearing to stop us, the public, from hearing his client unedited. What`s going on?

RORY O`NEILL, METRO NETWORKS: Well, Jose Baez, the attorney for Casey Anthony, says he wants the sheriff`s office and the jail to keep those recorded conversations secret, to keep them private until all the leads that may exist within those recorded conversations can be tracked down by the detectives on the case. He asked the judge, Please, keep these conversations sealed, do not release them to the media. The judge said, No way, 1st Amendment wins, these tapes will be made public.

GRACE: This ruling has just come down in a Florida courtroom. I`ve got with me right here the defense lawyer`s brief that he filed, begging -- ordering the court not to allow these phone calls to be released. We`re about to play them for you.

And he cites three reasons. One, releasing the video conferencing and phone calls could impede the investigation, two, kill the public`s willingness to call in tips -- translation, once you hear my client, you won`t want to call in tips anymore -- and three, releasing them would compromise the integrity of the right to a fair trial.

We`re going to unleash the lawyers and get their take on this, but first let`s take a listen to the phone calls.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY: Jose was going to, you know, think about stuff, how we were going to set things up over the weekend. He was going to be here with me when we bring them in. You know, and as far as what I answer, how I answer, you know, how all that goes down, he was going to figure that out this weekend. He was actually going to come up either today or tomorrow and bring a couple of the videos, I guess, for me to watch from some of the news stuff that`s been going on, I guess some of the talk shows, to try to update me on some of the stuff. He wanted me to get a good laugh, so...

LEE ANTHONY: Well, here`s the thing. Don`t put too much stock and faith into anything that the media is putting out there because you got to understand that...

CASEY ANTHONY: Oh, I know.

LEE ANTHONY: ... they get information, they speculate on information and then, you know, they put something out there so they can fill their -- their clips.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY: I gave them the same resources that I gave you, and you found out a hundred more things than they did...

LEE ANTHONY: Right.

CASEY ANTHONY: ... and they were given the same information.

LEE ANTHONY: Right.

CASEY ANTHONY: So it`s just about the approach, I guess, and using the resources to their full extent.

LEE ANTHONY: We just need to figure out how we can be clear on whatever we`re giving to them, so even if we have to, you know, speak, you know, very direct, or if we have to -- you know, we can`t really speak in generalities with them, with anybody, is what I`m finding out.

CASEY ANTHONY: I gave them things multiple times. Each officer I gave the same information at least two or three times. I`ve done the same thing with you, the same thing with Mom, the same thing with Jose. Everyone has the same information, same spelling, same names. I mean, none of that has altered because it`s as is.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining us tonight, Peter Schaffer out of New York and Michael Mazzariello, also out of New York, defense attorney and host of "Closing Argument." He has a new show coming in 2009, "Street Court."

Peter Schaffer, Michael Mazzariello, first of all, have you read this motion by the defense, why we shouldn`t be able to hear these phone calls - - yes, no, Peter?

PETER SCHAFFER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yes.

GRACE: What do you make of it?

SCHAFFER: Well, I mean, anybody that talks to somebody -- with a prisoner in jail knows those conversations are going to be recorded, but that doesn`t mean that they should come out and be released to the press. I mean, since when does information that may be subject at some point to being released -- since when is it released immediately? So I see his point...

GRACE: That doesn`t even make sense.

SCHAFFER: Well...

GRACE: No requirement under the law, Peter Schaffer, to hold public information for any period of time. In fact, typically, you can go down to the courthouse, you can trot on up to the record room, Michael Mazzariello, and read anything about the file, any case that has been on file.

What I`m trying to ask you guys is what you make of the three reasons he cites in this motion, why tonight the viewers, you and myself should not see or hear the videoconferencing or the jail phone calls? He cites three reasons. Basically, once you hear these phone calls, nobody`s going to want to call in tips. How does that strike you, Michael?

MICHAEL MAZZARIELLO, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I think that he`s doing what he`s paid to do, Nancy. He has to zealously defend this woman. Anything that she says could compromise the case that he has, so he has to minimize it. She made these calls. Unbeknownst to her, she was being recorded. Now they`re recording...

GRACE: Well, excuse me, Michael. I`d like to correct you because I heard the phone calls, and at the very beginning, it says, Your phone call is being monitored.

MAZZARIELLO: Well, you hear that, and then as you`re talking and you`re in jail and you`re scared, you`re nervous, your child`s missing...

GRACE: She wasn`t nervous. She was totally PO`d because they wouldn`t give her boyfriend`s phone number.

MAZZARIELLO: Well, everyone reacts to things differently. The defense attorney did a good job filing the motion to try to prevent it. He`ll get another shot at it at pre-trial hearing, if this goes to trial, God forbid, they should find the child. And he did the best he could, Nancy. I mean, that`s what you do.

GRACE: OK. So that is your defense? He did the best he could.

MAZZARIELLO: No, Nancy, the defense is, is that he has to...

GRACE: Look, you know what?

MAZZARIELLO: He has to present...

GRACE: I gave you a shot. That was your answer. Thanks.

Very quickly, to Larry Sutton, editor at "People" magazine. Larry, thank you for being with us.

LARRY SUTTON, "PEOPLE": You`re welcome.

GRACE: And everybody, in the August 11 issue coming out, headline on the front page, "What happened to Caylee?" extensive reporting on this story. What do you make of these phone calls? We hear her saying to her brother, You found a hundred more things out about where Caylee is than the police...

SUTTON: And it`s maddening that he doesn`t tell you what those hundred more things were.

GRACE: Yes, what would those things be, and wouldn`t that be withholding evidence?

SUTTON: Absolutely true. Why aren`t you sharing that information with the police, with the authorities? Those phone calls will just drive you crazy because it`s playing the game of, I know something you don`t know, and you know, a child`s life is at stake.

GRACE: But why -- let`s go out to our shrink tonight, Dr. Patricia Saunders. Why? Why? Now, the brother didn`t necessarily say, yes, you`re right, I found out all kind of stuff that the police didn`t find. He seems to be just going along with her craziness.

PATRICIA SAUNDERS, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, I think it`s part of her being the center of attention, Nancy. This is all about her. And there`s no anxiety in any of these recordings, other than her being very angered by the fact that she can`t get the boyfriend`s number. Where is her worry about her missing child? It`s not there.

GRACE: Well, you know, probatively, I`m talking about the evidence -- let`s go out to Marc Klaas, child advocate and president of Klaas Kids Foundation. Marc, the fact that she`s saying, You found out all this information about where Caylee is -- what information? Why aren`t they giving it to police? The fact that she has to set up a meeting to -- and preview videos, probably of you talking on this show, Marc Klaas, but watch videos of the coverage of her case before she can cooperate with police? I smell a rat. I think it`s that rat.

MARC KLAAS, BEYONDMISSING.COM: Yes. I have to agree with what the psychiatrist just said. Her arrogance -- this woman is sitting in a jail cell, possibly facing the rest of her life in prison, and she seems to be trying to call the shots. She`s given everybody this business. I actually think her brother is doing a credible job of trying to get her back in line and trying to help in recovering the child. He keeps reminding her that this isn`t about her, that, in fact, this is about little Caylee.

This woman is a twisted woman, and I stand by what I said the very first night we covered it. She either killed that child, sold that child, or gave her away. And if she gets out of prison, we may never find out the true answer.

GRACE: Everyone, the judge just hours ago has refused to suppress phone calls made by Caylee`s mom from the jail to her family and others. The mother was in court today. You are seeing just-released video of that. This all went down just a couple of hours ago, where there, Jose Baez goes into court and demands the judge suppress these phone calls so you won`t hear them. Take a listen.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: Do you think Caylee`s OK right now?

CASEY ANTHONY: My gut feeling? As Mom asked me yesterday and (INAUDIBLE) last night and the psychologist asked me this morning that I met with through the court, in my gut, she`s still OK and it still feels like she`s -- she`s close to home.

LEE ANTHONY: OK.

CASEY ANTHONY: So I mean, that`s still my best feeling at the moment. Again, if that changes, I mean, obviously, I`m going to reach out and say something immediately, but I know Mom will understand this better than anyone, that there is that type of bond that you have with your kids.

LEE ANTHONY: Right.

CASEY ANTHONY: And it`s -- you know, it`s unexplainable, absolutely.

LEE ANTHONY: Did you speak with Caylee over the phone at any time?

CASEY ANTHONY: I did one time, yes, and that was actually the day that Mom had called the police.

LEE ANTHONY: Do you remember what time you spoke to her?

CASEY ANTHONY: Around noon. It was through a private call.

LEE ANTHONY: Did you ever call the baby-sitter on your cell phone or ever receive a call from the baby-sitter on your cell phone number?

CASEY ANTHONY: I most definitely did.

LEE ANTHONY: Can you give me any day or anything whenever you think you may have received that?

CASEY ANTHONY: Any specific day? God, a lot of the times, it was through text messages, so I mean, the number would show up even on that.

LEE ANTHONY: OK.

CASEY ANTHONY: I can`t think of any specifics. I mean, my days are all thrown together. At least I know what the day is today, but as far as from the last couple months, I have no exact, you know, time or date.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: You know, I`m just thinking back over this -- back out to Rory O`Neill with Metro Networks. I can tell you right now what my twins are wearing to bed tonight, and I`m not even there. How can she not know the last time she spoke to the baby-sitter that took off with her child, OK? That`s what I`m having a hard time taking in. What more can you tell me about this alleged break-in in the tool -- the tool shed of the family home?

O`NEILL: Well, late last month, it was Caylee`s grandfather, George Anthony, who had reported to the local sheriff`s department that someone had broken into the back yard shed and stolen a couple gasoline cans. This has happened a couple times in the past. Police were aware of it, or the detectives, rather, were aware of it. They don`t think it has any direct connection to the case, but it has happened, apparently, several times in the past, as well.

GRACE: OK. Let me ask you a couple questions, Rory O`Neill. Was there gas in the cans?

O`NEILL: Yes, there was gas in the cans.

GRACE: So isn`t it true, Rory O`Neill, that Casey Marie Anthony, the mother of Caylee, who at this time is only charged with child neglect -- not kidnapping, not murder, just child neglect -- isn`t it true that in the past, she`s actually taken gas from the family, gasoline from a car?

O`NEILL: That`s true. And actually, when it comes to the abandoned car, the one the cadaver dogs had hit on, it`s Cindy Anthony, the grandmother, who said that the car had been abandoned at that location because the car was out of gas, oddly enough. So these gas cans keep coming up. But the police say, as far as Caylee`s disappearance is concerned, there`s probably no direct connection.

GRACE: But Rory, how exactly would Casey Anthony steal gasoline from her family, siphon it out of their cars with, like, a garden hose?

O`NEILL: It may have just been from the cans in the back yard shed. We really haven`t learned too much exactly in any more detail about this gasoline.

GRACE: OK. So let me get this straight. To Peter Schaffer and Michael Mazzariello, defense attorneys joining us tonight. Peter, so I`m supposed to believe that after Casey Anthony has a history of stealing gasoline from her own family to fill up her car that some unknown intruder sneaks into their back yard, breaks the lock and steals gasoline?

SCHAFFER: Nancy, if all she had to worry about was a petty larceny case...

GRACE: No, I`m just asking you this...

SCHAFFER: ... we wouldn`t be -- I don`t know whether she took it or not, but what does it have to do with this missing child?

GRACE: Well, I can tell you what it has to do with it, Peter. During the period of time that she was AWOL from her family, the fact that she may have been coming back and forth to the home to steal till gasoline at night is very, to me, evidentiary -- I mean, that she wouldn`t let her mother, her own mother, the child`s grandmother, see the child, but she would come back -- that says to me the child was already gone at that time. That`s what it says to me, that she would sneak back and steal gasoline so her mother wouldn`t see that she wasn`t with the child. You know, two and two is four, connect the dots thing, Peter.

SCHAFFER: I don`t find it that probative of anything.

GRACE: Michael, agree or disagree?

MAZZARIELLO: I agree with you, Nancy.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: We love you, and you know, please think of anything that we can help find Caylee because as soon as we can help find her, it`s going to be, you know, open and shut to get you out of there, OK, darling?

CASEY ANTHONY: Absolutely. I know.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: Everyone, breaking news. Apparently, in the last few moments, an arrest made in the murder of Army specialist Megan Lynn Touma, Ft. Bragg soldier. As you recall, she was found dead in a local hotel room. And remember, a week after her body was found, a letter was received from the so-called "zodiac killer."

A man has been arrested, Edgar Patino (ph), charged with first-degree murder in the death of Specialist Megan Touma. As we receive more information, we will bring it to you immediately. But right now, the news, an arrest has been made of Edgar Patino.

We are taking your calls live in the case of missing Caylee. Bombshell. A judge refuses to suppress phone calls made from the jail. Now they have been released. Let`s take a listen.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: Here`s an FYI for you so you can conduct yourself accordingly.

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes.

LEE ANTHONY: Everything is public record, including this phone call, including the visitation videos.

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes.

LEE ANTHONY: So all that stuff is going to end up being released at some point.

CASEY ANTHONY: Oh, I know it is.

LEE ANTHONY: I had no knowledge of that whatsoever.

CASEY ANTHONY: Jose told me that yesterday.

LEE ANTHONY: They told me that after we got on the (INAUDIBLE) that we did that. So...

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes.

LEE ANTHONY: ... there`s obviously some things that I may have asked in a different -- I would have asked in a different way.

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes. Absolutely.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: And I don`t want you to, you know, feel for any reason that, you know, we`re not on your side about anything because -- because we are about everything. We`re completely behind you.

CASEY ANTHONY: Oh, I know.

LEE ANTHONY: And being completely behind you, our entire focus, all our days, every second of every day is consumed with what can we do to find Caylee.

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes. Oh, absolutely.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Now that she`s been tipped off her phone calls are being recorded, we no longer hear the "F"-word every 30 seconds.

Out to the lines. Deborah in California. Hi, Deborah.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I have really two quick questions.

GRACE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: One, since the family -- since this mother has seemed like she`s detached herself from her daughter, has anyone looked into the biological father, to speak with him...

GRACE: The biological father is dead. The bio father is dead from a car crash. Second question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Also, has anyone linked the new boyfriend with the money being spent and the daughter missing? Maybe he didn`t want a daughter, to be raising someone else`s daughter.

GRACE: Excellent question. To Rory O`Neill. It`s my understanding the boyfriend, Tony, has been cooperating.

O`NEILL: Yes, from the very beginning, since the phone calls first went to police, Tony has been cooperative.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: We love you, and you know, please think of anything that we can help find Caylee because as soon as we can help find her, it`s going to be, you know, open and shut to get you out of there, OK, darling?

CASEY ANTHONY: Absolutely. I know.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: Even with her brother tipping her off repeatedly, You`re being recorded, still no mention of how to find Caylee, how the search is going, what`s being done to find Caylee.

Out to the lines. Joanne in North Carolina. Hi, Joanne.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hey, Nancy.

GRACE: What`s your question, dear?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I want to know, why can`t the mom take a polygraph test?

GRACE: She can take a polygraph test, right, Peter Schaffer and Michael Mazzariello?

MAZZARIELLO: Absolutely.

SCHAFFER: She could. Why would she?

GRACE: Nobody is stopping her. But it would probably help, Michael Mazzariello, if she would speak to cops first. Uh-oh! I forgot. She wants to review the TV video of herself before she speaks to cops. Why is that Michael?

MAZZARIELLO: Well, I don`t know the reason behind that, Nancy, but her attorney should be at her side. She should be cooperating with the authorities 100 percent to find her child.

GRACE: Peter?

SCHAFFER: I would advise her to say nothing. She`s said too much already.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING 2-YEAR-OLD: I gave them the same resources that I gave you and you found out a hundred more things than they did.

LEE ANTHONY, BROTHER OF CASEY ANTHONY: Right.

C. ANTHONY: . and they were given the same information.

L. ANTHONY: Right.

C. ANTHONY: So it`s just about the approach, I guess, in using the resources to their full extent.

L. ANTHONY: We just need to figure out how we can be clear on whatever we`re giving to them so even if we have to, you know, speak very direct or if we have to -- you know, we can`t really speak in generalities with them, with anybody is what I`m finding out.

C. ANTHONY: I gave them things multiple times, each officer, I gave them the same information at least two or three times. I`ve done the same thing with you, the same thing with mom, the same thing with Jose. Everyone has the same information, same spelling, same name, I mean none of that has altered because it`s as is.

L. ANTHONY: Hey.

C. ANTHONY: Hey, can you give me Tony`s number?

L. ANTHONY: I can do that. I don`t know what real good it`s going do you at this point.

C. ANTHONY: Well, I`d like to talk to him anyway.

L. ANTHONY: OK.

C. ANTHONY: Because I called to talk to my mother and it`s a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) waste.

Oh by the way, I don`t want any of you coming up here when I have my first hearing for bond and everything else like don`t even (EXPLETIVE DELETED) waste your time coming up here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: They end up in court today, just hours ago, as a matter of fact, trying to fight the release of these recordings, recordings of phone calls she -- Casey Anthony -- made from the jail.

Today in court, she smiled throughout the court hearings. Why?

You know, there was her chance. She was in court before a judge to tell the judge everything she knows about her missing daughter, but nothing. And if you hear the phone calls, if you listen to them, you hear her brother tell her repeatedly, the phone calls are being recorded, but even knowing that, she never asks about the location of her daughter, 2- year-old Caylee, or the progress of the search for the little girl.

I want to go out to Larry Sutton with "People" magazine.

Larry, again, thank you for being with us. You know, your article states a quote from Sheriff Deputy Carlos Padilla, "Everything she gave us turned out to be false. It`s been like trying to put a puzzle together."

What did you learn?

LARRY SUTTON, STAFF EDITOR, PEOPLE MAGAZINE: Well, you know, we learned that she has told the police an awful lot of things, but everything turned out to be a lie. Everything from simple facts like, oh, I`m working at Universal Studios. Well, two detectives put her into the car, say let`s go and find out what your co-employees think.

As they get to the scene of where she was supposedly working, she turns around and tells them oh I was fired from that job two years ago.

So there`s a number of facts, five, six, seven things that she`s told the cops, everything from the last time she saw a nanny that supposedly had care of the little girl, turns out that she gave them the wrong date, the wrong time, and the wrong name of the nanny, as least as far as the police are concerned.

So she has spoken a lot, but everything`s turned out not to be true.

GRACE: And what I find to be the most probative thing in your article, you have a box of various lies that she`s told, just some of them, to police. And one that I find especially probative is that she claimed to police she had been conducting her own search for the past 31 days for her little girl, Caylee, pictured here.

Everyone, take a look at this little girl. But.

SUTTON: And you know, that search was in clubs and discos. She wasn`t going to find her there.

GRACE: Yes, in clubs and discos. And also, the boyfriend, Tony, that she had been seeing had been staying with, throughout, on and off, throughout the time she was AWOL from her home, this guy, Anthony Lazaro, says he didn`t know anything about a search.

SUTTON: In fact most.

GRACE: He had no idea Caylee was even missing.

SUTTON: Absolutely true. Most of her friends say the same thing. If there was any concern, she certainly wasn`t telling her friends about it.

GRACE: So it was a super secret search for 2-year-old little Caylee.

Out to Bill Majeski, former NYPD detective. He is a member of Safe Now Project.

Bill, it`s great to see you again. What do you make of it?

BILL MAJESKI, FMR. NYPD DETECTIVE, BOARD MEMBER, SAFE NOW PROJECT: Well, I think there`s an awful lot of information that the police have that they haven`t shared with the public nor should they. We talk about cell phone conversations, anything that she said over the cell phone -- anything that she did over the cell phone, every number that came into her and she dialed out, the police are aware of that.

There are a lot of things, all these conversations that are taking place in the jail house, she`s saying that her brother has learned 100 new things.

Well, you know the police, I`m sure, sitting down with this -- with the brother and saying, OK, let`s go point by point. What are these things? So how does she know that she found out 100 more things than the police did?

The other thing that troubles me about her are some of the words that she`s using. When she asked -- when the brother asked about her daughter, saying, you know, do you think she`s OK, she said, I feel -- you know, I feel that she`s OK, I feel that she`s close to me.

You know, you either know or you don`t know or you hope, you know, that she`s OK. It`s not a question of being -- a feeling. You know the woman is living in her own mind in terms of what occurred.

Clearly, the likelihood is greater that something disastrous has happened to the child. Those gasoline cans may indeed come into evidence as a result.

GRACE: As part -- is connected to this in some way.

MAJESKI: Yes.

GRACE: And, you know, even if they`re not probative, if they don`t really prove anything, to Rory O`Neill with Metro Networks, as Bill was pointing out, if you have to steal gas -- gasoline from your family to drive around your mom`s car, how can you afford to pay a nanny to take your daughter to the beach, to take your daughter to amusement parks?

That is her story.

And Rory O`Neill, what can you tell me about her telling police or her brother, she had two cell phones and she doesn`t know where either of them are. And suddenly she remembers the SIM card that stores all the memory from the cell phones, she has that in her jeans pocket and she lost it.

RORY O`NEILL, REPORTER, METRO NETWORKS: It`s interesting, too, because the brother was asking very specific questions about exactly when she called this baby-sitter last, what time, when did she call you, how -- was she calling you from a local phone number with the 407 area code. She said, no, there was a Ft. Lauderdale incoming number. We also would text message back and forth.

And I thought one of the best questions came from a viewer last night on your show who asked -- you know, we`ve seen all these pictures of Caylee. How come we`ve never seen a picture of Caylee with this baby- sitter? I think that`s also something else that the police might want to look into.

GRACE: You know nobody takes the SIM card out of their cell phone and just loses it. If you don`t have that in your cell phone, the cell phone won`t work, for Pete`s sake.

Everybody, joining me right now is a very special guest. This is a dear friend of the entire Anthony family. Holly Gagne, is joining us out of Orlando.

Holly, thank you so much for being with us tonight.

HOLLY GAGNE, FRIEND OF ANTHONY FAMILY: Thanks for having me, Nancy.

GRACE: Holly, I know that the family must be torn apart. They`re hearing bad press, rightfully so, about Casey. And at the same time, they`re desperately trying to find Caylee. They must be completely wrenched apart.

GAGNE: That`s an understatement, Nancy. No one prepares you for this. There is no book, there is no teacher, there is -- that`s like me saying to you, well, how would you react if your daughter was taken or your daughter was in jail? They are flying by the seat of their pants, for lack of a better word. Every day it is a living, breathing nightmare. I can barely function in my home and it`s not my family member.

GRACE: When is the last time that you saw or spoke to Casey?

GAGNE: I spoke with her the tail end of `07. I spoke with her -- she came by my home, she and Caylee. They`d stopped in just, you know, every few months to say hi. And I also -- she also called me and invited my daughter and I to the park.

GRACE: Did you -- have you ever heard of this nanny, Zenaida Gonzalez?

GAGNE: I had never heard the name, but when Casey came to my home at the tail end of `07, she had told me that there had been someone taking care of her. There was never a name given. And I knew that she had -- you use the word nanny, and I know when you hear that word, you think paying someone.

I look at it more it was a baby-sitter or a caregiver, because I had also kept Caylee sometimes.

GRACE: Right.

GAGNE: And there was never any money exchanged.

GRACE: Well, that is the word she used, that`s why I have.

GAGNE: OK.

GRACE: . have been using it as well.

So long story short, neither the grandmother, the -- the grandmother, the grandfather, you, nobody has ever seen the nanny?

GAGNE: Not to my knowledge. I can only speak for myself. I`ve never seen her, no.

GRACE: Did she represent to you that she had a job?

GAGNE: When I kept Caylee, I know she was employed at Universal. Now when I saw her last year that never came up.

GRACE: What do you think has happened to Caylee?

GAGNE: I can tell you what I don`t know, and I can tell America what I know about Casey as a mother. The mother that I know, the friend that I was neighbors with and that I`ve known for over six years, believe it or not, in all this craziness, is -- was and is a loving, caring mother.

Now she`s not a ditzy mother. She never portrayed being a young mother, what you`d think as a teen. She was very, just, detailed, reading to her child. When I would baby-sit her down to little things.

GRACE: So a good mother, a great mother.

GAGNE: Well, I have a pretty high standard of being a mother. I`d say she was a good mother -- I`d say she was a good mother.

GRACE: Everyone, with us tonight -- and we`re taking your calls -- Holly Gagne, very dear friend of the Anthony family.

Continued

[Faith]

Everybody, as we`re going to break, I want to share with you my special birthday wishes to my husband, the father of the twins, Lucy and John David.

Happy birthday, David.

And everyone, before we go to break, I want to stop to remember a Tennessee friend of the show, a longtime fan, Arlene Dever. She passed away from complications after open heart surgery. She was a retired schoolteacher, 27 years, author, a daughter of missionaries that traveled the world. She never missed a show.

Our thoughts and prayers with her family.

Good night, Arlene.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWSBREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: And you last saw her a month ago?

C. ANTHONY: 31 days. It`s bee 31 days.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: Who has her? Do you have a name?

C. ANTHONY: Her name is Zenaida Fernandez-Gonzalez.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: Who is that? Babysitter?

C. ANTHONY: She`s been my nanny for about a year and a half, almost two years.

UNIDENTIFIED 911 OPERATOR: Why are you calling now? Why didn`t you call 31 days ago?

C. ANTHONY: I have been looking for her and just gone through other resources to try to find her which is stupid.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: In nightclubs and discos, that`s almost the extent of her search for her little girl, according to sources.

Back out to Anthony family friend, joining us tonight, Holly Gagne is with us.

Holly, you stated that Caylee was a good mother. Why not great?

GAGNE: Well, I just had a very high standard, and I guess I`m a little cocky, because I think I`m a great mother. So I don`t anyone`s as good as me, to be honest with you.

GRACE: How is her family reacting to all of her lies about the simplest things?

GAGNE: Nancy, I`m going to say this, you`re a mother, I`m a mother, and you`re going to defend your child because that`s all you know. You gave birth, you`ve raised this child, they are a very close family.

We were their neighbors. I mean, always together, and you`re going to defend your child. There`s just -- I don`t -- your mind can`t conceive that and they believe her in their hearts, and so that`s why.

GRACE: Do they believe that Caylee is still alive?

GAGNE: 185 million percent yes.

GRACE: OK, I`m going to ignore the 185 million thing but why, why do they believe that she`s alive at this juncture?

I mean the whole thing with the nanny -- she doesn`t exist. The nanny doesn`t exist. I know that`s hard to take in, but it`s a harsh reality, that`s the truth. That we know right now. I mean, maybe that will all change tomorrow, but it looks like she doesn`t exist.

GAGNE: OK, it looks like. Until that has been proven, they are going to believe their daughter. And you just said it. It may still be true. So until then, they`re going to believe her daughter, and that`s why I said what I said.

GRACE: Yes. Were you surprised when you found out that so many things she said were just lies?

GAGNE: Absolutely. I was devastated.

GRACE: Why? Did she have a history of lying? And did anyone know she had a history of lying?

GAGNE: I had never been a part of that, and so.

GRACE: Yes.

GAGNE: . so the reason I was so shocked and because that`s just not the Casey that I know. The Casey that I`ve seen, that`s been in my home, that`s babysat my own children. That`s just not who I know, Nancy.

GRACE: What was their reaction to Casey racking up about $45,000 worth of credit card debt on her mom`s credit cards?

GAGNE: I have not spoken to them about that at all. That has -- I`ve not.

GRACE: You know what, I understand, because in light of the fact she`s in jail, Caylee is missing, the credit cards seem so unimportant right now. But it seems to me that looking at where she spent all that money and what she was spending it on could be probative as to where Caylee may be tonight.

I want to go very quickly to Dr. Michael Bell joining us out of Miami.

Dr. Bell, thank you for being with us. Could you tell me if Caylee`s body is found now, is there a way to date the time of her death?

DR. MICHAEL BELL, PALM BEACH CO. CHIEF MEDICAL EXAMINER: Not from the autopsy, no, no.

GRACE: If a body has been buried and moved, would you still find forensic evidence, say, in the burial location, even if the body was no longer there?

BELL: You might, especially if there`s any clothing or any other material from the child may still remain there.

GRACE: I want to go back to Bill Majeski, former NYPD.

Bill, how do you go about proving somebody doesn`t exist? I`m talking about the so-called nanny.

MAJESKI: Yes, I think in this particular case, what they have to do is they have to go back to the original time frame, recreate the time line from the last time that the baby was seen with anyone, and then go forward from there.

But it`s just -- it`s a normal investigative process, you know, and it`s odd that the term puzzle was used, because essentially that`s what an investigation is. It`s a giant jigsaw puzzle and each new clue and each new bit of information makes that picture clearer.

GRACE: Out to the lines to Debbie in Missouri. Hi, Debbie.

DEBBIE, MISSOURI RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy.

GRACE: What`s your question, dear?

DEBBIE: Well, I`ve been wondering something that I haven`t heard mentioned.

GRACE: OK.

DEBBIE: If the father`s deceased, wouldn`t Casey be drawing a Social Security check for little Caylee?

GRACE: Interesting, the father died in a car crash, Rory O`Neill, correct?

O`NEILL: Yes, he died in a car crash about a year ago. They were not -- they weren`t married so I don`t know if the Social Security rules would apply in that case.

GRACE: To Larry Sutton, with "People" magazine, both you and Rory have done extensive investigation on this -- in this case. How is she supporting herself -- I`m talking about her, the woman smiling in court today, Casey Anthony -- other than mooching off parents?

SUTTON: Well, reaching up to parents is exactly what`s been the case for the past few months. You know she moved in with her family. Her mother was very nice and granting her own room and Caylee her own room.

And as far as her source of income, well, that`s kind of a mystery for the past few months.

GRACE: You know, everybody, throughout the hearing today -- this video has just come in from the court hearing today, is smiling and yucking it up.

You know, to me, Dr. Saunders, that`s not a good look.

PATRICIA SAUNDERS, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: No, it`s a very bad look, Nancy. It`s hard for us to empathize with someone who doesn`t have much empathy and it`s really hard for family to think that her daughter`s attachment to their granddaughter may not be very real or very human.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

L. ANTHONY: Did you speak with Caylee over the phone at any time?

C. ANTHONY: I did one time, yes, and that was actually the date that Mom has called the police.

L. ANTHONY: OK. Do you remember what time you spoke to her?

C. ANTHONY: Around noon, it was through a private call.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Out to the lines, Amy in Alaska.

PS, everybody, you`re seeing video from today`s court hearing in which Casey Anthony smiled pretty much the whole time.

Hey, Amy, what`s your question?

AMY, ALASKAN RESIDENT: My question is, did anybody ever question the family? Did Caylee talk about her babysitter because (INAUDIBLE) talk about their day care? They talk about who.

GRACE: Interesting question.

Rory, do we know anything about that?

O`NEILL: Well, we know -- I mean, the grandmother Cindy Anthony was well aware of the babysitter. I mean the family was well aware of this nanny.

GRACE: And never seen her.

O`NEILL: But never saw her.

GRACE: OK. Tina in Florida -- I think the answer`s no to that one, to Amy in Alaska.

Tina, hi, what`s your question?

TINA, FLORIDA RESIDENT: Yes, my question is where is the other set of grandparents?

GRACE: Interesting.

Larry Sutton, what do we know about the biological father`s family?

SUTTON: Well, you know, there`s some question as to the story that the family is telling. That the person who was the father died in an automobile accident. That`s beyond -- not beyond belief. But there are other possibilities out there.

So as far as we`re concerned, as far as the work we have done to look into this.

GRACE: Right.

SUTTON: . it`s still a question as to who the father is.

GRACE: Marc Klaas, final thought?

MARC KLAAS, FOUNDER, BEYONDMISSING.COM, FATHER OF MURDER VICTIM POLLY KLAAS: Yes, Casey can do many things. It was asked rhetorically why she wouldn`t take a polygraph exam. She should for the very same reason that I did, because she can clear herself and help law enforcement move forward.

She is giving them nothing, they`re desperate to find this child, only she can help.

GRACE: Marc Klaas, right as usual, president of Klaas Kids Foundation.

Let`s stop, everyone, and remember Army Specialist Dustin Jackson, 21, Arlington, Texas, killed, Iraq. Dedicated to serving his country, the second member of his family to lose their life in the war. Loyal, compassionate, loved taking in strays, helping others, brought his mom grilled cheese sandwiches and bag lunches to the homeless.

He`s remembered for giving the world`s best hugs. He dreamed of college and leaves behind parents, Ina and Mark, brother Damon, sister Krista, widow, Michelle.

Dustin Jackson, American hero.

Thanks to our guests but especially to you for being with us. And happy birthday to our show superstar, Mr. Lee Alexander.

Everyone, I`ll see you tomorrow night 8:00 sharp Eastern, and until then, good night, friend.

END

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0807/29/ng.01.html

[Jute]

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


LARRY KING, CNN HOST: Tonight, court fight over those jailhouse tapes from that missing toddler mystery. What doesn't Caylee Anthony's mom want us to hear as she sits behind bars?
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: In my gut, she's still OK.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

KING: Her own mother's actions helped put her there and for reporting that the 2-year-old disappeared.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CINDY ANTHONY, GRANDMOTHER OF MISSING TODDLER: My granddaughter has been taken, she has been missing for a month.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

KING: What's going on? I'll ask her. She's here.

Plus cell phones and cancer. Is there a link? Are children in immediate danger? A new warning should have everybody asking, does something I use every day kill me? Put down your cell phones now and find out, next on LARRY KING LIVE.

Good evening.

Where is little Caylee Anthony? And what does her now-jailed mother know about her fate?

The 2-year-old went missing in mid-June. She was reported missing on July 15th, that's a day (sic) later. Her mother Casey (sic) then calls in. She has her arrested on charges of child neglect, making false official statements, obstructing a criminal investigation. Police have now named Casey Anthony, the mother, as a person of interest in Caylee's disappearance.

We welcome the grandmother, Cindy Anthony. She is with us in Orlando, Florida.

Do you have any thoughts, Cindy, as to what happened to your granddaughter? CINDY ANTHONY: My thoughts are a lot clearer now than they were that night that I made three 911 calls. I'm very confident that -- I'm very confident that Casey will be exonerated of all charges once we find Caylee, so that's why our focus is on trying to find our granddaughter.

KING: So you feel she's definitely alive?

CINDY ANTHONY: I believe she is alive when Casey handed her off to the baby-sitter. At this point, I just hope to god that no one has done anything to her.

KING: Little explaining, Casey and Caylee were both living with you, right?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes, Casey has always lived at home. Caylee was born in 2005 and has lived with us ever since.

KING: And the father, I understand, was killed?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes, he's never been part of her life.

KING: But he was killed in an automobile accident?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes, but he was never a part of her life before that.

KING: And he wasn't supporting her?

CINDY ANTHONY: No, he was never even on the birth certificate. That was a mutual thing between Casey and the father.

KING: Why did you turn daughter in?

CINDY ANTHONY: Little background, Casey had gone on an extended trip, kind of trying to figure out -- she's 22. We were talking about when it might be the right time for her and Caylee to move out. And her trip just kept getting extended and extended, which was really not a red flag itself, I mean, the trip itself. There would be a few days at a time that she would go and stay with friends. She went from a couple different friends, and I never got a chance to speak with Caylee during that time.

I would ask Casey periodically if she could put Caylee on the phone or whatever, and there was always a very reasonable excuse. Either she was napping or she was already in bed. By the time I get home from work sometimes in the evening, and I would be able to speak to my daughter, it would be time for Caylee to be napping or going to bed.

KING: I got you. So she finally comes home?

CINDY ANTHONY: Well, what happened was, to set the background right, she had told me that she had been in Jacksonville for the last week and a half. We had gotten a notice in the mail that we had a registered letter. We found the registered letter a few days before, but it was the weekend, so we had to go down and get it. And when we got it, my husband found out it was from a tow truck or a towing company.

And when we actually went down and found out that the car that she, you know, uses was not in Jacksonville, it was in Orlando and we found out the date, that was a huge red flag.

So I started calling her friends and I found one friend that had just seen her a few hours prior, and she took me to where Casey was at, and when I got there, there was no Caylee. So I started to feel like, what's going on? She had told me that she was at the sitter's. So we took her friend home. Her friend and her and I drove around for a while. It was later in the evening, about 7:00, 7:30. That's typically when we start getting Caylee down for a nap and Casey's response was that Caylee was probably already getting ready for bed and didn't want to disrupt her.

But being the selfish grandma that I am, I wanted to see my granddaughter. So we drove around a bit. And I tried to convince her to take me to her, and I just started getting an eerie feeling that something wasn't right in Casey's voice. I know my daughter pretty well.

KING: So you decided -- in the interest of time, let's listen to your 911 call.

CINDY ANTHONY: Make sure you do the first one first, because there were three, actually.

KING: We'll do the first one. Let's listen.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

DISPATCH: 911, what's your emergency?

CINDY ANTHONY: I called a little bit ago. The deputy sheriff's not here. I found out my granddaughter has been taken. She has been missing for a month. I told you my daughter was missing for a month. I just found her today. But I can't find my granddaughter. She just admitted to me that she's been trying to find her herself. There's something wrong. I found my daughter's car today and it smells like there's been a dead body in the damn car.

DISPATCHER: Is your daughter there?

CINDY ANTHONY: Yes.

DISPATCHER: Can I speak with her?

CASEY ANTHONY: Hello.

DISPATCHER: Hello.

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes?

DISPATCHER: Hi. What can you -- can you tell me what's going on a little bit?

CASEY ANTHONY: My daughter's been missing for the last 31 days.

DISPATCHER: And you know who has her?

CASEY ANTHONY: I know who has her. I've tried to contact her. I actually received a phone call today -- now from a number that is no longer in service. I did get to speak to my daughter for about a moment, about a minute.

DISPATCHER: Why are you calling now? Why didn't you call 31 days ago?

CASEY ANTHONY: I've been looking for her and have gone through other resources to try to find her, which was stupid.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

KING: That was the third call. We didn't have the first two.

Cindy, are you now saying you believe your daughter -- you want her to come out, and you believe that we're going to find Caylee?

CINDY ANTHONY: I believe we're going to find Caylee if the investigation goes the right way, if the media will not just take their own spins on things.

I was in shock that first night and there's a lot of things -- the first phone call, there was no panic in my voice. The second phone call, a little frustrated. The third phone call, by the time my daughter had spoken to my son and actually said that Caylee had been kidnapped, I walked in on that conversation. So the police were going to be taking their time to get to the house, so I said whatever it was to get them out there right then and there.

KING: Cindy will be coming back with us. We want to talk to a couple of people about this. Casey Anthony's attorney is here as well. He'll join us after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: Our grandmother friend Cindy will be coming back.

But let's meet Jose Baez, the defense attorney for Casey Anthony. Casey is being held on charges related to the disappearance of her 2- year-old daughter, Caylee.

In Miami is our friend Stacey Honowitz, the assistant Florida state attorney who specializes in child abuse and sex crimes.

And in Madison Heights, Michigan, Dr. Daniel Spitz, forensic expert, chief medical examiner for Macomb County, Michigan.

A judge today denied to block media access to Casey's phone calls and visitation conversations in jail. Everything was released.

Let's just listen for a moment to Casey talking with her brother, Lee.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY, BROTHER OF CASEY ANTHONY: You think Caylee's OK right now?

CASEY ANTHONY: My gut feeling? As mom asked me yesterday and even Jose asked me last night, the psychologist asked me this morning that I meet with through the court -- in my gut, she's still OK. And it still feels like she's close to home.

L. ANTHONY: OK.

CASEY ANTHONY: So that's still my best feeling at the moment.

Again, if that changes, obviously I'm going to reach out and say something immediately. But I know mom will understand this better than anyone that there's that type of bond that you have with your kid.

L. ANTHONY: Right.

CASEY ANTHONY: And it's -- unexplainable, absolutely.

L. ANTHONY: Did you speak with Caylee over the phone at any time?

CASEY ANTHONY: I did one time, yes, and that was actually the day that mom called the police.

L. ANTHONY: OK. Do you remember what time you spoke to her?

CASEY ANTHONY: Around noon, it was through a private call.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

KING: Jose Baez, you're Casey's attorney, what's your read on this case?

JOSE BAEZ, CASEY'S ATTORNEY: Well, my read on this is she is basically being prosecuted for a homicide without any evidence. And the presumption of innocence has flown out the window, and that really scares me.

KING: Stacey Honowitz, what do you read on the prosecution's case, if any?

STACEY HONOWITZ, ASSISTANT FLORIDA STATE ATTORNEY: Well first of all, anybody looking at this case, it doesn't take a prosecutor to realize that there's something not right. Thirty-one days go by and this woman does not report that her child is missing, and there's no panic in her voice when she's talking to anyone in a jail or even when she's sitting in a courtroom.

So certainly she's going to be a person of interest to the police because she's the only person who knows where this child might be. And the fact that she's not cooperating certainly brings to mind that something is not right. So all of these feelings of the presumption of innocence, these are things that she's bringing on herself by not cooperating, by not being in a panic, by not trying to figure out who has her child.

BAEZ: I think that's inaccurate.

KING: Dr. Spitz -- hold on, Jose, just one thing for Dr. Spitz.

Dr. Spitz, there were reports of the smell of a decomposing body in the trunk of that car. The answer was that it was a pizza or something. Is there a similarity in those two smells?

DR. DANIEL SPITZ, CHIEF MEDICAL EXAMINER, MACOMB COUNTY: No, not really. That's very concerning to me. The smell of decomposition is very distinct. The fact that it was appreciated by this homicide detective and now child abuse detective, that's very concerning to me, and I think that as that evidence gets evaluated, you may in fact be able to prove this was the remains of a human body.

KING: Jose, is this something that -- is the prosecution saying, we don't have a body, but it sort of looks like a duck, acts like a duck, walks like a duck, it might be a duck.

BAEZ: You have to bear in mind this is the same dog that smelled something in the backyard, was inconsistent, so they had to bring in another dog and they dug there for two days and found nothing. At best, this dog is one for two, at worst it's zero for two. And quite frankly, I don't like those odds.

KING: What do you think happened to the baby?

BAEZ: Well, we believe this child has been kidnapped. And what's really disappointing is that people aren't searching for her as well as they should be.

We want to get the word out that Caylee is still missing. We want to do everything we can to facilitate the search. The prosecution can wait. If there's a missing child out there, we need to do every single thing we can to find this little girl and not put obstacles in front of that. And that's a problem.

What was said earlier about her not cooperating with police, that's clearly a misstatement. What happened was she spoke with police that night, they decided to charge her and start a criminal proceeding. Since then, I have opened myself up and the line of communications with law enforcement and I told them, if you have any leads that you want to bounce off my client, I will be happy to bounce them off her and give you access. The fact that she's not cooperating is just a misstatement.

KING: Stacey, does the 31 days, is that what bothers you the most?

HONOWITZ: I mean there's a number of things. If you look back into the investigation and everything that's been released so far, there's been such inconsistent statements. And his client in and of herself has given false leads because everything that they have tried to go down, every path that they have tried to find something out has been a lie.

She lied about working. She lied about the baby-sitter. She lied about leaving the baby-sitter. So all these things - when you say cooperating, the idea of cooperating is telling the truth. And in this case, all these leads by her have been false. So that's not just the 31 days. That's the worst of it. I think any parent would go crazy.

KING: Dr. Spitz, a mysterious stain apparently was found in the trunk. Police are awaiting for results. What might you read into that?

SPITZ: Well, I'll tell you. While Stacey's comments about all the misstatements are very concerning, it's going to be the forensic evidence which is going to crack this case open. And while the cadaver dog may not have been exact in the dog's approach, the dog certainly has led investigators to certain things that need to be further evaluated. The decomposition smell came from something. The stain that you mentioned is forensic evidence. So while that gets evaluated, I think we're going to have some results, and I think we're going to have much more information to go on.

It's very concerning the length of time this child has been missing. And the longer this goes, the more likely, we're dealing with a homicide investigation.

KING: Let's listen to more of a conversation Casey had with her brother Lee, released by the police. Watch.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

L. ANTHONY: Is there anything specifically -- I know you're going to meet with, you know the investigators and everything, you know -- is there anything specifically, the details, that you want to clarify for me now so when I'm following up on my own leads and my own information, putting the stuff together, you know then I can start working on it now?

CASEY ANTHONY: At the moment there's nothing specific or nothing that you know should probably be said here. Again, I'll put something together before I see Jose or when I see Jose and you know make sure that I have something also to put out.

L. ANTHONY: Right.

CASEY ANTHONY: So that way you can get whatever you like.

L. ANTHONY: OK. And just remember when you get to talk to those guys, you know, you mentioned that you're going to have your prep and everything with Jose. But remember truth don't hurt.

CASEY ANTHONY: I know but there are some things that I have told them that were misconstrued and not used to their benefit. I gave them the same resources that I gave you and you found out a hundred more things than they did. And they were given the same information. So it's just about the approach I guess and using the resources to their full extent.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: Jose, do you believe this child is alive?

BAEZ: Yes, I do. I really do, and I think if we concentrate on looking for her, that's exactly what we're going to do, we're going to find her.

I've said a million times, my case looks a whole lot better if we find Caylee. And that's what I want to try to focus on. We've done everything we possibly can to try and assist. There's a lot being said of her cooperation, but I have to tell you, I've taken an oath to protect my client and her interests.

If you want to drop it anywhere, drop it right here. I'm going to defend my client and protect her from what's going on in the system, and we certainly want to help with the cooperation.

KING: Stacey, do you believe law enforcement is looking for the child?

HONOWITZ: Well, I can't imagine why they wouldn't be. If they get a report that a child is missing, you know, within a couple hours they issue an Amber Alert under normal circumstances. So in this case, you heard the police officer on the tape say to her, why did you wait 31 days to report this? So you would hope, and I'm sure that they are actively investigating and trying to find this child.

KING: Dr. Spitz, you're saying forensics will answer this?

SPITZ: I truly hope so. The fact that it's been 31 days puts law enforcement in a tough spot, but the bottom line is if this is a homicide investigation, it is going to be the forensics. Even without a body, the forensics in that car may in fact tell us what happened.

KING: We'll have Cindy Anthony come back and comment on what we've just heard, right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KING: Few more things, back with Cindy Anthony.

From what you heard, Cindy, do you -- the key here is -- when she was gone for 31 days, didn't you think that was a little nuts?

CINDY ANTHONY: No, not really. I think what's nuts is for people to speculate on things that they don't know the whole truth.

I want to ask the question to the gentleman that doesn't think that pizza can cause an odor of that magnitude. I want him tonight to put a piece of pizza in the trunk, put it in the Florida hot sun for 19 days and then open his trunk and tell me how bad it smells when there's maggots in there. The sheriff's department was there that night with at least seven or eight deputies. That car we had aired out. They walked by it all night long. They left it in my driveway for two full days before they decided to take it down to where they look at things, and then they waited until the night before he bond hearing to even start looking at it. So if that was --

KING: Cindy --

CINDY ANTHONY: -- let me ask you one thing. If that was truly their key evidence in something, then why didn't they investigate that first thing?

KING: You want to answer it, doctor?

SPITZ: Sure. There's no question that the smell of a decomposing body is markedly different than the smell of some rotting food matter.

But, you know, that's not the real evidence. That's just sort of gets you going in that direction. What needs to be done is that evidence in the trunk needs to be evaluated, because with DNA testing, it can clearly be separated whether that was any type of food matter or the tissues or decomposing fluids that you would get with a body that had been in the trunk for any length of time.

CINDY ANTHONY: I was told today -- can I ask a question? I was told today, sir, that sweat in that car could also be construed as decomposition. Is that true?

SPITZ: No, that's entirely different. Sweat or those kinds of body fluids are not the same thing as decomposing tissue or the decompositional fluid that is generated from a body.

So again, it all is going to go back to the collection of that evidence, the analysis of that evidence. And when it comes back that that in fact shows that a body was in that trunk, then there's going to be some explaining that needs to be done. If in fact that's not the case, then maybe it will turn out differently.

KING: Cindy, when your daughter gave the baby to the baby- sitter, what was the baby-sitter supposed to do with it? What happened after that?

CINDY ANTHONY: The same thing that she's always done, is let her pick her back up and take her.

KING: And when she went to pick her back up, what happened?

CINDY ANTHONY: They weren't there. They weren't there.

KING: So is it the suspicion that the baby-sitter kidnapped her?

CINDY ANTHONY: That's not suspicion. That's what Casey has maintained all along.

KING: Did you get a ransom note?

CINDY ANTHONY: No, it's not that type of kidnapping, sir, that this person loves this girl and wants to have her as her own. That happens all the time. That happened not too long ago. In Orlando, Florida, someone stole the baby right out of a hospital.

KING: So she's a runaway with this child?

CINDY ANTHONY: I believe so.

KING: And you're saying the authorities are not looking for that baby-sitter and the child?

CINDY ANTHONY: Well let me tell you why I say that. It's because they told us there was one person in central Florida with that name. In fact there's nine in central Florida. I just got a phone call on my way here that there's four in Fort Lauderdale and my daughter said that this girl had a Fort Lauderdale number and has connections in Fort Lauderdale and New York, and New Jersey.

In every state, there's people by this name. They think she's smart enough to make up this person for the last two and a half years, but dumb enough to park a car where in plain sight that her mother would drive by twice a day and see and leave her purse in the front seat of the car and not drive it into some lake.

So, my daughter is not a murder. My granddaughter is missing. My granddaughter is missing.

KING: Well will do more on this. Thank you, Cindy, and thank you, panel.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0807/29/lkl.01.html

[Faith]

This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," July 29, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

Video at the link

MEGYN KELLY, FOX NEWS HOST: This is a "FOX News Alert." An arrest tonight in the murder of pregnant Army specialist Megan Touma.

Good evening, everyone. I'm Megyn Kelly.

Moments ago, Fayetteville police arresting a 27-year-old man and charging him with first-degree murder, Touma found dead in a motel bathtub on June 21. This news is literally breaking as we speak. We're going to have much more later in the hour.

But first up tonight, "On the Record" obtains shocking new photos of Casey Anthony partying at a club days after she says her daughter went missing. Casey is behind bars tonight, a person of interest in what police say may be the homicide of her little daughter, Caylee. Casey claims she left her daughter with a baby-sitter on June 9, and that when she returned to pick her up, little Caylee was gone.

It took five weeks before the child was reported missing, and now we know what Casey Anthony was doing for part of that time, these pictures taken at a club on June 20, while Casey says she was conducting her own search for her daughter.


John Azzilano and Teddy Piper, the photographers who took those pictures, join us live. Good evening, guys.

JOHN AZZILANO, STUDENT AND CLUB PHOTOGRAPHER: How're you doing?

KELLY: John, let me start with you. You took these photographs on June 20?

Watch the interview

AZZILANO: Yes, the night of June 20. Teddy and I usually work at a club called Fusian. We take a lot of pictures there. Casey was there that night.

KELLY: How sure are you that it was Friday night, June 20?

AZZILANO: I'm absolutely positive. The photos are time-stamped. Every time a photo's taken, it embeds it into the -- into the code of the photo. And when I upload it to my Flickr account, it actually says right on my Flickr account June 20.

KELLY: Why were you taking photos at the club that night?

AZZILANO: Teddy and I usually go to clubs around Orlando, and we're hired to do nightlife photography. And that was just one of the nights we were working at Fusian.

KELLY: John, who was she there with?

AZZILANO: I really don't recall. Me and Teddy were bopping around that night, taking pictures of a lot of people. She just happened to be one of them. So I don't recall any specific people that she was there with.

KELLY: Teddy, do you know who she was there with?

TEDDY PIPER, STUDENT AND CLUB PHOTOGRAPHER: Not exactly. We showed up later in the evening, probably after midnight on that Friday night, and set up and took pictures just throughout the night until the club closed at 2:00.

KELLY: OK. And was she drinking?

AZZILANO: I'm not exactly sure if she was drinking. I mean, it is a bar. A lot of people were drinking that night. I can't confirm or deny that she was or wasn't drinking, but I know it was just a -- everyone was having a good time that night, I guess.

KELLY: So John, you had the opportunity to observe her, then, that night.

AZZILANO: Not closely. I didn't scrutinize whatsoever. I just -- like I said, we were walking around, taking photos. She just happened to be in, I believe, four or five of the photos that we had taken.

KELLY: And from what you saw, what was her mood? What was her demeanor?

AZZILANO: She seemed happy, as were most of the people there that night. I mean, as you can see from the photos, she seemed -- she seemed all right, having a good time, just like people our age would that night. That was it.

PIPER: Nothing out of the ordinary.

AZZILANO: Nothing out of the ordinary, really.

KELLY: Teddy, do you know how many -- have you seen her at the club Fusian at other times in these past -- you know, in these past days since June 9? Have you seen her besides that one night there?

PIPER: Yes, I can recall her being there. I can't remember exactly how many Fridays she was there, but I had been taking photos at Fusian every Friday night for, like, probably a month coming up to the -- you know, the 20th there, which was the last day I took photos. But I saw her definitely on what would be the 13th, I think, and the 6th.

KELLY: OK, the 6th and the 13th and the 20th. So this is a place, obviously, she likes to hang out.

PIPER: Well, I guess so. Usually, it's about the same crowd every Friday night at this...

KELLY: And Teddy, did you notice any change when you saw her in those weeks, on that Friday the 6th, the 13th, the 20th, those days? Did you notice any change in her mood, her demeanor when she was at the club?

PIPER: No, not necessarily at all. I really didn't come in contact with her too much, you know, in passing just talked to her, a couple sentences here and there. But absolutely no out of the ordinary behavior.

KELLY: How did she seem to you?

PIPER: She seemed just fine. Like, I really -- from the amount of time that I actually talked to her, I couldn't reasonably, like, judge her, you know.

AZZILANO: She seemed fine. She seemed like she was having fun with her friends and just wearing really nice regalia and just having a really - - a good, decent time, just like anybody else would.

KELLY: John, when you found out that she had been arrested -- and you know, you've been following -- obviously, you know the headlines these days -- what was your thought, knowing that you had her in these photos?

AZZILANO: Well, it was funny to me at first because I had just met her that one night that I'd taken photos of her. And one night, I went to Fusian and I -- I went there to take pictures again, and you know, everyone seemed down. They asked if I'd watched the news that night, and I hadn't. And then I went home and I saw, and I was shocked to see -- I mean, I really don't know Casey very well at all, I mean, very, very loosely, but I was shocked to see that someone I had come into contact with is in such a case of such, you know, severity.

KELLY: I mean, sitting here tonight, guys, are you shocked to learn, now that you know her story, that she claims the times she was at Fusian, child was missing? Does that jive with the person you saw there? Can you reconcile that the woman you saw at that club is claiming to the world now that her child was kidnapped and missing at that time?

AZZILANO: I don't know. It really hasn't really impacted us that much. I'm not -- you know, it's not -- it's not hitting me hard. I mean, it's kind of crazy that it's going on, but I really -- I don't have an opinion because I don't really -- I'm not on either side. I'm not sure. I don't know Casey that well. I mean, Teddy can pretty much say the same.

PIPER: Yes, I didn't even know she had a daughter until the news broke about her daughter being missing.

KELLY: Let me just ask you about these photos because -- do you know who any of these people are in the photos, either by name or just by their relationship to her?

AZZILANO: Not at all. I think the photos were on -- which photos are we looking at?

(CROSSTALK)

KELLY: In any of them. In any of the photos that you guys took, I mean, does she know -- does she know these people? Do you know these people? Is it a friend of hers that we're looking at, these girlfriends? Are those guys boyfriends to her? Who are they, if you know?

AZZILANO: If they're the photos that I think about, I'm really not sure. Like I said, we go around taking photos of random people. I don't really know any names. That was probably my first night at Fusian, so I didn't really know any of the regulars. I don't know. Maybe, Teddy, you can say any different, but...

PIPER: In some of the photos that I had, which -- I don't know -- I don't know what photos you guys have.

KELLY: Ours are from June 20.

(CROSSTALK)

KELLY: Ours are from June 20. She's in the blue dress.

PIPER: I mean, there's, like -- there's, like, two places that the photos were, you know, like -- my photos are not posted on his Flickr, so...

KELLY: Did you -- well, let me ask you his. Do either of you know Casey's boyfriend?

AZZILANO: Yes, I know Anthony. Anthony's a great guy. I actually -- I knew him when we used to live in New York together, but I haven't talked to him in a while.

KELLY: You haven't talked to him since this whole thing broke?

AZZILANO: I talk to him here and there, saying hello and stuff. Just hellos and good-byes and how are yous and -- but nothing -- nothing pertaining to the case whatsoever.

KELLY: So he's not in these pictures we've been looking at.

AZZILANO: I don't believe so. I know I do have pictures of Anthony somewhere on my Flickr, but I don't know if they're in context with Casey or anything like that.

KELLY: Can I ask you, have the investigators, have the police contacted either one of you?

PIPER: Not at all.

AZZILANO: Not at all because I think we figured our position in this was -- you know, aside from the photos, our position as people that are affiliated, it's not -- I don't think it's very -- we're not very important. Maybe the photos are.

KELLY: And have you been contacted by Casey, her attorney or anybody connected to her?

AZZILANO: Not whatsoever.

PIPER: Not at all.

KELLY: All right, John and Teddy, thanks so much for being here. We appreciate it.

AZZILANO: Thanks a lot. I appreciate it.

PIPER: Thank you.

KELLY: Well, joining us live now is Michael Walsh. He is co-counsel for Casey Anthony. And Michael, I know you're just first getting a look at these, I assume, tonight, as we are. Your reaction to what you just saw and heard.

MICHAEL WALSH, CO-COUNSEL FOR CASEY ANTHONY: I could only hear it. I can't see the photos from where I'm at.

KELLY: And so your reaction to what you heard?

WALSH: She worked there. She was one of the promotion girls at that club, so it would be expected that she was there. The fact that she's in some photos from a guy who said he didn't really observe her, he didn't -- doesn't really know her, one of them didn't even know she had a daughter, it's a little hard to react to just that kind of statement. The fact that she was at the club -- she worked there.

KELLY: And how long has she worked at Fusian?

WALSH: It's not a steady job. It's a promotional thing, so it's on and off for the last few months.

KELLY: And had Casey told you prior to tonight that she had worked at Fusian in the time Caylee was missing and had worked at promotional events?

WALSH: Well, I just have to clarify. Today was my first day meeting with Casey.

KELLY: OK, so...

WALSH: So I didn't have an opportunity to speak to her before today.

KELLY: But was that information that she made clear to you or your co-counsel?

WALSH: Oh, she's made a lot of things clear to us, but I would keep that under the attorney-client privilege.

KELLY: So how is it you know, if you can tell us, that she worked at Fusian?

WALSH: Oh, some things I can tell you. She certainly told me that.

KELLY: OK. And Michael, let me ask you, because -- you know, I mean, let's lay it out there. People see those photos, which I know you haven't seen, but it shows her with these guys and gals in bar shots, appearing to have a good time. People are going to be asking themselves how a woman whose child was missing, and according to her had been kidnapped, could behave in such a manner.

WALSH: Well, I have to take issue with the date that you described as June 9 as the date that little Caylee was kidnapped. That's not the date she was kidnapped. It's sometime later in the month.

KELLY: Well, what is the date? Because that comes from your client.

WALSH: Well, it comes from my client to the police. It hasn't come from my client to the police while she's had the assistance of counsel. Obviously, she said some things that the police certainly have taken issue with, with regards to the veracity of it. And we've kind of explained the reason she said the things she said to the police was out of fear for her child's life.

KELLY: So you're suggesting...

WALSH: So I can't address what she said.

KELLY: You're suggesting -- so I'm clear, you're suggesting that she perhaps was not honest with the police when she said Caylee went missing on June 9.

WALSH: Yes, that is correct. That would not be an accurate statement.

KELLY: And is it also correct that she would have, then, lied to her mother, Cindy, and her brother, Lee, who we heard on their 911 calls believed when they called on July 15 that Caylee had been missing for over a month?

WALSH: You call it a lie. I call it under the duress and pressure of somebody whose child has been kidnapped and told, If you say anything about it, your child will receive harm. So I think a lie is a material falsehood. I think this young girl was going through the pressures and stress of what she was dealing with.

KELLY: Michael, is that what happened here, that -- I know -- we know that Casey says Caylee was kidnapped and that she had at least one communication from the alleged kidnapper, the baby-sitter. Are you now saying that the baby-sitter made a threat to Casey?

WALSH: Yes, and there are other people besides the baby-sitter involved.

KELLY: Can you tell us more, who?

WALSH: No, I can't tell you who.

KELLY: Have you spoken with either Jess (ph) or Juliet (ph), two women who Casey says knew this baby-sitter, Zenaida?

WALSH: We've spoken to people who knew her. When the police looked for the Zayda -- Zenaida, I'm sorry -- they found the wrong Zenaida. So that's why there's some miscommunication as to whether or not the Zenaida the police referred to and the other people referred to is the same Zenaida that Casey's referring to.

KELLY: And Michael, let me ask you, is your client willing to take a polygraph?

WALSH: At this point, it depends on what the conditions are. Initially, yes, but not if it's going to be simply used to not look for Casey. If it's going to be used for no other purpose than to prosecute her, then no.

KELLY: So that door is still open.

WALSH: Right because this is the situation. It's in the hands of the police and the prosecutors whether or not they believe her. There's not a third neutral party out there...

KELLY: Understood.

WALSH: ... Who's going to decide whether they believe her. So...

KELLY: Got it.

WALSH: And there are none so deaf as those who won't hear.

KELLY: Michael, thank so much for being here. We appreciate it.

WALSH: Thank you.


http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,394286,00.html

[Faith]

NANCY GRACE Aired July 30, 2008 - 20:00:00 ET

Photos Found of Tot Mom Partying After Child`s Disappearance

Aired July 30, 2008 - 20:00:00 ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. Police desperately searching for a beautiful little 2-year-old Florida girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing, little Caylee now not seen for six long weeks, last seen with her mother. So why didn`t Mommy call police?
Headlines tonight. Let the good times roll! Stunning photos surface, Caylee`s mom smiling for the cameras and celebrating, celebrating repeatedly at a local nightclub. Here`s the kicker. All the clubbing caught on camera is after little Caylee disappears. Well, it looks like Casey Anthony`s search for her daughter, Caylee, includes under every barstool at the club.

Also tonight, more jailhouse phone calls. This time, mom, Casey, explaining why she doesn`t know the baby-sitter`s phone number. Remember the baby-sitter who she says stole little Caylee?

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY, BROTHER: I understand that we don`t -- in today`s day and age, you don`t really memorize cell phones since you have it programmed in -- you know numbers, you program in yourself.

CASEY ANTHONY, MISSING CHILD`S MOTHER: Very much so.

LEE ANTHONY: Would she have been programmed in your cell phone?

CASEY ANTHONY: She was programmed into that other phone that we need to find a way to recover. I mean, I don`t know...

LEE ANTHONY: Help me with tat, actually. You said that you referred to it as your "black jack"?

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes. It was a black jack. I`d only had it for probably a week, week-and-a-half. It didn`t keep its charge, so that`s why I started using that other phone.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: Well, on the black jack, do you remember the phone number that the black jack was associated with?

CASEY ANTHONY: It was my same number. I just swapped the sim card back and forth.

LEE ANTHONY: OK. Here`s the thing, how these things work, Casey. The contact information -- the contact stuff is on your sim card, so if you switched it back and forth...

CASEY ANTHONY: It doesn`t always save to the sim card. You can sometimes save things to the sim card or save it specifically to the phone. It just depends on the way the phone`s set up. I thought abut that, too. The phone that I`m currently using, where I guess that the police still have or you guys have it, I had set it up after the fact to just save things to my sim card. But you can also save it to just the phone or to the sim card and the phone, so there`s copies on both.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: What is she saying?

And tonight, a beloved preacher`s wife turns up in a freezer, but for years, he`s been telling congregations she died in childbirth.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yellow tape now surrounds the home where police believe a family lived a tortured life. Anthony Hopkins lived here with his eight children. Police discovered something gruesome, the body of a woman in a freezer. Police believe the body was Hopkins`s wife, Arletha (ph). Police say they found the body in a freezer like this one. They say it was wrapped in a sheet in a utility room behind the house. Now police are searching the family`s home, hoping to uncover more dark secrets.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We had a victim present at our offices who complained about an ongoing case of sexual abuse that had taken place over many years.

Well, they`re in protective custody. Obviously, I`m sure that the situation has been an ordeal for them, but they`re certainly better off than they were. There`s no question about that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us tonight. Police desperately searching for a beautiful 2-year-old Florida girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing, little Caylee now not seen for six long weeks. Tonight: Let the good times roll. Stunning photos surface, Caylee`s mom smiling for the cameras, repeatedly celebrating at a local nightclub, this after little Caylee disappears.

And more jailhouse phone recordings reveal mom, Casey, trying her best to explain why she has no idea what the baby-sitter`s number is, the baby- sitter who she says stole little Caylee.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: So this black jack -- where did you -- you said that you reported it missing and lost. Give me the information so I can find the phone.

CASEY ANTHONY: OK. The last time I know I had it for certain, I was up at Universal.

LEE ANTHONY: For work or for otherwise?

CASEY ANTHONY: I was in through the park, talking to just a couple of mutual friends up there.

LEE ANTHONY: So you were up there for fun or whatever?

CASEY ANTHONY: It wasn`t necessarily fun, but yes, not through work at that moment.

LEE ANTHONY: I got you. OK. I understand.

CASEY ANTHONY: I know I had it at Jay Blanchard Park. I don`t remember where the very last place is I had it.

LEE ANTHONY: Where did you get this phone from? Like, how was it provided to you?

CASEY ANTHONY: Through the AT&T store.

LEE ANTHONY: Was this a phone -- is this another personal cell phone or yours?

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: If you lost the physical phone itself, aside from searching for it, how would you go about finding this? How should I go about finding your phone?

CASEY ANTHONY: I don`t know. That`s the thing. I mean, if I knew specifically where it was -- I mean, my last recollection of me having it was at Universal, but I knew that I had also been at Jay Blanchard Park, and I could have potentially had it there with me, too. I don`t know if you guys have checked through, like, some of the bags and stuff that I have at the house with me, if maybe it was in one of those purses. But I know I kept everything that I had kind of centralized at Tony`s.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: Casey, if you had your black jack with you and you lost your black jack but you still have your sim card in your other phone -- I`m trying just to figure out why you wouldn`t have -- why you wouldn`t lose both, you know what I mean?

CASEY ANTHONY: Well, that`s the thing. If it fell out of my bag, if it fell out of my pocket. It`s a decent-size phone, almost the size of the phone that you have now. It could have easily fallen out of my purse.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: It just keeps getting more and more bizarre. These are the photos we were telling you about, photos that were apparently taken after little Caylee disappears. This, I guess, is part of mom, Casey`s, search for her little girl there at Fusion nightclub.

Straight out to Mark Williams with WNDB Newstalk. Mark, what`s the latest?

MARK WILLIAMS, WNDB NEWSTALK: Well, the latest, of course, is those pictures surfacing this morning, which really knocked everybody`s socks off. They were taken by a photographer who goes out on Friday nights and takes pictures, and he just happened to run into Casey there at the nightclub. From what we understand, the boyfriend, Tony, was a DJ there, and she would tag along with him.

There`s been that story. The other story has been that she promoted a little bit. She was there to draw some people in because she was one of the beautiful people. So that`s up in the air. You know, and the pictures were obtained from a Flickr account.

The other thing -- the other big news story was the fact that there will not be a second bond hearing for Casey Anthony. The attorney went to court, the fifth circuit court in Daytona Beach, and after looking at a couple of things, even Bill McCollum (ph), the state attorney general, sent a message to the justices there this morning saying that she`s a person of interest, bail is not unreasonably high, and she holds the key to finding Caylee. Also the appeals judges got the psychological report around 11:00 o`clock this morning. That, of course, has not been released.

And those are the big things right there. And the sim card thing -- that just absolutely blows my mind due to the fact that I don`t know anybody who changes out sim cards if they have two phones.

GRACE: You know -- and everybody, a sim card, as you al know, is about that big. It`s the width of a piece of paper, the thickness of a piece of paper. It`s maybe a quarter of an inch, a half an inch square.

And let me get this straight, Nikki Pierce, joining us from WDBO. She`s claiming that she swapped a sim card from one phone to the next and that she must have lost one phone and she had another phone from AT&T, and she doesn`t know where they are and it must have fallen out of her pocketbook -- and her dog ate the homework, right?

NIKKI PIERCE, WDBO: That`s essentially what she`s claiming, the dog ate the homework. We`re just learning about the cell phone shell game that`s happening, but she said she saved the numbers to the cell phone, as opposed to the sim card, and then she lost the cell phone. And it`s very difficult to understand why she didn`t have this baby-sitter`s phone number.

GRACE: Out to Vince Velazquez, homicide detective, Atlanta. Vince, is that even possible, to save phone call -- phone numbers -- like, in your memory, on your cell phone, to save numbers to a cell phone that doesn`t have a sim card in it?

VINCE VELAZQUEZ, HOMICIDE DETECTIVE, ATLANTA METRO AREA: No, you would have to have the phone powered up. And you can save a phone number either on a sim card or the phone memory. You have to choose. So that portion is correct.

But you know, just listening to that conversation with her brother, she contradicts herself. First she says she swapped the sim card out. Then she says, Well, maybe I lost my phone. The brother even said he didn`t -- he couldn`t make sense of that because he was trying to ask her, Well, wouldn`t you have swapped -- if you lost the phone, the sim card would have been lost, as well. So that -- it`s very bizarre. It`s just two different stories that make absolutely no sense at all.

GRACE: And back to Mark Williams with WNDB Newstalk. Mark, last night, the grandmother, Cindy Anthony had, a lot of revelations, one of them being that they totally believe that their daughter, Casey, has nothing to do with the disappearance of Caylee. What else can you tell us?

WILLIAMS: Well, last night on one of the cable news shows, she told Larry King that she still believes Casey is alive and that -- or Caylee is alive and she is still with the baby-sitter. But nobody can get in touch with this baby-sitter, who police over the past couple of weeks have not been able to find. They`ve tracked everything down. Even your staff has called a lot of folks. And they cannot find this person. This person has disappeared into mid-air. And you know, again, she holds the key to finding Caylee.

GRACE: Well, the mother also stated -- the grandmother also stated that other people are involved. What other people? Don`t you think police would have put out an all-points bulletin on the other people that are involved in the kidnapping, the so-called kidnapping? Why are they being kept a secret?

WILLIAMS: Well, you know, the first thing when we have a missing child here in the state of Florida, police issue a "BOLO," "be on the look out for," and they also issue an Amber Alert. That has not been done in this case whatsoever.

You know, she said several -- last week that she was protecting her family. Who knows? This girl, again, has told so many fabrications, has told so many lies, there`s so many twists and turns in this case, you don`t know who to believe anymore.

GRACE: We are taking your calls live. Out to psychotherapist -- psychologist Caryn Stark. Caryn, take a look at these photos. Do you see Casey Anthony partying hearty, shooting the party sign?

CARYN STARK, PSYCHOLOGIST: I do, Nancy.

GRACE: This is after Caylee, her daughter, disappears into thin air. What does it suggest to you, Caryn Stark?

STARK: This is a person who is not having a traumatic experience, Nancy. She`s having a really good time without a care on her mind. So she does not look like a mother who has lost her daughter.

GRACE: Now, let me remind everybody that Casey Anthony has been charged only with child neglect, a couple of other related charges. She is not charged with kidnapping. She is not charged with murder.

But Caryn Stark, do you recall the motivation in the murder in the Susan Smith case?

STARK: The motivation was a boyfriend in the Susan Smith case. Do you feel this is similar, Nancy?

GRACE: Well, the boyfriend in this case, Anthony Lazaro (ph), had no idea -- and Casey Anthony had been in and out of his home for the last five to six weeks. He had no idea Caylee was missing. He didn`t know anything about her search for Caylee.

STARK: And so there is a possibility that there`s a similar experience going on here.

GRACE: And again, she has not been charged with murder at this juncture.

To Thomas in Canada. Hi, Thomas.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hi, Nancy.

GRACE: What`s your question, dear?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was wondering, has anybody thought where she went on that shopping spree with her mother`s credit cards, could she have left Caylee in the car in the heat, came back, found her dead and panicked?

GRACE: Interesting question. Let`s go out to Dr. Joshua Perper, medical examiner and author. Dr. Perper, thank you for being with us. It`s a pleasure to see you.

DR. JOSHUA PERPER, MEDICAL EXAMINER: Sure.

GRACE: If the child died under that scenario -- the cadaver dog hit in the trunk of the car, not on the inside of the car. What does that mean to you?

PERPER: Well, if this indeed happened, there might be some signs of the fact that the child was reposed (ph) there and there was some bleeding or some oozing from tissue which broke down, decomposed tissue. This would be evidence which possibly could be detected.

GRACE: You know, Vince Velazquez, joining us from Atlanta, homicide detective -- Vince, don`t you think out of a shopping mall that someone would have seen the little girl in the car?

VELAZQUEZ: Yes, I don`t see that -- you know, if it`s a shopping day and there`s a lot of people there, I think the police would have been alerted. And you know, that whole thing with the trunk of the car -- and I`ve got to tell you, I`ve smelled decomposing bodies, and it`s a smell that you just can never forget.

GRACE: Yes. There`s no way it smells like an old pizza. I can tell you that much.

VELAZQUEZ: No. Absolutely not.

GRACE: Out to the lines. Kristie in Texas. Hi, Kristie.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I was just wondering if Casey was living with Amy and Ricardo Morales (ph). I`ve read a lot of information about that, and I know they have all have, like, MySpace pages and Facebook, and they have a lot of information on there. And I was just wondering if they have information where -- where was she living at the time, at the beginning of June, when all of this started happening?

GRACE: You know, Kristie in Texas, I spoke with the grandmother, Cindy Anthony, and tried so hard to get it out of her where Casey had been for these four to five weeks. I really believe the grandmother, Cindy Anthony. I don`t think she knows. I don`t think that Casey Anthony has revealed to anybody where she`s been that whole time.

I want to go back out to you, Mark Williams. What can you tell us about the Moraleses?

WILLIAMS: This is the first time I`ve heard of this, about the Moraleses. I have not gone on anybody`s MySpace page or Facebook page.

But one thing did come up yesterday. When Casey Anthony was back in an Orange County courtroom with her lawyer, trying to get all these 911 tapes and everything else suppressed, her jailhouse conversations, the videos that they take, she -- an inmate talked to her. Twenty-year-old Travis Nichols (ph) talked to her because they were all in holding cells. And Travis says, Where`s the baby, Casey? She says, I don`t have the baby, my boyfriend has the baby. So that`s another development which has popped up over the last couple of hours.

GRACE: Well, it`s my understanding Anthony Lazaro, the boyfriend, has been fully cooperating with police.

WILLIAMS: Yes, he has been very, very up front about everything. They`ve searched his apartment, police have. They`ve talked to the neighbors of Anthony Lazaro, and thus far, there`s been no body, there`s been no cell phones left behind in Anthony`s place. And the deal is, you know, this guy`s a stand-up citizen, a stand-up guy.

GRACE: We are taking your calls live. Not only do these stunning photos come out -- caught on camera, Casey Anthony partying, this is after her little girl, she says, disappears into thin air, being kidnapped by the so-called baby-sitter, this is part of her search for the little girl -- but more stunning phone conversations recorded from the jail. Take a listen.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: I understand that we don`t -- in today`s day and age, you don`t really memorize cell phones since you have it programmed in. You know numbers that you program in yourself.

CASEY ANTHONY: Very much so.

LEE ANTHONY: Would she have been programmed in your cell phone?

CASEY ANTHONY: She was programmed into that other phone that we need to find a way to recover. I mean, I don`t know...

LEE ANTHONY: Help me with that, actually. You said that you referred to it as your "black jack"?

CASEY ANTHONY: Yes. It was a black jack. I`d only had it for probably a week, a week-and-a-half. It didn`t keep its charge, so that`s why I started using that other phone.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: Casey, if you had your black jack with you and you lost your black jack, but you still have your sim card in your other phone -- I`m trying just to figure out why you wouldn`t have -- why you wouldn`t lose both, you know what I mean?

CASEY ANTHONY: Well, that`s the thing. If it fell out of my bag, if it fell out of my pocket. It`s a decent-size phone, almost the size of the phone that you have now. It could have easily fallen out of my purse.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: The significant of this jailhouse phone recording is that the baby-sitter`s phone numbers and information were allegedly stored on that phone, and now it`s lost.

Let`s unleash the lawyers -- Susan Moss out of New York, Alan Ripka, defense attorney out of New York, Christopher Amolsch out of Washington, D.C. Susan Moss, weigh in.

SUSAN MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: She hits the sauce while her child is lost. You`ve got to be kidding me. If you believe the grandma`s timeline -- and so far, she seems to be the only one who`s playing it straight -- then this woman was out clubbing while her child was missing. Now, she went on and on that she went and searched everywhere for her child. Apparently, it was just in the bottom of a bottle.

GRACE: Alan Ripka, these photos, to my mind, are damning. This is when her child has just been reported missing, disappeared.

ALAN RIPKA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Nancy, first of all, these are photos that show someone who most likely did not murder or harm her child. So I`m happy to see these photos because, obviously, she believes her child is safe and in the arms of somebody. So I don`t mind these photos, Nancy.

GRACE: Wait. No, no. Liz, please put Ripka`s -- OK, would you repeat that, please, so I can actually look at you when you say that?

RIPKA: Nancy, this is not an individual who`s acting like she had anything to do with the disappearance or...

GRACE: Really? Because I`ve seen plenty of killers yucking it up in a bar right after the murder.

RIPKA: Nancy, this is a woman whose family has told you and has told the public that she`s been a loving mother, no history of any problems.

GRACE: OK.

RIPKA: She didn`t go out and harm her child and then go to a bar and smile.

GRACE: Christopher Amolsch, can you actually agree with that?

CHRISTOPHER AMOLSCH, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, I agree with that in some degree, but I also think that everybody deals with grief differently. You know, if this woman is really grieving for her child -- I mean, everybody does it differently. And I appreciate the psychiatrist or psychologist...

GRACE: I guess she does it with a beer and a push-up bra.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Can Tony tell me anything?

CASEY ANTHONY: Honey, Tony doesn`t know anything, and I haven`t even talked to him since this morning.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Has Tony seen Caylee?

CASEY ANTHONY: Tony hasn`t seen Caylee since the beginning of June.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY: If you lost the physical phone itself, aside from searching for it, how would you go about finding this? How should I go about finding your phone?

continued

[Faith]

CASEY ANTHONY: I don`t know. That`s the thing. I mean, if I knew specifically where it was -- I mean, my last recollection of me having it was at Universal, but I knew that I had also been at Jay Blanchard Park, and I could have potentially had it there with me, too. I don`t know if you guys have checked through, like, some of the bags and stuff that I have at the house with me, if it was in one of those purses. But I know I kept everything that I had kind of centralized at Tony`s.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

GRACE: These stunning phone calls just released from the jailhouse recordings.

Out to the lines, Kimberly in Pennsylvania -- uh-oh. Gary in Wisconsin. Hi, Gary.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hi, Nancy. We love your show!

GRACE: Thank you. Thank you for watching, and thank you for calling in.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Here`s my question. If the cadaver dogs, which we know only scent the scent of human remains, if it wasn`t Caylee`s body then in the trunk, then who else`s would it be?

GRACE: You know, that`s the million-dollar question. What about it, Nikki Pierce?

PIERCE: Well, investigators don`t think it could possibly be anyone else`s, but they are sending out some samples of a stain that was found there and some hair that matched Caylee`s, preliminarily, to the FBI lab and the FDLE lab -- that`s the Florida state lab -- so that they can take a look and find out what`s going on there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEE ANTHONY, BROTHER OF CASEY ANTHONY: So this Black Jack, where did you -- you said that reported it missing and lost. Give me the information so I can find this phone.

CASEY ANTHONY, MOTHER OF MISSING 2-YEAR-OLD CAYLEE: OK. The last time I know I had it for certain I was up at Universal.

L. ANTHONY: For work or for otherwise?

C. ANTHONY: I was in through the park talking to just a couple of mutual friends up there.

L. ANTHONY: So you were up there for fun or whatever.

C. ANTHONY: It wasn`t necessarily fun but yes, not through work at that moment.

L. ANTHONY: I gotcha. OK. I understand.

C. ANTHONY: I know I had it at Jay Blanchard Park. I don`t remember where the very last places that I had it.

L. ANTHONY: Where did you get this phone from? Like how was it provided to you?

C. ANTHONY: Through the AT&T store.

L. ANTHONY: Was this a phone -- is this another personal cell phone of yours?

C. ANTHONY: Yes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: How much more of this can police tolerate?

That is a recorded phone call by Casey Anthony, the mom, speaking to her brother, who`s trying to help her. He`s trying to find out about her cell phone that may have the mysterious baby-sitter`s phone calls recorded on it, logged in it, memorized in it.

Let`s unleash the lawyers, Susan Moss, Alan Ripka, Christopher Amolsch.

Alan Ripka, that is the biggest line of BS. There`s no other way to put it. She goes around and around and around about trying to explain how she doesn`t know where her phone is, maybe the SIM card fell out of her pocket, the phone`s pretty big, how`d she lose it.

You know it`s a big lie.

ALAN RIPKA, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I don`t know that, Nancy. I think at the end of the day, people can lose phones and it`s not such a big deal. Furthermore, we know as a fact that she did have a nanny or a baby-sitter who helped to take care of the child.

So who is that.

GRACE: Oh, really, how do we know that for a fact?

RIPKA: So who is that person?

GRACE: No. How do you know that as a fact? The mother -- the grandmother, the grandfather, the neighbor, whom I interviewed, nobody, the boyfriend that she was living with, the Morales, the caller called in earlier, Kristi from Texas, that`s her ex-boyfriend and his current girlfriend -- none of them had ever seen the baby-sitter.

So have you -- did you know who the baby-sitter is, Alan Ripka?

RIPKA: I don`t know who the baby-sitter is, but it certainly makes sense that a mother with a baby will have a baby-sitter to assist her. That`s certainly not out of the ordinary, Nancy.

GRACE: And pay the baby-sitter with what? She`s stealing gasoline out of her family`s cars.

RIPKA: Well, Nancy, I`m sure she has some money to pay a baby-sitter.

GRACE: Why? Why are you sure?

RIPKA: She had a very supportive family.

GRACE: OK.

RIPKA: Obviously, her family are very supportive by all their actions in this particular matter, Nancy.

GRACE: Well, they are being supportive of her, but that doesn`t mean that they were supporting her financially at the time. The grandmother and grandfather had already let her move back in.

RIPKA: Well, Nancy, obviously, she was supporting her baby. She had to have some money to do that. She need food, she needed clothes.

GRACE: She was getting all that from her mother.

RIPKA: Well, she got it from somewhere, right?

GRACE: Yes, but money to pay a baby-sitter and not one acquaintance, Susan Moss, not relatives, nobody has seen the baby-sitter, Zenaida Fernandez Gonzales.

SUSAN MOSS, CHILD ADVOCATE, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: This woman puts the I in lie. Everything that comes out of this woman`s mouth is absolutely contradictory and a lie.

Not one single person has seen this baby-sitter. They can`t find where she allegedly lived. They can`t find any idea of this woman. There`s no picture of her that is recognized by Casey. This is all a big lie.

And what`s scary, what is most scary about this is that this woman seems to think she`s going to get away this. It`s not going to happen.

GRACE: What about it, Chris Amolsch?

CHRISTOPHER AMOLSCH, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: It just seems like if she`s going to lie, there`s a whole lot easier lies to tell than this. I mean this is fairly evolved. My SIM card falling.

GRACE: What, that`s your defense? She could come out with a better lie?

AMOLSCH: Well, if she`s going to lie, I mean, why not just say, I lost my cell phone, it got stolen, instead of going through the whole SIM card.

GRACE: Well, you know what.

AMOLSCH: . if it wasn`t actually true.

GRACE: It`s interesting.

AMOLSCH: Why not just say, I was with Caylee, I turned around and she disappeared at the mall I was shopping at. I mean there`s so many easier ways to lie about this than that.

GRACE: Caryn Stark, I`ve seen this a million times on the stand in court. When people are lying, they don`t know to keep it simple stupid. They just go on and on and suddenly the lie gets bigger and bigger and more detailed.

CARYN STARK, PSYCHOLOGIST: Nancy, it`s a textbook example of a pathological liar. If you ever saw on "Saturday Night Live," -- do you remember the guy who was the liar?

GRACE: Yes.

STARK: And he would go on and on and on and keep changing his story. I was there, well, I was close. Well, maybe I was not there but I spoke to them on the phone.

That`s what she`s doing. She just keeps twisting her story and trying to make it sound authentic.

GRACE: I mean, Caryn, I know in your practice you must have seen this a million times, but when you`re hearing her on the phone, how does it strike you?

STARK: It strikes me as somebody who`s trying to get herself out of a jam. And she`s used to doing this. You could tell because she`s very quick in coming up with another explanation.

Well, I was here, I wasn`t really having fun, but I was not there for work. And she just keeps turning it around.

GRACE: Well, and the fact that she says Universal -- she claimed to work there at Universal there in Florida, but that was over two years ago that she was fired.

Out to the lines, Kimberly in Pennsylvania. Hi, Kimberly.

KIMBERLY, PENNSYLVANIA: Hi, honey, how are you?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

KIMBERLY: I was listening to the sound bites about her in the park.

GRACE: Yes.

KIMBERLY: . and losing her phone. I hope to god this child is alive.

GRACE: I do, too.

KIMBERLY: But what -- if this child has passed and the mom has done something to that child, is it possible that she buried the child in that park and that`s where the phone is?

GRACE: You know, Caryn Stark, have you noticed that when people are lying, they work in bits of the truth?

STARK: Well, they can`t help it because somewhere they begin to stick to their story, but what happens is they keep going round and round and round. So you might get a little bit of the smoke with the fire, but you won`t get the real, honest truth, Nancy.

GRACE: I want to go back to Dr. Joshua Perper, joining us out of Miami, Florida, a renowned medical examiner and author.

Dr. Perper, a concern is, of course, we all want Caylee to be alive. That`s a given. We want this fantastic story she`s telling to be true.

If she`s not alive, at what point will a body decompose so you really cannot tell cause of death?

DR. JOSHUA PERPER, MEDICAL EXAMINER, AUTHOR OF "WHEN TO CALL THE DOCTOR": Well, it depends again in what environment the body was deposed, because in the air, it`s going to decompose much more than it decomposes in the water and much less in the ground. But probably in the Florida climate, in several weeks, maybe eight weeks, nine weeks or more, you will be left with basically skeletal remains or skeleton with very little tissue.

GRACE: You know, Dr. Perper, as you are describing that possibility, I`m just looking at these shots of Casey Anthony living it up at a local bar.

To Mark Williams with WNBD -- Mark, we`ve just gotten more jailhouse recordings while we are on air. I want you and Nikki Pierce to take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

C. ANTHONY: This morning.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)

C. ANTHONY: Hey, no big deal, you know, tell you that I miss you. And.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, some of the stuff that we, you know, talked about before, you know, if there`s anything additional or at this moment, I mean, I only have a lot of my notes with my right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: You know, to Mark and Nikki -- first to you, Mark Williams, that`s more relatives trying to get information. They even say, don`t be general, be specific.

MARK WILLIAMS, NEWS DIRECTOR, WNDB NEWSTALK 1150: Well, you know, and you know, Casey has not been playing it straight. And all during these jailhouse conversations, everybody has been pumping her for information. They should probably work for the sheriff`s department, because they`re getting more information out of them -- out of Casey than the sheriff`s office investigators are.

However, the one thing, Nancy, is the fact that if she had a cell phone or if she had two cell phones, they ought to be able to go back to the cell phone provider and pull those numbers where she called. She probably also had detailed billing, so they ought to be able to find her bills and see who she called.

GRACE: You know, to Nikki Pierce with WDBO Radio -- Nikki, last night Cindy Anthony mentioned on air -- this is the grandmother -- that the family had the cell phone records and that they were disturbed that police had not released them to the public.

Why can`t the family release them to the public?

NIKKI PIERCE, REPORTER, WDBO RADIO: Well, that`s a good question and I`m not entirely certain if they could release them to the public or not or if they have copies of that.

GRACE: Well, I`m pretty sure -- I`m pretty sure, to Alan Ripka, that if the family has the cell phone records that we`re all talking about, that could prove or disprove the existence of a nanny, they could just send them straight on over to Mark Williams with WNBD or Nikki Pierce with WDBO and I`m sure they`d publish them.

RIPKA: I agree with you, Nancy. I think if they have those records they can release them to the public or an investigator to dial the numbers in those records and determine whether or not they could find this baby- sitter.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWSBREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

C. ANTHONY: I mean, as far as I`m concerned here, I don`t really know on that level. I guess, understandably, just being out of contact, but, I mean, as far as I`m concerned, nothing`s really changed on that level. So -- and if anything does, I`ll let you know.

L. ANTHONY: All right. I`ve talked with pretty much everybody at this point.

C. ANTHONY: OK.

L. ANTHONY: Most of them on a regular basis, and at least most people within the last few days or day. So I`m definitely, you know, just trying to get my bearings and everything like that with everybody.

C. ANTHONY: OK.

L. ANTHONY: But you know if there`s anything you think that I should look into or follow up on.

C. ANTHONY: Yes, I`ll definitely let you know if things come up if anything goes at all.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Sounds like her brother, basically, begging her for more information in the search for their little girl, 2-year-old little Caylee.

You are hearing just-released phone calls. We are getting them as we are on air right now from the jailhouse. These are public records and there`s a recording on every phone call there, telling you you are being monitored.

Out to the lines, Kimberly in Pennsylvania. Hi, Kimberly. Uh-oh, Marilyn in New York, hi, Marilyn.

MARILYN, NEW YORK RESIDENT: Hi, Nancy. On a much lighter note very quickly, I just want to say that your babies are just beautiful and I thank you for sharing the photos with us. It`s just great.

GRACE: Thank you, thank you very much. Thank you.

MARILYN: On a more somber note, I haven`t heard anything about a police interview with the boyfriend, Tony.

GRACE: OK. This is what I know, Marilyn in New York. I know that we have been told repeatedly that Anthony Lazaro has been completely cooperative with police. Translation -- they`ve interviewed him, they`ve gone to his apartment, they`ve searched his apartment and he allowed them to do that.

Mark Williams with WNDB, isn`t it correct that the boyfriend that she`s been in and out of his apartment since she went AWOL from her home says he had no idea Caylee was missing?

WILLIAMS: Apparently not. The deal was at one time, apparently, Casey took Caylee swimming at the complex where Tony Lazaro lives, but from that point on, he hasn`t seen Caylee or heard from Caylee and, you know, he -- again, you hit it on the head. He is cooperating. He would love to give more information, but he`s at a standstill, too.

And the phone calls that we`ve heard this afternoon or this evening is the fact that she is trying to placate her brother and her family. She says, well, if something comes up, I`ll let you know.

How the heck does she know if anything`s going to come up because she`s sitting in the Orange County jail right now?

GRACE: And you`re seeing, everyone, photos of Casey Anthony out partying hardy, this is after she says her little girl was kidnapped by the baby-sitter. Here she is at a local bar yucking it up

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0807/30/ng.01.html

[Faith]

Exclusive: Photos Show Missing Toddler's Mom Partying After She Disappears
Wednesday, July 30, 2008

photographers who took those pictures

This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," July 29, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

MEGYN KELLY, FOX NEWS HOST: This is a "FOX News Alert." An arrest tonight in the murder of pregnant Army specialist Megan Touma.

Good evening, everyone. I'm Megyn Kelly.

Moments ago, Fayetteville police arresting a 27-year-old man and charging him with first-degree murder, Touma found dead in a motel bathtub on June 21. This news is literally breaking as we speak. We're going to have much more later in the hour.

But first up tonight, "On the Record" obtains shocking new photos of Casey Anthony partying at a club days after she says her daughter went missing. Casey is behind bars tonight, a person of interest in what police say may be the homicide of her little daughter, Caylee. Casey claims she left her daughter with a baby-sitter on June 9, and that when she returned to pick her up, little Caylee was gone.

It took five weeks before the child was reported missing, and now we know what Casey Anthony was doing for part of that time, these pictures taken at a club on June 20, while Casey says she was conducting her own search for her daughter.

John Azzilano and Teddy Piper, the photographers who took those pictures, join us live. Good evening, guys.

JOHN AZZILANO, STUDENT AND CLUB PHOTOGRAPHER: How're you doing?

KELLY: John, let me start with you. You took these photographs on June 20?

Watch the interview

AZZILANO: Yes, the night of June 20. Teddy an